4 ms·

So people don't smoke and drive because they don't want to be caught doing something illegal. Seeing as DUI is still illegal in Washington, I don't see how this

So people don't smoke and drive because they don't want to be caught doing something illegal. Seeing as DUI is still illegal in Washington, I don't see how this changes anything. Unless you're saying that because cannabis is legal I'm going to think that a cop is more likely to let me go, or be less likely to check me or what? The legality of cannabis use doesn't change the likelihood of me getting pulled over, no? Or am I misunderstanding where you're coming from?

tptacek 14y ago
Yes, I am saying that when cannabis is legal, its users are no longer going to be continuously paranoid that the mere detection of its presence is going to be enough to have them imprisoned.
- drivebyacct2 14y ago
  Right, (barring the discussion about the differences in impairment between cannabis and alcohol...) those are the same type of people that think they can get away with drinking and driving. They're arrogant, selfish people. But I don't really buy that they're sitting at home being good law abiding citizens waiting one hour for every drink or one hour for every toke before driving to Taco Bell right now, only to abandon that once it's legal.
  - tptacek 14y ago
    No, I disagree. People think they can get away with drinking and driving because they almost overwhelmingly can get away with drinking and driving, and because the penalties for DUI conviction are routinized (they're more severe than a ticket but, barring injuries, less severe than any felony). Neither is the case for cannabis. If you're pulled over and your car reeks of weed, your car will be searched, and if cannabis turns up, everyone in the car is likely to be arrested. Your prosecution afterwards will not be routine; if you're found guilty, it is very likely to cost you your job in a way a DUI conviction isn't.
    - drivebyacct2 14y ago
      >People think they can get away with drinking and driving because they almost overwhelmingly can get away with drinking and driving The legality of cannabis does not affect the likelihood of me getting pulled over so I don't understand. Or are you saying "keeping your job and not getting a felony = getting away with it"? I mean, how many people are you imagining are cool with a DUI conviction and not a, I don't know, whatever it is if you get pulled over with weed in the car, possession+DUI?
      - tptacek 14y ago
        First offense DUI in most states isn't even a felony. It doesn't matter if your employer is "cool" about it; they're unlikely to discover it. Stipulate a fixed likelihood of being pulled over at all. You're pulled over for making the kind of mistake anyone could make, or pulled over because a traffic cop is bored or has a quota. But once you're pulled over, the likelihood of an officer detecting marijuana anywhere in the car including its passengers is far higher than the likelihood of an officer detecting alcohol intoxication in the driver. These observations are so straightforward that I feel like we might be getting argumentative just for the sake of it. For what it's worth, I'm in favor of decriminalization.
        drivebyacct2 14y ago
        >These observations are so straightforward that I feel like we might be getting argumentative just for the sake of it. For what it's worth, I'm in favor of decriminalization. huh? I'm not trying to argue with you. I know that you think cannabis is a net-negative and I have no desire to argue with you about that. I respect your position and know that you're in favor of decriminalization. I still do not understand what you're getting at. If I were to smoke a bowl, drink two beers and get in my car and got pulled over, I guarantee you I would be asked if I had been drinking because that would be far more present on my breath. Even if I had some weed in a grinder in my glove box. >detecting marijuana anywhere in the car including its passengers is far higher than the likelihood of an officer detecting alcohol intoxication in the driver. I have no idea how you come to this conclusion or find it obvious. Besides, I think we're just going to disagree at the core of this. I like to think that there is more keeping people from recklessly drunk-driving than a "felony" on their record or losing their job.

tptacek 14y ago

Yes, I am saying that when cannabis is legal, its users are no longer going to be continuously paranoid that the mere detection of its presence is going to be enough to have them imprisoned.

drivebyacct2 14y ago
Right, (barring the discussion about the differences in impairment between cannabis and alcohol...) those are the same type of people that think they can get away with drinking and driving. They're arrogant, selfish people. But I don't really buy that they're sitting at home being good law abiding citizens waiting one hour for every drink or one hour for every toke before driving to Taco Bell right now, only to abandon that once it's legal.
- tptacek 14y ago
  No, I disagree. People think they can get away with drinking and driving because they almost overwhelmingly can get away with drinking and driving, and because the penalties for DUI conviction are routinized (they're more severe than a ticket but, barring injuries, less severe than any felony). Neither is the case for cannabis. If you're pulled over and your car reeks of weed, your car will be searched, and if cannabis turns up, everyone in the car is likely to be arrested. Your prosecution afterwards will not be routine; if you're found guilty, it is very likely to cost you your job in a way a DUI conviction isn't.
  - drivebyacct2 14y ago
    >People think they can get away with drinking and driving because they almost overwhelmingly can get away with drinking and driving The legality of cannabis does not affect the likelihood of me getting pulled over so I don't understand. Or are you saying "keeping your job and not getting a felony = getting away with it"? I mean, how many people are you imagining are cool with a DUI conviction and not a, I don't know, whatever it is if you get pulled over with weed in the car, possession+DUI?
    - tptacek 14y ago
      First offense DUI in most states isn't even a felony. It doesn't matter if your employer is "cool" about it; they're unlikely to discover it. Stipulate a fixed likelihood of being pulled over at all. You're pulled over for making the kind of mistake anyone could make, or pulled over because a traffic cop is bored or has a quota. But once you're pulled over, the likelihood of an officer detecting marijuana anywhere in the car including its passengers is far higher than the likelihood of an officer detecting alcohol intoxication in the driver. These observations are so straightforward that I feel like we might be getting argumentative just for the sake of it. For what it's worth, I'm in favor of decriminalization.
      - drivebyacct2 14y ago
        >These observations are so straightforward that I feel like we might be getting argumentative just for the sake of it. For what it's worth, I'm in favor of decriminalization. huh? I'm not trying to argue with you. I know that you think cannabis is a net-negative and I have no desire to argue with you about that. I respect your position and know that you're in favor of decriminalization. I still do not understand what you're getting at. If I were to smoke a bowl, drink two beers and get in my car and got pulled over, I guarantee you I would be asked if I had been drinking because that would be far more present on my breath. Even if I had some weed in a grinder in my glove box. >detecting marijuana anywhere in the car including its passengers is far higher than the likelihood of an officer detecting alcohol intoxication in the driver. I have no idea how you come to this conclusion or find it obvious. Besides, I think we're just going to disagree at the core of this. I like to think that there is more keeping people from recklessly drunk-driving than a "felony" on their record or losing their job.