4 ms·

> Your point is totally and completely wrong. Germany has public benefits that actually matter. Objectively wrong, because Germany does better in the things th

by gottorf 4mo ago

> Your point is totally and completely wrong. Germany has public benefits that actually matter. Objectively wrong, because Germany does better in the things that subjectively matter to you? > Germany's average life expectancy is ahead of Mississippi by 10 years. Comparing like for like, that gap drops down to 5-6 years and puts Mississippi on par with, say, Thailand or Latvia. Hardly grounds for condemnation. > Germany ranks as one of the highest in the world in general satisfaction of the people, Mississippi does not. Those rankings are all stupid, but in most of the ones I've seen, Germany ranks a scant few spots higher than the US. Sure, if Mississippi were a country, the distance would be greater, but how meaningful is it? I just saw one that ranks Saudi Arabia and El Salvador ahead of Spain and Italy[0]. And in any case, why do people keep leaving those satisfactory countries for America? [0]: https://data.worldhappiness.report/table https://data.worldhappiness.report/table

computerex 4mo ago
> And in any case, why do people keep leaving those satisfactory countries for America? https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2026/01/historic-decline-in-net-international-migration.html https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2026/... America used to be a great place to be. To put it in perspective, I myself am an American in the top 5% of earning households. I am strongly considering leaving. The value is no longer here. I don't want to live in a country where my healthcare is conditional, on principal. I don't want to live in a country where the Epstein class is protected.
- WalterBright 4mo ago
  [flagged]
  - zzrrt 4mo ago
    > Epstein died in jail. He was awaiting trial, so death by his choice wasn't necessarily the justice he deserved. His co-conspirator is in a cushy prison as a favor from the administration. Trump promised to release files but has been avoiding it in every possible legal way. It appears there are still things missing. What do you call that other than protection? I might buy that there is not great evidence for any more prosecutions, but they are at least reputationally protected as much as possible. > Rosie O'Donnell didn't stay in Ireland very long. She has only visited the US, which is congruent with this thread saying it's a less desirable place to live.
    - WalterBright 4mo ago
      Epstein died in jail. Ghislane is in prison. Trump shows no inclination to pardon her. Rosie shows no sign of ever going back to Ireland. Biden could have released the Epstein files. Trump called the police on Epstein.
      - zzrrt 4mo ago
        Why is he lenient to her at all? It's either guilt or corruption, or at the very least out of character, given his many tirades against rapists. Trump reportedly called the police in 2006, after their investigation became public, saying "everyone has known he's been doing this." Why didn't he call sooner then? And if he was working with the police, why did he say in 2019 he had no idea of the crimes? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/feb/10/trump-epstein-phone-call-florida-police https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/feb/10/trump-epstei... That article also quotes the DOJ: "We are not aware of any corroborating evidence that the president contacted law enforcement 20 years ago." So the claim is just something in the files, right alongside the worst imaginable allegations against Trump. Do you believe those too? I believe Biden had legal and procedural reasons not to release them (ongoing cases and keeping DOJ independent), but even without those, the argument cuts both ways: Trump could have released them in 2017. He could have released them before 99.8% of Congress voted to force it. If Biden or Obama were covering for Dems or something, why wasn't Trump glad to release the files as soon as possible? Even if you say "both sides are bad" on this issue, that would be a reason people are disenchanted and want to leave the country. I'll admit after googling Rosie, it's murkier than I thought. I don't really care to sift gossip rags and try to predict what she'll do, though I'd lean toward you're wrong if you mean she will never set foot in Ireland again nor live there for any significant time. But what is your argument really? Famous liberals who say they are leaving don't actually leave for long, because USA is actually great because of conservative policies? Maybe for most of them, but I feel like them leaving for any significant fraction of the year kind of undercuts your "nobody sneaked into East Berlin" idea though. I don't think many people would performatively leave if there was literally nothing better about their destination. They leave because the value has diminished, and maybe they come back because it's not zero.
WalterBright 4mo ago
> general satisfaction of the people Different groups of people have different ideas of what "general satisfaction" is. Hence, such cross-group studies are pretty suspect.
- micro2588 4mo ago
  One objective measure of satisfaction is if you are alive and healthy, hard to be satisfied otherwise.
  - WalterBright 4mo ago
    "healthy" is not objective, either.
    - micro2588 4mo ago
      Of course it is, to be healthy you need to be born Mississippi is double the OCED average for infant mortality. Then you can track obesity, diabetes, heart diseases, etc. throughout life. The only area where all this supposed American exceptional wealth confers an advantage in healthcare is post op outcomes where higher penetration of CT / MRI scans can make a measurable difference. Even then the difference is not large. You don't get a DECADE of life expectancy difference without an objective difference in health.
      - WalterBright 4mo ago
        > OCED average for infant mortality This is no good because different companies use different criteria for infant mortality. For example, the US leads the world in trying to save premies, and does well at it. But the failures are counted as infant mortality. Other countries categorize premie death as a miscarriage. Some societies do not count a baby as an infant until it has survived its first year. > life expectancy difference Criminality, drugs, tobacco, alcohol and obesity strongly affect life expectancy. It's an error to blame it all on the health care system.

by gottorf 4mo ago

computerex 4mo ago

> And in any case, why do people keep leaving those satisfactory countries for America? https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2026/01/historic-decline-in-net-international-migration.html https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2026/... America used to be a great place to be. To put it in perspective, I myself am an American in the top 5% of earning households. I am strongly considering leaving. The value is no longer here. I don't want to live in a country where my healthcare is conditional, on principal. I don't want to live in a country where the Epstein class is protected.

WalterBright 4mo ago
[flagged]
- zzrrt 4mo ago
  > Epstein died in jail. He was awaiting trial, so death by his choice wasn't necessarily the justice he deserved. His co-conspirator is in a cushy prison as a favor from the administration. Trump promised to release files but has been avoiding it in every possible legal way. It appears there are still things missing. What do you call that other than protection? I might buy that there is not great evidence for any more prosecutions, but they are at least reputationally protected as much as possible. > Rosie O'Donnell didn't stay in Ireland very long. She has only visited the US, which is congruent with this thread saying it's a less desirable place to live.
  - WalterBright 4mo ago
    Epstein died in jail. Ghislane is in prison. Trump shows no inclination to pardon her. Rosie shows no sign of ever going back to Ireland. Biden could have released the Epstein files. Trump called the police on Epstein.
    - zzrrt 4mo ago
      Why is he lenient to her at all? It's either guilt or corruption, or at the very least out of character, given his many tirades against rapists. Trump reportedly called the police in 2006, after their investigation became public, saying "everyone has known he's been doing this." Why didn't he call sooner then? And if he was working with the police, why did he say in 2019 he had no idea of the crimes? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/feb/10/trump-epstein-phone-call-florida-police https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/feb/10/trump-epstei... That article also quotes the DOJ: "We are not aware of any corroborating evidence that the president contacted law enforcement 20 years ago." So the claim is just something in the files, right alongside the worst imaginable allegations against Trump. Do you believe those too? I believe Biden had legal and procedural reasons not to release them (ongoing cases and keeping DOJ independent), but even without those, the argument cuts both ways: Trump could have released them in 2017. He could have released them before 99.8% of Congress voted to force it. If Biden or Obama were covering for Dems or something, why wasn't Trump glad to release the files as soon as possible? Even if you say "both sides are bad" on this issue, that would be a reason people are disenchanted and want to leave the country. I'll admit after googling Rosie, it's murkier than I thought. I don't really care to sift gossip rags and try to predict what she'll do, though I'd lean toward you're wrong if you mean she will never set foot in Ireland again nor live there for any significant time. But what is your argument really? Famous liberals who say they are leaving don't actually leave for long, because USA is actually great because of conservative policies? Maybe for most of them, but I feel like them leaving for any significant fraction of the year kind of undercuts your "nobody sneaked into East Berlin" idea though. I don't think many people would performatively leave if there was literally nothing better about their destination. They leave because the value has diminished, and maybe they come back because it's not zero.

WalterBright 4mo ago

> general satisfaction of the people Different groups of people have different ideas of what "general satisfaction" is. Hence, such cross-group studies are pretty suspect.

micro2588 4mo ago
One objective measure of satisfaction is if you are alive and healthy, hard to be satisfied otherwise.
- WalterBright 4mo ago
  "healthy" is not objective, either.
  - micro2588 4mo ago
    Of course it is, to be healthy you need to be born Mississippi is double the OCED average for infant mortality. Then you can track obesity, diabetes, heart diseases, etc. throughout life. The only area where all this supposed American exceptional wealth confers an advantage in healthcare is post op outcomes where higher penetration of CT / MRI scans can make a measurable difference. Even then the difference is not large. You don't get a DECADE of life expectancy difference without an objective difference in health.
    - WalterBright 4mo ago
      > OCED average for infant mortality This is no good because different companies use different criteria for infant mortality. For example, the US leads the world in trying to save premies, and does well at it. But the failures are counted as infant mortality. Other countries categorize premie death as a miscarriage. Some societies do not count a baby as an infant until it has survived its first year. > life expectancy difference Criminality, drugs, tobacco, alcohol and obesity strongly affect life expectancy. It's an error to blame it all on the health care system.