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Your reasoning would be "ok" if Airbnb would absorb the cost of the fine. The problem here is that all the illegal part is done by the airbnb customer who offer

by duked 14y ago

Your reasoning would be "ok" if Airbnb would absorb the cost of the fine. The problem here is that all the illegal part is done by the airbnb customer who offers his short term rental on the site and he is the one who has to pay the fine if any.

tomkarlo 14y ago
It's like if made an navigation app that tells you all the best places to jaywalk (and sold it to you), but failed to tell you that it's likely to eventually cost you $150.
- anigbrowl 14y ago
  Or jail time, as in the case of an SF cyclist who was an avid competitor in Strava's ap comunity: http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/06/chris_bucchere_cyclist_who_kil.php http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/06/chris_bucchere_c...
  - jrockway 14y ago
    Uh, he killed someone. That's just plain negligent.
    - anigbrowl 14y ago
      It's criminal because he disregarded traffic signals (I believe he recently pleasded guilty BTW). It's also negligent when he gets sued by the decedent's relatives in civil court. That's not the app's fault, but it's not the only case where people have got into accidents because they were pursuing the status of fastest rider on a particular route. Where rewarding people (even intangibly) encourages them to push up against the limits of safety/legal restrictions, there's an argument for proximate causation, eg 'but for Appmaker's reward of an exclusive title (King of the Mountain) to the fastest cyclist on that stretch of road, Cyclist would not have habitually ridden at such high and dangerous speeds.' It's not a million miles away from prosecuting people for organizing street racing: http://twitdoc.com/upload/onaccel/san-diego-illegal-street-racing.pdf http://twitdoc.com/upload/onaccel/san-diego-illegal-street-r...
      - jrockway 14y ago
        Riding a bike fast is not all that dangerous. Ignoring traffic controls is. One would expect that the "king of the mountain" rating is based on a combination of lucky traffic light timing in addition to raw cycling skill. Otherwise, Lance Armstrong would win every route, right?
      - tomkarlo 14y ago
        It's the app equivalent of a "cannonball run" - a race to see who can get from point A to point B as fast as possible. Unless you have some way to ensure participants obey traffic regulations (and I don't think anything exists at present), if you base winning on minimizing time you are arguably inducing people to break rules, since that's almost mandatory to win. There's still some rallies around that run on public streets, but usually winning is based on _matching_ some target time, rather than having the shortest time overall.

by duked 14y ago

tomkarlo 14y ago

It's like if made an navigation app that tells you all the best places to jaywalk (and sold it to you), but failed to tell you that it's likely to eventually cost you $150.

anigbrowl 14y ago
Or jail time, as in the case of an SF cyclist who was an avid competitor in Strava's ap comunity: http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/06/chris_bucchere_cyclist_who_kil.php http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/06/chris_bucchere_c...
- jrockway 14y ago
  Uh, he killed someone. That's just plain negligent.
  - anigbrowl 14y ago
    It's criminal because he disregarded traffic signals (I believe he recently pleasded guilty BTW). It's also negligent when he gets sued by the decedent's relatives in civil court. That's not the app's fault, but it's not the only case where people have got into accidents because they were pursuing the status of fastest rider on a particular route. Where rewarding people (even intangibly) encourages them to push up against the limits of safety/legal restrictions, there's an argument for proximate causation, eg 'but for Appmaker's reward of an exclusive title (King of the Mountain) to the fastest cyclist on that stretch of road, Cyclist would not have habitually ridden at such high and dangerous speeds.' It's not a million miles away from prosecuting people for organizing street racing: http://twitdoc.com/upload/onaccel/san-diego-illegal-street-racing.pdf http://twitdoc.com/upload/onaccel/san-diego-illegal-street-r...
    - jrockway 14y ago
      Riding a bike fast is not all that dangerous. Ignoring traffic controls is. One would expect that the "king of the mountain" rating is based on a combination of lucky traffic light timing in addition to raw cycling skill. Otherwise, Lance Armstrong would win every route, right?
    - tomkarlo 14y ago
      It's the app equivalent of a "cannonball run" - a race to see who can get from point A to point B as fast as possible. Unless you have some way to ensure participants obey traffic regulations (and I don't think anything exists at present), if you base winning on minimizing time you are arguably inducing people to break rules, since that's almost mandatory to win. There's still some rallies around that run on public streets, but usually winning is based on _matching_ some target time, rather than having the shortest time overall.