4 ms·

This just says that they have too much power and society would be better off having a vacancy tax that aimed to reduce abuse by landlords while at the same time

This just says that they have too much power and society would be better off having a vacancy tax that aimed to reduce abuse by landlords while at the same time ensuring the city doesn't look like post crisis Detroit, which makes it worse for everyone.

ryanmcbride 4mo ago
Yup. Unfortunately landlords have plenty of time to lobby against things like this while the rest of us are busy contributing to society.
limagnolia 4mo ago
Most of the US does, its called property tax. Or in some cases, land value taxes.
- ryanmcbride 4mo ago
  You really thought you ate with this huh
- Grombobulous 4mo ago
  That doesn’t work very well in practice because a half vacant commercial property has lower property value than a full one. There are buildings that seem to purposefully keep commercial space vacant to devalue the building: https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/09/10/trump-gets-another-tax-break-on-trump-tower-retail-space/ https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/09/10/trump-gets-anothe...
  - prepend 4mo ago
    Property tax isn’t based on vacancy rate, it’s based on property value. The article writes a bit about property value being based on rents. So a completely rented building pays the same property tax as an empty building with no renters.
    - deleted 4mo ago
      [deleted]
    - flurben 4mo ago
      I used to think the same thing, until recently. Where I live (NC, USA) there was a big issue where commercial property owners have been able to reduce their property tax assessments, not on the basis of 'comparable sales' (like everyone else), but on the basis of the income derived from the property. I can't say how widespread this practice actually is, but it's not unheard of. Apparently property tax rules are going to vary widely by jurisdiction, which country / which state or province / etc.
      - naijaboiler 4mo ago
        There’s one thing you can guarantee in America. If it puts the interests of high income people vs everyday income people, the policies favoring the rich will almost always win out.
        voakbasda 4mo ago
        And as long as money = speech, this will never change.
      - limagnolia 4mo ago
        It would be absolute stupidity for a property owner to keep a property vacant solely to reduce the property tax assessment. Certainly there are some stupid rich people... but I doubt that the majority are that stupid. There must be some other explanation.
- dietr1ch 4mo ago
  Not the same because it does not depend on utilisation. Pretty much everywhere you see property taxes, but vacancy taxes are a lot more recent and I guess rare so far.
  - Redoubts 4mo ago
    Arguably vacancy taxes are just Georgism with extra steps
    - dietr1ch 4mo ago
      If you wanted to switch to Georgism it seems that you'd need to add that and slowly shift taxes into just being the vacancy taxes. Switching to Georgism overnight seems way too hard to execute.
jujube3 4mo ago
The city doesn't want commercial real estate values to collapse either, since buildings are taxed based on their value. If extend and pretend is ending, tax revenues are about to take a nosedive.
- dietr1ch 4mo ago
  The city is better off having its citizens participate more in the economy and paying taxes through it than staying home or not starting business because rent is too high.
  - inigyou 4mo ago
    Not necessarily. That's what's best for the city as in a geographical area where people live. What's best for the city as in an organisation with bureaucrats and finances is probably whatever increases revenues.

ryanmcbride 4mo ago

Yup. Unfortunately landlords have plenty of time to lobby against things like this while the rest of us are busy contributing to society.

limagnolia 4mo ago

Most of the US does, its called property tax. Or in some cases, land value taxes.

ryanmcbride 4mo ago
You really thought you ate with this huh
Grombobulous 4mo ago
That doesn’t work very well in practice because a half vacant commercial property has lower property value than a full one. There are buildings that seem to purposefully keep commercial space vacant to devalue the building: https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/09/10/trump-gets-another-tax-break-on-trump-tower-retail-space/ https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/09/10/trump-gets-anothe...
- prepend 4mo ago
  Property tax isn’t based on vacancy rate, it’s based on property value. The article writes a bit about property value being based on rents. So a completely rented building pays the same property tax as an empty building with no renters.
  - deleted 4mo ago
    [deleted]
  - flurben 4mo ago
    I used to think the same thing, until recently. Where I live (NC, USA) there was a big issue where commercial property owners have been able to reduce their property tax assessments, not on the basis of 'comparable sales' (like everyone else), but on the basis of the income derived from the property. I can't say how widespread this practice actually is, but it's not unheard of. Apparently property tax rules are going to vary widely by jurisdiction, which country / which state or province / etc.
    - naijaboiler 4mo ago
      There’s one thing you can guarantee in America. If it puts the interests of high income people vs everyday income people, the policies favoring the rich will almost always win out.
      - voakbasda 4mo ago
        And as long as money = speech, this will never change.
    - limagnolia 4mo ago
      It would be absolute stupidity for a property owner to keep a property vacant solely to reduce the property tax assessment. Certainly there are some stupid rich people... but I doubt that the majority are that stupid. There must be some other explanation.
dietr1ch 4mo ago
Not the same because it does not depend on utilisation. Pretty much everywhere you see property taxes, but vacancy taxes are a lot more recent and I guess rare so far.
- Redoubts 4mo ago
  Arguably vacancy taxes are just Georgism with extra steps
  - dietr1ch 4mo ago
    If you wanted to switch to Georgism it seems that you'd need to add that and slowly shift taxes into just being the vacancy taxes. Switching to Georgism overnight seems way too hard to execute.

jujube3 4mo ago

The city doesn't want commercial real estate values to collapse either, since buildings are taxed based on their value. If extend and pretend is ending, tax revenues are about to take a nosedive.

dietr1ch 4mo ago
The city is better off having its citizens participate more in the economy and paying taxes through it than staying home or not starting business because rent is too high.
- inigyou 4mo ago
  Not necessarily. That's what's best for the city as in a geographical area where people live. What's best for the city as in an organisation with bureaucrats and finances is probably whatever increases revenues.