4 ms·

This endless moaning about "capitalism" is lamentable. You are looking at an oligopoly, degenerated through the mechanisms of American-style democracy, but you

This endless moaning about "capitalism" is lamentable. You are looking at an oligopoly, degenerated through the mechanisms of American-style democracy, but you attribute it all to capitalism, an economic system, not ideology, because it became fashionable to hate on it during the financial crisis of 2007.

pixl97 4mo ago
I mean, America sells the idea that it is capitalism in the flesh, so there is that. Also the endless moaning about "socialism" by the capitalists is just as tiring. And you sound like a kid, bitching about capitalism has gone on for a long time. Why do you think the US.gov was so anti-communist, they didn't want any competition and so turned capitalism into an identity.
spencerflem 4mo ago
The core idea of capitalism is that you spend money to make more money. Rich get richer is the basic idea, you invest and those investments make you more. It very necessarily leads to oligarchy when left unchecked.
- neonstatic 4mo ago
  The core ideas of capitalism are private property and free market, not "rich getting richer". > It very necessarily leads to oligarchy when left unchecked. Great, let's not leave it unchecked. Unlike other -isms, capitalism does not need to be treated like an ideology to work. Also, maybe let's not attribute obvious failures of the political system to the underlying economic system.
  - spencerflem 4mo ago
    You can have free markets without investments, which imo is the key differentiator between Capitalism and what came before. That’s what ‘capital’ is in capitalism. In fact, capitalism tends to trend towards monopoly which is the opposite of a free market. Investing in a monopoly tends to be a Very Good Idea for investors but we want a free market so we go against the ideals of capitalism to break up firms and limit acquisitions. Once you can invest and reliably make money invested by its very nature you get Rich-Get-Richer. You can say this is a fine trade off for the benefits if you like, but it’s pretty well baked into the design. IMO we don’t have to go all the way to some other -ism either but we have a trillionaire that bought the government, that’s waaaayy too much capitalism if you ask me
pesus 4mo ago
> it became fashionable to hate on it during the financial crisis of 2007. Is it because it's "fashionable", or is it because million of people started directly feeling the adverse effects of it and saw the perpetrators get off scot-free?
- neonstatic 4mo ago
  It's been 19 years. Since then an entire generation has been conditioned to think that saying something bad about capitalism earns them social points. I have seen it so many times - people, who don't even know what capitalism is, saying they are "fighting to bring it down" just because they think it sounds cool. They should read a bit about bureaucracy (Kafka) and gulags (a variety of authors) to get a hint what "bringing it down" leads to. The very same people are happy to be participants in capitalism if it earns them money. > and saw the perpetrators get off scot-free? And your argument is that the reason for that is free market and private property? I would suggest it might be corruption in the political system, which happens to be "a federal republic" (since we are discussing the US).
happytoexplain 4mo ago
One man's "fashionable" is another man's "popular for concrete reasons".
- neonstatic 4mo ago
  Resentment, projection, and scapegoating are all time favorites for concrete reasons.

pixl97 4mo ago

I mean, America sells the idea that it is capitalism in the flesh, so there is that. Also the endless moaning about "socialism" by the capitalists is just as tiring. And you sound like a kid, bitching about capitalism has gone on for a long time. Why do you think the US.gov was so anti-communist, they didn't want any competition and so turned capitalism into an identity.

spencerflem 4mo ago

The core idea of capitalism is that you spend money to make more money. Rich get richer is the basic idea, you invest and those investments make you more. It very necessarily leads to oligarchy when left unchecked.

neonstatic 4mo ago
The core ideas of capitalism are private property and free market, not "rich getting richer". > It very necessarily leads to oligarchy when left unchecked. Great, let's not leave it unchecked. Unlike other -isms, capitalism does not need to be treated like an ideology to work. Also, maybe let's not attribute obvious failures of the political system to the underlying economic system.
- spencerflem 4mo ago
  You can have free markets without investments, which imo is the key differentiator between Capitalism and what came before. That’s what ‘capital’ is in capitalism. In fact, capitalism tends to trend towards monopoly which is the opposite of a free market. Investing in a monopoly tends to be a Very Good Idea for investors but we want a free market so we go against the ideals of capitalism to break up firms and limit acquisitions. Once you can invest and reliably make money invested by its very nature you get Rich-Get-Richer. You can say this is a fine trade off for the benefits if you like, but it’s pretty well baked into the design. IMO we don’t have to go all the way to some other -ism either but we have a trillionaire that bought the government, that’s waaaayy too much capitalism if you ask me

pesus 4mo ago

> it became fashionable to hate on it during the financial crisis of 2007. Is it because it's "fashionable", or is it because million of people started directly feeling the adverse effects of it and saw the perpetrators get off scot-free?

neonstatic 4mo ago
It's been 19 years. Since then an entire generation has been conditioned to think that saying something bad about capitalism earns them social points. I have seen it so many times - people, who don't even know what capitalism is, saying they are "fighting to bring it down" just because they think it sounds cool. They should read a bit about bureaucracy (Kafka) and gulags (a variety of authors) to get a hint what "bringing it down" leads to. The very same people are happy to be participants in capitalism if it earns them money. > and saw the perpetrators get off scot-free? And your argument is that the reason for that is free market and private property? I would suggest it might be corruption in the political system, which happens to be "a federal republic" (since we are discussing the US).

happytoexplain 4mo ago

One man's "fashionable" is another man's "popular for concrete reasons".

neonstatic 4mo ago
Resentment, projection, and scapegoating are all time favorites for concrete reasons.