6 ms·

Looking In retrospect, if you were a policy maker today how would you try to prevent the new generation for having to go through this (today your path likely wo

Looking In retrospect, if you were a policy maker today how would you try to prevent the new generation for having to go through this (today your path likely would not be viable due to fentanyl).

isityettime 4mo ago
Maybe also worth asking what he's doing along those lines as a father. Probably some interventions are in reach for the state, and there are some other things that parents are best positioned to do. He might have some insight into both.
- dadpassthebeans 4mo ago
  (Lost my passwd to my throwaway so i had to create another, sorry) Me? I have nothing to offer. My elementary aged kids will be in middle school soon and I am not looking forward to having to try and keep them on the straight and narrow. At home my parents afforded me a long leash and I rejected most of what my superiors at school/etc fed me. As soon I was able, I GTFO. Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it.
  - throwaway2037 4mo ago
    This is a good and balanced reply. My brother was much more rebellious than me when he was younger. Not as crazy as your first post, but crazy enough for our relatively conservative family. When he got married and had kids later, he is -- to my great surprise -- a very strict, conservative parent. He has his daughters on the straight and narrow path. Sometimes I wonder will they go crazy as soon as they got to uni (move away from home). I saw more than a few crack during my first year of uni, living in dorms. You can probably find some books or blogs that people have written about their own journey as a parent, especially when they had a rocky start in life as an adult. I am not a parent, but I have observed that the best style of parents adapt to the natural personality of each child. For example, I was very contientious from early childhood (I assume that part was genetic), and my brother was exactly the opposite. My parents really had to work with him to get him to take school seriously. Fortunately, he has a naturally high IQ, so it wasn't so hard for him.
    - red-iron-pine 4mo ago
      > I saw more than a few crack during my first year of uni, living in dorms. You can probably find some books or blogs that people have written about their own journey as a parent, especially when they had a rocky start in life as an adult. grew up around the military, ended up enlisting out of HS. buncha my friends, all army/navy brats from outside of DC, all went off to college. easily 1/3 drank themselves stupid or otherwise went nuts. off the leash they decided they'd rather be in a band and work part-time at the grocery store than keep going down the path they were forced. Most of them have since graduated and several are doing pretty well. Had to do that freedom thing, tho. better choice than the one I made, too
  - close04 4mo ago
    > Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it. Why do you think they'd know it? Working out in the end for you was the less likely option. Everything is possible but if you manage to explain the likelihood of each outcome compared to the expected payoff it could make the case clearer. Not an easy thing when dealing with small kids. It's hard because even adults are blinded by survivorship bias. Kids are easy victims, they can all become Cristiano Ronaldo, they can all launch the unicorn startup after dropping out of school, etc. > I have nothing to offer. Kids need guidance whether you think they'll take it or not, especially at that age. It's up to you to strike the balance between guidance, trickery, heavy handed rules, something works. Your teachers probably didn't care enough and your parents couldn't find the right button because it's not an easy job but it doesn't mean you can't or worse, that you shouldn't even try because you "have nothing to offer".
  - bko 4mo ago
    > Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it. "Do whatever you want and things will work out because it worked out for me" is not a good (or honest) message for children. [survivor-bias-airplane.jpg]
    - konart 4mo ago
      I'm not the parent commenter, but I think this is not what they are saying. This is more of a "Do what you must, come what may" thing. You can and should teach your kids the ways of life and make them understand that - the choices are theirs - responsibility for said choices is also theirs - results may not reflect choices
bagels 4mo ago
Did he have to? Some of that sounds like choices, especially in the start.
- kbenson 4mo ago
  Almost everything is a choice. The difference is that sometimes you're making a rational one and sometimes you only think you're making a rational one and to outsiders and in retrospect it obviously wasn't the best choice, or event a good choice. There are two aspects to the type of question that was asked. How do you prevent people from ha I g to make choices which are rational and good for their options but still really bad overall, and how do you convinve/educate people about available options they weren't aware of so they don't make outright bad choices when better ones are available that they are unaware of. There are many possible answers to "why did you take off to the west and ride trains and sleep in parks and steak to feed yourself", but most of them aren't "well I just felt like leaving my entirely stable, loving and supportive friends and family." What to an outsider seems like a poor choice to a specific person imight seem like the decision that saved their life, even in retrospect.
  - shrubby 4mo ago
    Well said here. We don't have a honest discussion about the progression of addiction so the choices are not visible, until later. The first beer is the most critical choice, yet it's made for us (in 99% of the cases) by our peers. So is it a choice really? We're routine (addiction) prone herd animals and as long as we pretend otherwise (free will and the likes) we're stuck in repeating this.
    - moi2388 4mo ago
      Why is the first beer the most critical choice? Why isn’t the last beer the most critical one, for example?
      - TylerE 4mo ago
        Without the first beer there is no last beer.
dadpassthebeans 4mo ago
(Lost my passwd to my throwaway so i had to create another, sorry) I dont know if you intended to reply to the OP/author or my reply. In my case, I dodged hard drugs for $reasons and can safely say that I chose my own adventure. I was had anxiety and apprehension about status quo and what was expected of a HS graduate circa 2000 so I said F it and did my own thing.
deleted 4mo ago
[deleted]
wvh 4mo ago
I guess one can only optimise the system for the majority following the beaten path. Some folks just have to find a way both through the world and through their own head.
- Obscurity4340 4mo ago
  > Some folks just have to find a way both through the world and through their own head You need to stop seeing me so hard rn

Looking In retrospect, if you were a policy maker today how would you try to prevent the new generation for having to go through this (today your path likely would not be viable due to fentanyl).

isityettime 4mo ago

Maybe also worth asking what he's doing along those lines as a father. Probably some interventions are in reach for the state, and there are some other things that parents are best positioned to do. He might have some insight into both.

dadpassthebeans 4mo ago
(Lost my passwd to my throwaway so i had to create another, sorry) Me? I have nothing to offer. My elementary aged kids will be in middle school soon and I am not looking forward to having to try and keep them on the straight and narrow. At home my parents afforded me a long leash and I rejected most of what my superiors at school/etc fed me. As soon I was able, I GTFO. Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it.
- throwaway2037 4mo ago
  This is a good and balanced reply. My brother was much more rebellious than me when he was younger. Not as crazy as your first post, but crazy enough for our relatively conservative family. When he got married and had kids later, he is -- to my great surprise -- a very strict, conservative parent. He has his daughters on the straight and narrow path. Sometimes I wonder will they go crazy as soon as they got to uni (move away from home). I saw more than a few crack during my first year of uni, living in dorms. You can probably find some books or blogs that people have written about their own journey as a parent, especially when they had a rocky start in life as an adult. I am not a parent, but I have observed that the best style of parents adapt to the natural personality of each child. For example, I was very contientious from early childhood (I assume that part was genetic), and my brother was exactly the opposite. My parents really had to work with him to get him to take school seriously. Fortunately, he has a naturally high IQ, so it wasn't so hard for him.
  - red-iron-pine 4mo ago
    > I saw more than a few crack during my first year of uni, living in dorms. You can probably find some books or blogs that people have written about their own journey as a parent, especially when they had a rocky start in life as an adult. grew up around the military, ended up enlisting out of HS. buncha my friends, all army/navy brats from outside of DC, all went off to college. easily 1/3 drank themselves stupid or otherwise went nuts. off the leash they decided they'd rather be in a band and work part-time at the grocery store than keep going down the path they were forced. Most of them have since graduated and several are doing pretty well. Had to do that freedom thing, tho. better choice than the one I made, too
- close04 4mo ago
  > Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it. Why do you think they'd know it? Working out in the end for you was the less likely option. Everything is possible but if you manage to explain the likelihood of each outcome compared to the expected payoff it could make the case clearer. Not an easy thing when dealing with small kids. It's hard because even adults are blinded by survivorship bias. Kids are easy victims, they can all become Cristiano Ronaldo, they can all launch the unicorn startup after dropping out of school, etc. > I have nothing to offer. Kids need guidance whether you think they'll take it or not, especially at that age. It's up to you to strike the balance between guidance, trickery, heavy handed rules, something works. Your teachers probably didn't care enough and your parents couldn't find the right button because it's not an easy job but it doesn't mean you can't or worse, that you shouldn't even try because you "have nothing to offer".
- bko 4mo ago
  > Took many risks and things worked out okay for me in the end. I could tell my kids to do the opposite but I'd be lying and they'd know it. "Do whatever you want and things will work out because it worked out for me" is not a good (or honest) message for children. [survivor-bias-airplane.jpg]
  - konart 4mo ago
    I'm not the parent commenter, but I think this is not what they are saying. This is more of a "Do what you must, come what may" thing. You can and should teach your kids the ways of life and make them understand that - the choices are theirs - responsibility for said choices is also theirs - results may not reflect choices

bagels 4mo ago

Did he have to? Some of that sounds like choices, especially in the start.

kbenson 4mo ago
Almost everything is a choice. The difference is that sometimes you're making a rational one and sometimes you only think you're making a rational one and to outsiders and in retrospect it obviously wasn't the best choice, or event a good choice. There are two aspects to the type of question that was asked. How do you prevent people from ha I g to make choices which are rational and good for their options but still really bad overall, and how do you convinve/educate people about available options they weren't aware of so they don't make outright bad choices when better ones are available that they are unaware of. There are many possible answers to "why did you take off to the west and ride trains and sleep in parks and steak to feed yourself", but most of them aren't "well I just felt like leaving my entirely stable, loving and supportive friends and family." What to an outsider seems like a poor choice to a specific person imight seem like the decision that saved their life, even in retrospect.
- shrubby 4mo ago
  Well said here. We don't have a honest discussion about the progression of addiction so the choices are not visible, until later. The first beer is the most critical choice, yet it's made for us (in 99% of the cases) by our peers. So is it a choice really? We're routine (addiction) prone herd animals and as long as we pretend otherwise (free will and the likes) we're stuck in repeating this.
  - moi2388 4mo ago
    Why is the first beer the most critical choice? Why isn’t the last beer the most critical one, for example?
    - TylerE 4mo ago
      Without the first beer there is no last beer.

dadpassthebeans 4mo ago

(Lost my passwd to my throwaway so i had to create another, sorry) I dont know if you intended to reply to the OP/author or my reply. In my case, I dodged hard drugs for $reasons and can safely say that I chose my own adventure. I was had anxiety and apprehension about status quo and what was expected of a HS graduate circa 2000 so I said F it and did my own thing.

deleted 4mo ago

[deleted]

wvh 4mo ago

I guess one can only optimise the system for the majority following the beaten path. Some folks just have to find a way both through the world and through their own head.

Obscurity4340 4mo ago
> Some folks just have to find a way both through the world and through their own head You need to stop seeing me so hard rn