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> do they have to let Anthropic and Deepseek run their models on it too? provided it gets big enough, yes. the EU's position roughly is "if this hurts an entir

> do they have to let Anthropic and Deepseek run their models on it too? provided it gets big enough, yes. the EU's position roughly is "if this hurts an entire market just to benefit you, and lots of people use / rely on it, then you gotta allow it"

aurareturn 4mo ago
Why can't Anthropic or Deepseek take the big risk to develop their own phone? It doesn't seem right that they can simply use EU laws to hop on the ride for free without taking the same risks.
- KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
  As a consumer it also doesn't seem right that Apple can just use all their private APIs that no other company is allowed to use to tell me what I can and can't use on my phone. If I want Anthropic to have the same level of access that Apple grants itself on _my_ phone, I should be able to do so.
  - aurareturn 4mo ago
    If I want Anthropic to have the same level of access that Apple grants itself on _my_ phone, I should be able to do so. I want to install my personal software on my refrigerator, washing machine, hand shaver, coffee maker. I bought them. They're mine. /s If people want to buy open hardware, then just buy those. If they don't exist, make them yourself.
    - gumby271 4mo ago
      Just make a new phone OS lol, problem solved.
      - aurareturn 4mo ago
        If the demand for installing your own software is so great, a company would make it.
    - KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
      Do you rather want your refrigerator, washing machine and coffee maker send all the data it collects about you during your usage to some company you don't even know? How is it ridiculous to want to be able to make your devices do what you want to do, not what the big company behind it wants?
      - aurareturn 4mo ago
        Those machines don’t connect to the internet but I want to run my own software on them.
        KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
        1. A lot of those more recent machines do actually connect to the internet. 2. Since you want to run your own software on them, but you can't buy open hardware like that, did you build it yourself then as you suggested? "If they don't exist, make them yourself."
        aurareturn 4mo ago
        1. I want to run my own software even on the ones that don’t connect to the internet. /s 2. No, I don’t have the skills to. But if it’s so important to you, you can surely build it yourself.
  - Danox 4mo ago
    Don’t buy it you have Android which is 3/4 of the world? What’s the problem? You also have Windows which is also 3/4 of the world.
    - KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
      As if Android and Windows don't also use the same tactics. Windows used to not let you uninstall Edge and Android used to just default to Chrome and Google Search, now they have to prompt you what you actually want to use. If the big companies are left unchecked, of course they'll use their size to bully other players to increase their own profit, but always at the cost of the customer.
      - aurareturn 4mo ago
        Surely there must be a phone you can buy that lets you do that right?
- merlindru 4mo ago
  the EU feels like this falls under monopolistic practices, which it has deemed illegal. the buck stops with the politicians - there's no reason other than "the EU thinks it's bad for the economy and should thus not be allowed"
Danox 4mo ago
Then the EU’s not gonna get anywhere the US and China will just sail along. The lawyers in the EU are essentially cutting their throats building hardware and operating systems cost real money and time which is one of the reasons Apple is using Google’s model for $1 billion a year. (when Apple finishes their models in house, Google probably will be dropped). Like dropping Broadcom, Intel, or Qualcomm in 2027-28). It takes real time to drag along five ecosystems. That is the main reason it’s taking Apple longer than they’re so-called competition? Noticed that Google and Microsoft only do bits and pieces. Microsoft has no mobile and Google at its heart is an ad company the processor is six years behind.
- merlindru 4mo ago
  that's the most common criticism. can't say i disagree. though monopolistic practices are unequivocally bad and used to get struck down. one may argue this is just another instance of disallowing monopolistic behavior. the DOJ used to have sharper fangs than what the EU is doing now

aurareturn 4mo ago

Why can't Anthropic or Deepseek take the big risk to develop their own phone? It doesn't seem right that they can simply use EU laws to hop on the ride for free without taking the same risks.

KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
As a consumer it also doesn't seem right that Apple can just use all their private APIs that no other company is allowed to use to tell me what I can and can't use on my phone. If I want Anthropic to have the same level of access that Apple grants itself on _my_ phone, I should be able to do so.
- aurareturn 4mo ago
  If I want Anthropic to have the same level of access that Apple grants itself on _my_ phone, I should be able to do so. I want to install my personal software on my refrigerator, washing machine, hand shaver, coffee maker. I bought them. They're mine. /s If people want to buy open hardware, then just buy those. If they don't exist, make them yourself.
  - gumby271 4mo ago
    Just make a new phone OS lol, problem solved.
    - aurareturn 4mo ago
      If the demand for installing your own software is so great, a company would make it.
  - KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
    Do you rather want your refrigerator, washing machine and coffee maker send all the data it collects about you during your usage to some company you don't even know? How is it ridiculous to want to be able to make your devices do what you want to do, not what the big company behind it wants?
    - aurareturn 4mo ago
      Those machines don’t connect to the internet but I want to run my own software on them.
      - KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
        1. A lot of those more recent machines do actually connect to the internet. 2. Since you want to run your own software on them, but you can't buy open hardware like that, did you build it yourself then as you suggested? "If they don't exist, make them yourself."
        aurareturn 4mo ago
        1. I want to run my own software even on the ones that don’t connect to the internet. /s 2. No, I don’t have the skills to. But if it’s so important to you, you can surely build it yourself.
- Danox 4mo ago
  Don’t buy it you have Android which is 3/4 of the world? What’s the problem? You also have Windows which is also 3/4 of the world.
  - KawaiiCyborg 4mo ago
    As if Android and Windows don't also use the same tactics. Windows used to not let you uninstall Edge and Android used to just default to Chrome and Google Search, now they have to prompt you what you actually want to use. If the big companies are left unchecked, of course they'll use their size to bully other players to increase their own profit, but always at the cost of the customer.
    - aurareturn 4mo ago
      Surely there must be a phone you can buy that lets you do that right?
merlindru 4mo ago
the EU feels like this falls under monopolistic practices, which it has deemed illegal. the buck stops with the politicians - there's no reason other than "the EU thinks it's bad for the economy and should thus not be allowed"

Danox 4mo ago

Then the EU’s not gonna get anywhere the US and China will just sail along. The lawyers in the EU are essentially cutting their throats building hardware and operating systems cost real money and time which is one of the reasons Apple is using Google’s model for $1 billion a year. (when Apple finishes their models in house, Google probably will be dropped). Like dropping Broadcom, Intel, or Qualcomm in 2027-28). It takes real time to drag along five ecosystems. That is the main reason it’s taking Apple longer than they’re so-called competition? Noticed that Google and Microsoft only do bits and pieces. Microsoft has no mobile and Google at its heart is an ad company the processor is six years behind.

merlindru 4mo ago
that's the most common criticism. can't say i disagree. though monopolistic practices are unequivocally bad and used to get struck down. one may argue this is just another instance of disallowing monopolistic behavior. the DOJ used to have sharper fangs than what the EU is doing now