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I want to summarize and add some commentary to the article[1] posted by macu as a reply to another comment. It's amazingly interesting and well argued. In shor
by goldfeld 14y ago
I want to summarize and add some commentary to the article[1] posted by macu as a reply to another comment.
It's amazingly interesting and well argued. In short, the author says first that any sufficiently advanced civilization will at one point send self-replicating probes that will eventually colonize all of the galaxy and even universe. And it takes only one match to light a fire, and this is important--that is, for a sufficiently advanced planet, it would take only one rebel, one mad scientist, to set the colonization, by robots, of every habitable body in motion.
Assuming the above is true, then why do we not see any sign of these probes? It follows that there must be a Great Filter that prevented them from ever being created. Things that qualify as such a filter are not plenty, and include the original formation of life and the transition from procaryotic to eucaryotic (taking a couple billion years).
Thus if we find life so easily formed on Mars or anywhere else (especially eucaryotic cells), we can assume these past events are not really Great Filters. Then, the only reason we haven't found a single probe is that any sufficiently advanced civilization destroys itself before it ever gets to that point. If it's not nuclear weapons, then there must exist technologies that are sure on our path to discovery while at the same time guaranteeing our extinction--again, think in terms of things that only need one outlier to use it in a way that compromises the existence of all on Earth for good.
So he concludes that we must pray that we never find life anywhere else, because it would in turn give us hope (but not assure us) that there might exist no Great Filter ahead of us, and the Great Filter was indeed in our conception as life--thus we are the one single unfathomably lucky planet to ever have harbored life. If nothing potentially impedes our expansion, we will be the one sending probes and expanding to everywhere.
Adding my own expansion on this, I believe it's extremely unlikely that there is some irrevocably cataclysmical tech to be discovered before ever we are able to send self-replicating probes--ones who can mine the raw materials needed for unbounded expansion.
I don't think we're that far from that point, and taking from our own anecdotal existence since it's the only one there is, even if we do annihilate ourselves before sending them out by chance, other civilizations might not have done so, if they existed. Thus indeed the only tech that would assure a Great Filter is the self-replicating technology itself. And that is a strong point--the author seems to ignore the fact that these probes wouldn't really be the expansion of humanity, it would be the expansion of drones. And what might the precursor techs for such a replicating machine look like? If superior AI is needed at any rate, we could think that the tech leading to sure extinction is indeed robots who decimate us humans. And since they would do this as early as chance would afford it, the robots eliminating us would be as dumb as possible--thus we can assume they would be incapable of advancing technology on their own; or of coordinating an event like launching themselves into space, and thus would never leave Earth. In this scenario, we can assume every civilization that ever got a shot in going to space ended up extinct, their planet ridden with dumb self-replicating robots who can never launch themselves into space.
Since self-replicating robots are the hypothesis of the author's argument, then indeed it makes sense that every potential civilization either never reached this tech (the Great Filter is in life's conception, or otherwise somehow denies the existence of self-replicating robots), or it must absolutely reach it, in order to colonize space, but in doing so it declares it's extinction.
So, like the author, I also hope[2] that we never find life elsewhere, that we might put our tiny hopes in thriving as a race, the only one that ever existed.
[1]: http://www.nickbostrom.com/extraterrestrial.pdf http://www.nickbostrom.com/extraterrestrial.pdf
[2]: Just an hour ago, I would have jumped with joy if this NASA announcement was indeed confirming life.
- trendspotter 14y agoI think Nick Bostrom should have focused more on the time and randomness factor. Maybe there was life in our galaxy, but they visited us before humans have lived. Or we have been visited (think peruvian desert drawings [1]), but before we as human race were as advanced as we are today and they left our boring planet to visit another galaxy. There are probably more than 170 billion (1.7 × 1011) galaxies... [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazca_Lines http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazca_Lines
- goldfeld 14y agoThe point is, well before folks who could feel "boredom" passed by us, their self-replicating probes would have landed here, many thousand, million or billion years prior. And they would have harassed our planet to depletion, since they are dumb and drone-like. Even if a meteor somehow extinguished them, by then they would have launched themselves into all of the solar system, and by chance would land here again. Given time and randomness, these probes are like radio waves; they get everywhere once set in motion. Thus we can assume they were never set in motion.
- trendspotter 14y agoWhen I'm visiting Japan I don't have to "probe" them. It es enough to take some pictures and leave. Like Star Trek, maybe they had some guidelines on their journey to us that stopped them from interfering with the history of our planet. And maybe they didn't even need our resources or "probe" the entire universe in the first place, because they invented a new way to create materials directly out of matter and anti-matter, without the hassle of mining the universe. The 'self-replicating probe' factor is just a theory by a human scientist from earth. Just because evolution may happen someplace else, that doesn't have to imply that all intelligent life ticks and reasons ultimately the same. Everything is just a big 'if this than that' logic, where every part of the theory can be trashed. Until now the human race can only reason with our own brain. More advanced life forms could reason with endlessly intelligent A.I. and could come to completely different conclusions. For example if it is a good strategy to visit or be detected by primitive animal life forms like us. Maybe they want just obverse us, like Bostrom mentioned.