4 ms·

How much of this is actually to "catch" terrorists? Its mostly for surveillance, intimidation, suppression. Usually it's the state that defines who a terrorist

How much of this is actually to "catch" terrorists? Its mostly for surveillance, intimidation, suppression. Usually it's the state that defines who a terrorist is, and usually terrorists are ALL people opposing the current regime.

DrScientist 3mo ago
Case in point - in the UK you can currently be put into prison for a long stretch under terrorism charges for holding up a sign with just 4 words.
- deaux 3mo ago
  Last I checked River->Sea is 6 words. Unless it's a phrase about a different subject, but I can't imagine since the UK only tends to arrest sign holders as part of protecting Bibi's interests.
  - DrScientist 3mo ago
    You don't get prison for that. It starts "I support" and ends action. It's just the most recent and egregious misuse of anti-terrorism laws - doing the sort of thing that they claimed it never would be used for when they were brought in. Secret courts, evidence the defence isn't allowed to see nevermind challenge, judges trying to restrict what the defence can say, long prison terms for simply holding up a sign. The treatment of Julian Assange was a warning of what was to come. These are worrying trends.
    - deaux 3mo ago
      By pure coincidence, I learned today that there's also another four words that will at least get you prosecuted in the UK: "You have a conscience". https://www.declassifieduk.org/palestine-action-lawyer-faces-renewed-contempt-proceedings/ https://www.declassifieduk.org/palestine-action-lawyer-faces...
      - DrScientist 3mo ago
        Same Filton case. You had the bizarre situation that some of defendants dismissed their lawyers because the lawyers were constrained in what they could say in the defence of their clients - so the defendents did there own closing speeches.
- amiga386 3mo ago
  The four words you're referring to are "I support Palestine Action", and there's nobody in prison "for a long stretch" just for saying that. There have been over 3000 people arrested for showing support for this proscribed organisation, and over 700 charged, but none actually prosecuted yet. It was only just decided two weeks ago that the government's act of proscribing Palestine Action was lawful. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jun/15/arrested-protesters-devastated-appeal-court-rules-palestine-action-ban-lawful https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jun/15/arrested-pro... Obviously, I think the Terrorism Act shouldn't silence speech like it does. Palestine Action are a pack of bumbling thugs, and the government's real reason for proscription is that those idiots successfully broke into an RAF base. Egg on face for military so government strikes back with proscription. The law does allow for these sorts of penalties you describe. But I think you will find that if the CPS does prosecute these cases, especially against people who literally stood in front of police stations and displayed those four words and no more, i.e. they dared the government to prosecute them for speech, I don't think they will be "put in prison for a long stretch". They may not even be prosecuted at all. They would have to do more, i.e. actually break into places and physically damage them, like Palestine Action have repeatedly done, to get a long prison sentence. But the threat of prison for speech is there in the law, that's why I don't like that law.
  - Cider9986 3mo ago
    You shouldn't be judged based on your speech, only your actions. That's the problem with the Terrorism Act.
  - DrScientist 3mo ago
    As you say the max penalty is 14 years in prison. I would argue the state harassment of these protestors is the actual terrorism - using state violence for political means. As you say there is also an underlying reason - but it's not the painting of the planes on the RAF base - it was well underway before then. The main driver was the Filton case. A really concerning development recently is that the judge has decided to sentence people on the basis of terrorism, despite the people not being convicted for terrorism charges - just criminal damage. Now they are recorded as terrorist for life - despite no jury ever convicting them of that. https://www.opendemocracy.net/inside-the-palestine-action-trial-that-could-redefine-protest-as-terrorism/ https://www.opendemocracy.net/inside-the-palestine-action-tr...

DrScientist 3mo ago

Case in point - in the UK you can currently be put into prison for a long stretch under terrorism charges for holding up a sign with just 4 words.

deaux 3mo ago
Last I checked River->Sea is 6 words. Unless it's a phrase about a different subject, but I can't imagine since the UK only tends to arrest sign holders as part of protecting Bibi's interests.
- DrScientist 3mo ago
  You don't get prison for that. It starts "I support" and ends action. It's just the most recent and egregious misuse of anti-terrorism laws - doing the sort of thing that they claimed it never would be used for when they were brought in. Secret courts, evidence the defence isn't allowed to see nevermind challenge, judges trying to restrict what the defence can say, long prison terms for simply holding up a sign. The treatment of Julian Assange was a warning of what was to come. These are worrying trends.
  - deaux 3mo ago
    By pure coincidence, I learned today that there's also another four words that will at least get you prosecuted in the UK: "You have a conscience". https://www.declassifieduk.org/palestine-action-lawyer-faces-renewed-contempt-proceedings/ https://www.declassifieduk.org/palestine-action-lawyer-faces...
    - DrScientist 3mo ago
      Same Filton case. You had the bizarre situation that some of defendants dismissed their lawyers because the lawyers were constrained in what they could say in the defence of their clients - so the defendents did there own closing speeches.
amiga386 3mo ago
The four words you're referring to are "I support Palestine Action", and there's nobody in prison "for a long stretch" just for saying that. There have been over 3000 people arrested for showing support for this proscribed organisation, and over 700 charged, but none actually prosecuted yet. It was only just decided two weeks ago that the government's act of proscribing Palestine Action was lawful. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jun/15/arrested-protesters-devastated-appeal-court-rules-palestine-action-ban-lawful https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jun/15/arrested-pro... Obviously, I think the Terrorism Act shouldn't silence speech like it does. Palestine Action are a pack of bumbling thugs, and the government's real reason for proscription is that those idiots successfully broke into an RAF base. Egg on face for military so government strikes back with proscription. The law does allow for these sorts of penalties you describe. But I think you will find that if the CPS does prosecute these cases, especially against people who literally stood in front of police stations and displayed those four words and no more, i.e. they dared the government to prosecute them for speech, I don't think they will be "put in prison for a long stretch". They may not even be prosecuted at all. They would have to do more, i.e. actually break into places and physically damage them, like Palestine Action have repeatedly done, to get a long prison sentence. But the threat of prison for speech is there in the law, that's why I don't like that law.
- Cider9986 3mo ago
  You shouldn't be judged based on your speech, only your actions. That's the problem with the Terrorism Act.
- DrScientist 3mo ago
  As you say the max penalty is 14 years in prison. I would argue the state harassment of these protestors is the actual terrorism - using state violence for political means. As you say there is also an underlying reason - but it's not the painting of the planes on the RAF base - it was well underway before then. The main driver was the Filton case. A really concerning development recently is that the judge has decided to sentence people on the basis of terrorism, despite the people not being convicted for terrorism charges - just criminal damage. Now they are recorded as terrorist for life - despite no jury ever convicting them of that. https://www.opendemocracy.net/inside-the-palestine-action-trial-that-could-redefine-protest-as-terrorism/ https://www.opendemocracy.net/inside-the-palestine-action-tr...