3 ms·

That's not a bad policy, considering America's disastrous history of spreading democracy and then finding out those voters want different shades of fascism

• lern_too_spel 4mo ago
  America has a disastrous history of propping up dictators who are overthrown and replaced by governments who can then justify anti-Americanism as a populist political strategy.
• watwut 4mo ago
  America has more history of destroying democracies and actively proping/helping dictators then of trying to create democracies. It did made germany democratic after wwii. That really happened. But then it has stream of helping dictators and killing democracies while being acting confused when locals did not appreciated it ... and when different violent movements joined the game. America is even supporting fascists parties all around Europe right now. If they win, it is going to be mainly eu dysfunction. But it will also be true that America actively sponsored fascists and actively undermined democracy in Europe. > spreading democracy and then finding out those voters want different shades of fascism Where exactly this happened, really?
  • breppp 4mo ago
    > Where exactly this happened, really? Iraq, Egypt, Gaza, Post-Soviet Russia comes to mind among others
    • lern_too_spel 4mo ago
      Any government that isn't democratically chosen is illegitimate. Better a democratic fascist government than a dictatorial fascist government, which will have to be more brutal to maintain power.
      • breppp 4mo ago
        And you suppose the Nazi party that had won a large enough of the seats to enforce democratic consensus is also better than any alternative?
        • lern_too_spel 4mo ago
          Do you think a government not supported by its populace would have fared better? Unless it brutally represses it's opposition, it would be violently overthrown by the government that the people wanted, and then that government would do what the people wanted. The solution to a bad government isn't to install one that doesn't have the support of the people it governs.
          • breppp 4mo ago
            What I am saying is that as often missed by American policy makers, bringing Democracy does not make a population automatically Liberal, and they often vote for disaster for both them and for the US. Also, contrary to your theory, most of human history people were ruled by non-democratic governments that were deemed legitimate, so I think you are conflating the two
            • lern_too_spel 4mo ago
              > bringing Democracy does not make a population automatically Liberal Nobody believes this to be the case. What is more often missed by policy makers is that overthrowing a government supported by the local population is unpopular and will cause blowback. The CIA-supported coup in Iran is a currently relevant example. > Also, contrary to your theory, most of human history people were ruled by non-democratic governments that were deemed legitimate That was when people believed in the divine right of kings, so those kings ruled with the consent of the governed. This is no longer the case. Nobody believes in the divine right of dictators.