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1) it's kind of unfair, because I've been using macs since... 2007 maybe? I was 100% linux from 2002-2007, then switched to macs. Despite my familiarity with l

1) it's kind of unfair, because I've been using macs since... 2007 maybe? I was 100% linux from 2002-2007, then switched to macs. Despite my familiarity with linux, I can't be sure that simple comfort with the Mac OS isn't part of it. I don't much like the new Gnome (haven't used it since 2007, remember), nor do I care to learn how to install a different window manager and thereby spend the time supporting it. 2) The monitor is the biggest issue for me, followed by the mouse. The monitor is low resolution, and feels very small compared to the retina monitor. Not a fair comparison, I know! But it's the one I make with the two computers side by side. 3) The dell keyboard is just as good as the mac's, and unlike most PCs, the overall hardware package generally feels very solid, simple, and well thought out. The carbon fiber bottom feels very cool. It's not quite as nice as the Air, but it's not too far away. So, those are basically the reasons that it sits on my desk, unused, next to my macbook. Also, obviously I don't mind travelling with a slightly larger and heavier computer.

t4nkd 14y ago
As someone who's been using a Mac since 2008-ish, beginning with a 17" A4, I'm really considering buying this Dell and moving to Ubuntu permanently. I have a few gripes with Apple laptops and I was wondering if you could refute or lend an opinion on why(or why not) the Dell would be an option. 1) I really hate the hardware upsell. With this XPS machine I'm getting a 256gb SSD, 8G RAM, and an 3GHz i7 processor. The comparable hardware for a 13" Retina is $2,200 and it's still not as light or thin. The comparable Air is missing a GHz of processing speed and still costs an extra $150. Also, there isn't a team of OEM Apple developers writing Ubuntu PPA support for either machine, so I'm stuck on OS X again, which I'm pretty disillusioned with. 2) I'm actually still not really clear what the advantage of a retina display is. Maybe it's because I haven't been able to use one for a significant timespan, but I just don't get it. If there was a way to clearly and easily illustrate why a 13" display benefits from retina resolution, I'd really appreciate it. 3) I'm kind've ready for a change from Apple products. I haven't used a high end laptop or PC from any other manufacturer and I feel like I don't know what I'm missing, if I'm missing anything. If you or the other XPS tester can respond at all, thanks in advance.
- llimllib 14y ago
  1) not really sure what the question is? If the specs are the thing for you, then go for the machine with the best specs. My macbook is plenty fast enough for me. 2) I like the retina display because I can crank my resolution up to 1680x1050 (on a 15") and it looks great. Font rendering on the retina displays is outstanding on apps that support it. 3) I can confirm that the Dell is not an Apple product. I'd be unhappy if I had to switch from a retina macbook or an Air to the dell, mainly because of the screen. YMMV.
  - t4nkd 14y ago
    Fair response, the list wanted to be in question form, turned into hem hawing about anti-apple opinion. I'm still on the fence about 13" resolution and I can't seem to find resources to help me make the choice. Thanks for the reply.
- tambourine_man 14y ago
  >2) I'm actually still not really clear what the advantage of a retina display is. Maybe it's because I haven't been able to use one for a significant timespan, but I just don't get it. If there was a way to clearly and easily illustrate why a 13" display benefits from retina resolution, I'd really appreciate it. How good is your eyesight? Honest question. The difference is night and day for me and I wonder how I lived with that blurry thing for so long.
  - t4nkd 14y ago
    Not very good, honestly. From what I've read, switching to a higher resolution wont really give me more work space, just make things more crisp, but I'm not sure how significant that would be for someone who wears corrective lenses already. Maybe I'll look for some kind of 1:1 13" comparison...
    - sshconnection 14y ago
      It makes things crisp enough that those higher resolutions are practical. Sure, you can turn your font size down low with a low res screen, but you rapidly get to a point where the characters are harder to distinguish. Not so with the retina screens. Really you just have to see the difference. It's striking.
brian_cloutier 14y ago
> nor do I care to learn how to install a different window manager and thereby spend the time supporting it. Since you haven't used linux in 5 years I'll be the fanboy that points out Linux, and Ubuntu especially, has grown up a lot since then. How do you install an application? You open a package manager and hit the install button. Same thing with desktop environments. You want KDE? 'sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop'. Xfce is 'xubuntu-desktop'. Hell, even gnome classic can be installed this way with 'gnome-panel'. LightDM will automatically notice the new environment. All you have to do is log out, then choose the desktop environment you want and log back in. Window managers usually take a little more fiddling to install properly but I assume that's not what you meant since you referenced gnome.
- llimllib 14y ago
  I was an ion3 guy back in the day. Installing and configuring those window managers (which I loved!) is why I left linux... I don't want to spend my time futzing around with the computer instead of getting work done.
  - brian_cloutier 14y ago
    That makes a lot more sense, as much as I love tiling window managers it's not especially fun to get that far off the beaten path, for exactly the reasons you've mentioned.
    - rsync 14y ago
      ion3 is the high water mark for simplicity and actually getting things done. We are all poorer for Tuomo Valkonen no longer producing this.
      - moe 14y ago
        Yes, ion3 was by far the best tiling wm in its time, and probably still is (I haven't seen another wm implement the tabbed frames metaphor yet). I wish someone would port it to OSX (not X11). I'd pay serious money for a license and I imagine quite a few others would, too.
w1ntermute 14y ago
> The monitor is the biggest issue for me, followed by the mouse. That's interesting, because the mouse is one of the biggest turnoffs for me when it comes to OS X. I never could get used to the acceleration curve[0], despite installing 3rd party software[1] to modify it. There's also the issue of not having a pointing stick on Macs, but that's another subject entirely. 0: http://tidbits.com/article/8893 http://tidbits.com/article/8893 1: http://triq.net/mac/mouse-acceleration-preference-pane-mac-os-x http://triq.net/mac/mouse-acceleration-preference-pane-mac-o...
- hayksaakian 14y ago
  Its not hard to turn it off altogether. http://osxdaily.com/2010/08/25/mouse-acceleration/ http://osxdaily.com/2010/08/25/mouse-acceleration/
  - w1ntermute 14y ago
    I mentioned the 3rd party software in your link ("Mouse Acceleration Preference Pane") in my initial post as something I'd tried. In any case, it was a work machine and I'm no longer there, so it's not particularly important anymore.
- ricardobeat 14y ago
  Mouse acceleration is something you get used to pretty quickly, a full day of usage is enough to not even notice it anymore. I use both OSX (trackpad), windows with a 1600dpi mouse, and play games with acceleration disabled. For work I prefer OSX's acceleration, it feels more precise/natural.
  - w1ntermute 14y ago
    I used a Mac for work for months and never got used to it, but obviously YMMV.
    - moe 14y ago
      I've noticed the curve seems to strangely vary between different Macs and different mice. On some of my Macs I had to install software to fix it, on some it just felt right from the start. I never kept track to make out a pattern, but it may be worth trying out a different mouse.
chimeracoder 14y ago
> 2007 maybe? I was 100% linux from 2002-2007, then switched to macs. > Despite my familiarity with linux, I can't be sure that simple comfort with the Mac OS isn't part of it. That's probably the reason, honestly - I'm coming at this as a daily Linux user who already knows how everything works, and all I want is that same experience on an Ultrabook. I can't speak for Dell, but I don't think this laptop could/should really compete for the same audience as the Macbook Air... if you're happy with using OS X on Apple hardware - if it's "good enough" - there's probably not much that could get you to switch. In my case, Linux is my first choice by far, so the choice between using my Ultrabook and using my work computer always results in me reaching for the ultrabook.
- llimllib 14y ago
  Agree with everything, except: > I don't think this laptop could/should really compete for the same audience as the Macbook Air I assume their market for this machine would be towards devs who might otherwise use an Air? I think of this machine as competing directly against the Air, which is why I used it as a comparison. Why you don't think they're competing? (This comment is meant in as non-combative a way as possible, I liked your response a lot. I hate the internet?)
  - chimeracoder 14y ago
    > Why you don't think they're competing? Oh, they very well may be (probably are, in fact). I'm just saying that it's better to think of it as a laptop for Linux users who want something Air-like, as opposed to Air users who want Linux. That's simply because it's much harder to replace something that's "good enough", even with something that's hands-down better on all fronts (take a look at Plan 9 vs. UNIX[1]) For users like me, a Mac isn't even close to "good enough", so I like some of the additional things this provides versus other solutions (installing Linux manually on another Ultrabook or on a laptop and providing my own support). For users who are already happy with a Macbook Air, this is probably good enough if you couldn't use your Air, but the added convenience may not compensate the friction of changing, even if you've used Linux in the past. In other words, that friction doesn't exist for existing Linux users. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_9_from_Bell_Labs#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_9_from_Bell_Labs#Impact
deleted 14y ago
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t4nkd 14y ago

As someone who's been using a Mac since 2008-ish, beginning with a 17" A4, I'm really considering buying this Dell and moving to Ubuntu permanently. I have a few gripes with Apple laptops and I was wondering if you could refute or lend an opinion on why(or why not) the Dell would be an option. 1) I really hate the hardware upsell. With this XPS machine I'm getting a 256gb SSD, 8G RAM, and an 3GHz i7 processor. The comparable hardware for a 13" Retina is $2,200 and it's still not as light or thin. The comparable Air is missing a GHz of processing speed and still costs an extra $150. Also, there isn't a team of OEM Apple developers writing Ubuntu PPA support for either machine, so I'm stuck on OS X again, which I'm pretty disillusioned with. 2) I'm actually still not really clear what the advantage of a retina display is. Maybe it's because I haven't been able to use one for a significant timespan, but I just don't get it. If there was a way to clearly and easily illustrate why a 13" display benefits from retina resolution, I'd really appreciate it. 3) I'm kind've ready for a change from Apple products. I haven't used a high end laptop or PC from any other manufacturer and I feel like I don't know what I'm missing, if I'm missing anything. If you or the other XPS tester can respond at all, thanks in advance.

llimllib 14y ago
1) not really sure what the question is? If the specs are the thing for you, then go for the machine with the best specs. My macbook is plenty fast enough for me. 2) I like the retina display because I can crank my resolution up to 1680x1050 (on a 15") and it looks great. Font rendering on the retina displays is outstanding on apps that support it. 3) I can confirm that the Dell is not an Apple product. I'd be unhappy if I had to switch from a retina macbook or an Air to the dell, mainly because of the screen. YMMV.
- t4nkd 14y ago
  Fair response, the list wanted to be in question form, turned into hem hawing about anti-apple opinion. I'm still on the fence about 13" resolution and I can't seem to find resources to help me make the choice. Thanks for the reply.
tambourine_man 14y ago
>2) I'm actually still not really clear what the advantage of a retina display is. Maybe it's because I haven't been able to use one for a significant timespan, but I just don't get it. If there was a way to clearly and easily illustrate why a 13" display benefits from retina resolution, I'd really appreciate it. How good is your eyesight? Honest question. The difference is night and day for me and I wonder how I lived with that blurry thing for so long.
- t4nkd 14y ago
  Not very good, honestly. From what I've read, switching to a higher resolution wont really give me more work space, just make things more crisp, but I'm not sure how significant that would be for someone who wears corrective lenses already. Maybe I'll look for some kind of 1:1 13" comparison...
  - sshconnection 14y ago
    It makes things crisp enough that those higher resolutions are practical. Sure, you can turn your font size down low with a low res screen, but you rapidly get to a point where the characters are harder to distinguish. Not so with the retina screens. Really you just have to see the difference. It's striking.

brian_cloutier 14y ago

> nor do I care to learn how to install a different window manager and thereby spend the time supporting it. Since you haven't used linux in 5 years I'll be the fanboy that points out Linux, and Ubuntu especially, has grown up a lot since then. How do you install an application? You open a package manager and hit the install button. Same thing with desktop environments. You want KDE? 'sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop'. Xfce is 'xubuntu-desktop'. Hell, even gnome classic can be installed this way with 'gnome-panel'. LightDM will automatically notice the new environment. All you have to do is log out, then choose the desktop environment you want and log back in. Window managers usually take a little more fiddling to install properly but I assume that's not what you meant since you referenced gnome.

llimllib 14y ago
I was an ion3 guy back in the day. Installing and configuring those window managers (which I loved!) is why I left linux... I don't want to spend my time futzing around with the computer instead of getting work done.
- brian_cloutier 14y ago
  That makes a lot more sense, as much as I love tiling window managers it's not especially fun to get that far off the beaten path, for exactly the reasons you've mentioned.
  - rsync 14y ago
    ion3 is the high water mark for simplicity and actually getting things done. We are all poorer for Tuomo Valkonen no longer producing this.
    - moe 14y ago
      Yes, ion3 was by far the best tiling wm in its time, and probably still is (I haven't seen another wm implement the tabbed frames metaphor yet). I wish someone would port it to OSX (not X11). I'd pay serious money for a license and I imagine quite a few others would, too.

w1ntermute 14y ago

> The monitor is the biggest issue for me, followed by the mouse. That's interesting, because the mouse is one of the biggest turnoffs for me when it comes to OS X. I never could get used to the acceleration curve[0], despite installing 3rd party software[1] to modify it. There's also the issue of not having a pointing stick on Macs, but that's another subject entirely. 0: http://tidbits.com/article/8893 http://tidbits.com/article/8893 1: http://triq.net/mac/mouse-acceleration-preference-pane-mac-os-x http://triq.net/mac/mouse-acceleration-preference-pane-mac-o...

hayksaakian 14y ago
Its not hard to turn it off altogether. http://osxdaily.com/2010/08/25/mouse-acceleration/ http://osxdaily.com/2010/08/25/mouse-acceleration/
- w1ntermute 14y ago
  I mentioned the 3rd party software in your link ("Mouse Acceleration Preference Pane") in my initial post as something I'd tried. In any case, it was a work machine and I'm no longer there, so it's not particularly important anymore.
ricardobeat 14y ago
Mouse acceleration is something you get used to pretty quickly, a full day of usage is enough to not even notice it anymore. I use both OSX (trackpad), windows with a 1600dpi mouse, and play games with acceleration disabled. For work I prefer OSX's acceleration, it feels more precise/natural.
- w1ntermute 14y ago
  I used a Mac for work for months and never got used to it, but obviously YMMV.
  - moe 14y ago
    I've noticed the curve seems to strangely vary between different Macs and different mice. On some of my Macs I had to install software to fix it, on some it just felt right from the start. I never kept track to make out a pattern, but it may be worth trying out a different mouse.

chimeracoder 14y ago

> 2007 maybe? I was 100% linux from 2002-2007, then switched to macs. > Despite my familiarity with linux, I can't be sure that simple comfort with the Mac OS isn't part of it. That's probably the reason, honestly - I'm coming at this as a daily Linux user who already knows how everything works, and all I want is that same experience on an Ultrabook. I can't speak for Dell, but I don't think this laptop could/should really compete for the same audience as the Macbook Air... if you're happy with using OS X on Apple hardware - if it's "good enough" - there's probably not much that could get you to switch. In my case, Linux is my first choice by far, so the choice between using my Ultrabook and using my work computer always results in me reaching for the ultrabook.

llimllib 14y ago
Agree with everything, except: > I don't think this laptop could/should really compete for the same audience as the Macbook Air I assume their market for this machine would be towards devs who might otherwise use an Air? I think of this machine as competing directly against the Air, which is why I used it as a comparison. Why you don't think they're competing? (This comment is meant in as non-combative a way as possible, I liked your response a lot. I hate the internet?)
- chimeracoder 14y ago
  > Why you don't think they're competing? Oh, they very well may be (probably are, in fact). I'm just saying that it's better to think of it as a laptop for Linux users who want something Air-like, as opposed to Air users who want Linux. That's simply because it's much harder to replace something that's "good enough", even with something that's hands-down better on all fronts (take a look at Plan 9 vs. UNIX[1]) For users like me, a Mac isn't even close to "good enough", so I like some of the additional things this provides versus other solutions (installing Linux manually on another Ultrabook or on a laptop and providing my own support). For users who are already happy with a Macbook Air, this is probably good enough if you couldn't use your Air, but the added convenience may not compensate the friction of changing, even if you've used Linux in the past. In other words, that friction doesn't exist for existing Linux users. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_9_from_Bell_Labs#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_9_from_Bell_Labs#Impact

deleted 14y ago

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