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> FSD is up to v14 and there is no sense in which it's "Full", or is likely to be "Full" any time soon. I think the SpaceX IPO is way overvalued, but have you

> FSD is up to v14 and there is no sense in which it's "Full", or is likely to be "Full" any time soon. I think the SpaceX IPO is way overvalued, but have you actually tried FSD v14 yourself? My car has 8-year old hardware running v12, and it handles like 90+% of my driving. When I test drove 14 it blew my mind how good it had gotten in only 8 months of development. In my opinion, there's question that it's "when," not "if."

veqz 4mo ago
Yes, I hear lots of people saying Tesla's "FSD" product can drive by itself already. Yet if the car crashes while in FSD mode, it is still you who are legally the driver and you who will be responsible. You are the driver, regardless of what the name of the car's software is. This can be contrasted with e.g. Mercedes' offering, which is actually self-driving, and where Mercedes is responsible if the car crashes (The limitation in that case, of course, is the very limited roads and conditions where that software will actually be enabled.). So, yes: Until Tesla (or someone else) actually takes responsibility while the car drives itself, and the "driver" is legally just a passenger, it is not a fully self-driving car. If you ever take your attention away from the road while using FSD you are breaking the law, which says that as the driver, you must always pay attention.
- wnmurphy 4mo ago
  > Until Tesla (or someone else) actually takes responsibility while the car drives itself Were you aware they're already doing exactly this in Austin and Dallas?
  - vel0city 4mo ago
    Yeah, there's ~40 of them in Dallas, and they're highly geofenced. Seems pretty small for a platform they're so confident about.
  - soperj 4mo ago
    They've also had multiple crashes in very few miles driven.
vel0city 4mo ago
Its so good that's why they've got tons of robotaxis all over the place. Oh, they only have a tiny fleet in a few cities which are still mostly monitored? Strange.
stetrain 4mo ago
> it's "when," not "if." That has always been the question since Elon started making self-driving claims back in 2016. If you believed him any time up until now you'd have been wrong and potentially own a car that will never drive without a responsible human in the driver's seat. Another question is how many resources each "self-driving" car needs to complete its task. All of the major self-driving taxi providers do have monitoring staff who need to intervene occasionally to get the car unstuck from some situations. If you need to pay one monitor per 10 cars you can run a taxi service in specific markets but it's pretty hard to roll that out to a fleet of millions of personally-owned cars.
soperj 4mo ago
I hope you've filled out your will.

veqz 4mo ago

Yes, I hear lots of people saying Tesla's "FSD" product can drive by itself already. Yet if the car crashes while in FSD mode, it is still you who are legally the driver and you who will be responsible. You are the driver, regardless of what the name of the car's software is. This can be contrasted with e.g. Mercedes' offering, which is actually self-driving, and where Mercedes is responsible if the car crashes (The limitation in that case, of course, is the very limited roads and conditions where that software will actually be enabled.). So, yes: Until Tesla (or someone else) actually takes responsibility while the car drives itself, and the "driver" is legally just a passenger, it is not a fully self-driving car. If you ever take your attention away from the road while using FSD you are breaking the law, which says that as the driver, you must always pay attention.

wnmurphy 4mo ago
> Until Tesla (or someone else) actually takes responsibility while the car drives itself Were you aware they're already doing exactly this in Austin and Dallas?
- vel0city 4mo ago
  Yeah, there's ~40 of them in Dallas, and they're highly geofenced. Seems pretty small for a platform they're so confident about.
- soperj 4mo ago
  They've also had multiple crashes in very few miles driven.

vel0city 4mo ago

Its so good that's why they've got tons of robotaxis all over the place. Oh, they only have a tiny fleet in a few cities which are still mostly monitored? Strange.

stetrain 4mo ago

> it's "when," not "if." That has always been the question since Elon started making self-driving claims back in 2016. If you believed him any time up until now you'd have been wrong and potentially own a car that will never drive without a responsible human in the driver's seat. Another question is how many resources each "self-driving" car needs to complete its task. All of the major self-driving taxi providers do have monitoring staff who need to intervene occasionally to get the car unstuck from some situations. If you need to pay one monitor per 10 cars you can run a taxi service in specific markets but it's pretty hard to roll that out to a fleet of millions of personally-owned cars.

soperj 4mo ago

I hope you've filled out your will.