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Ninja IDE: written in Python for Pythonists
- gfosco 14y agoAs soon as I see the words "cross-platform" on an IDE, I'm no longer interested. Looks really nice though, they did a good job with branding.
- mjs7231 14y agoThis is a very strange reason not to like a product. Care to elaborate why?
- gfosco 14y agoOh, the old saying "Write once, run crappily everywhere." See the other comments already talking about it crashing or having weird behavior. It's something I've come to after many years of trying cross-platform apps that involve a GUI... They are almost all terrible. I hope the group who agrees with me is cancelling out all the down-votes I got for expressing a valid & common opinion. :)
- e1ven 14y agoIn this case, it runs using X11 on OSX, which is a terrible way of making software ;)
- johnobrien1010 14y agoAm I the only one who uses PyDev?
- reinhardt 14y agoNo we're not.
- e1ven 14y agoI had bad experiences with Eclipse back years and years ago, but I'll try it again. It looks like there's a new release (Juno?)- That seems like a decent starting point.
- aleyan 14y agoOne of the few. I am a PyDev user, but I have been migrating toward using ipython notebook for development and saving the code into .py files when I need to run in production. PyDev gets used to debug the resultant code when something goes wrong. PyDev seems to heavy to me when you need to write a standalone script and too buggy at evaluating module dependencies resulting in bad tooltips. Ipython notebook doesn't have this problem because you evaluate code as you develop, so tooltips come from object introspection.
- johnobrien1010 14y agoI agree about module dependency tooltips. I'm happy to hear I'm not the only one.
- pacoverdi 14y agoPyDev user here too. Although I don't use it directly anymore but through Aptana. It works out of the box and also supports javascript/html/css/... so is ideal for developing webapps with a python backend. Ninja looks nice, but nothing I saw in the screencast makes me want to make the jump.
- pacoverdi 14y ago
- bitwize 14y agoThere's no such thing as a cross-platform GUI layer that doesn't suck. Qt comes the closest, and it has all sorts of platform-specific hacks in it, some even visible at the API level. If you're going to be writing something that's used as frequently and intensively as an IDE, then it had BETTER conform to the user interface guidelines of whatever OS it's running on. Those differ on Windows or Mac, and Linux doesn't really have any.
- aroman 14y agoI definitely agree with your thoughts on this, but I guess I wanted to add that Linux most definitely _does_ have human interface guidelines -- they're just not the same for every flavor of Linux under the sun. Granted a lot of Linux apps tend to be "cross-environment", or just cross-platform in general, so it's less obvious than on Mac, for example. But GNOME definitely has them[1], and newer projects which have dedicated themselves to a really solid HIG are gaining a lot of traction[2]. [1] http://developer.gnome.org/hig-book/stable/ http://developer.gnome.org/hig-book/stable/ [2] http://elementaryos.org/docs/human-interface-guidelines http://elementaryos.org/docs/human-interface-guidelines I guess the issue comes down to more people needing to _care_ about them :)
- Derbasti 14y agoI used to think so, too. But then, IDEs and developers are kind of special. IDEs are mostly just big rectangles full of text, which are eminently platform independant. Developers are special in that that we are very used to staring at terminals and logs, and are very accustomed to work with colored but unformatted text. Also, workflows tend to be very similar, across platforms and environments. So that leaves us with not much reason for platform dependance, and thus Eclipse, Emacs/Vim/etc., and terminals. Even Visual Studio sports many things, but a native look is not among them. I guess XCode is the only really platform-dependant IDE I know. All the others could just as well run on different platforms or even do so. So, umm, I respectfully disagree.
- smacktoward 14y agoI can't speak for gfosco, but my guess would be that it's because in IDE-land "cross-platform" frequently means "written in Java" (as with Eclipse, NetBeans, etc.), with all the performance issues and not-quite-perfect platform look and feel that implies.
- deleted 14y ago[deleted]
- pbreit 14y agoYou really can't think of any reasons why a person would suspect a cross-platform IDE to be a waste of time? I stupidly downloaded the 141MB only to find out it requires X11 (ugh) on a Mac which isn't even included in MacOS anymore (yuck). Delete.
- kghose 14y agoIt is FOSS (GPLv3). The license information was a wee bit hard to find (Wayyy down on the about page http://ninja-ide.org/about/ http://ninja-ide.org/about/) and I first thought it was some frankenstein freemuim product where you had to apply for a free license if you were an OSS devel (like PyCharm) etc. etc. I gave it a whirl: 1. Snappy, which is nice, since PyCharm can be sluggish on my Mac 2. No VCS integration 3. By default very strict code checking is turned on, which turns my (functional) code into a sea of underlines, which is not so pretty It looks to be an interesting start, but it will need VCS integration before it looks suitable as a PyCharm replacement. I didn't look in detail at code completion/code assist, which PyCharm does very well.
- masklinn 14y ago> I didn't look in detail at code completion/code assist, which PyCharm does very well. Also various refactorings (both refactoring-refactorings and smaller rewriting which PyCharm/IntelliJ calls "intentions")
- fmoralesc 14y agoIt has bazaar and git plugins (check the Addins menu).
- vvpan 14y agoI would rather have developers work on the IDE than make yet another GUI interface for Git. You have the command line for that.
- ninetax 14y agoIt would be great to see some screen shots.
- wsc981 14y agoYep, I was quite annoyed when browsing to their site that I can't find any screenshots at all. And as someone mentioned, a video would be nice as well. I'm a bit reluctant to download an app with so little information except from a sparse bit of text.
- indiecore 14y agoNice, it would be good to have some screenshots and stuff though, I'll definitely check it out.
- unohoo 14y agoWhat would really help is a small demo video just to get a whiff of what the IDE feels like. The description and screenshots are somehow not enough for me to download and install an entire IDE and take a test drive. If there is a demo video somewhere, my apologies - I was not able to find it.
- tonylampada 14y agoThere's one on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDlWk_Z7JPQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDlWk_Z7JPQ
- reledi 14y agoIt's also a year old.
- gatox 14y agoWe don't have tutorials yet, but you could take a look at a couple of videos about Code Completion in NINJA-IDE: http://youtu.be/xCqiOEXfZd4 http://youtu.be/xCqiOEXfZd4 http://youtu.be/auVJF44XSnM http://youtu.be/auVJF44XSnM http://youtu.be/tA_BJBLdduQ http://youtu.be/tA_BJBLdduQ
- rxc178 14y agoThis is nice, but one quick question, why's the windows installer in spanish?
- briancurtin 14y agoMost (all?) of the team is based in Argentina. I'll bring it up to one of the devs (a coworker).
- gatox 14y agoYes, as Brian mentioned, most of the team is from argentina, as the windows packager, we already take care of that for the next release.
- rxc178 14y agoThats cool, its not a problem. I really like the tool though, great job!
- buster 14y agoWow.. how did this not make it to HN before? Already version 2.1.1 and never heard of it?
- recuter 14y agoSomething something second system syndrome, just use vim/emacs/sublime. 'etc.
- hoka 14y agoI'll definitely give it a shot. From a usability perspective, your download button could be better. It doesn't download right away (which is fine), but redirects to downloads/win for me. Might be nice to have it auto-scroll to the win downloads since it took me a while to figure out what was going on. Here's a screenshot from Win7 32-bit: http://i.imgur.com/2RT6u.png http://i.imgur.com/2RT6u.png That random pink line makes it unusable for me.
- aaronbrethorst 14y agoIt looks like that delimits an 80 char width.
- kstenerud 14y agoPretty cool all around, but it needs a lot more stability work. It crashed a few times just scrolling around in some of my python projects, and there are quirks such as complaining "This font can not be used in this editor" if I open the font selector and then click "Cancel". Also, changing the margin line doesn't seem to take effect unless you quit and restart the IDE.
- kstenerud 14y agoAfter a few hours use I'll definitely say the robustness is not there :( I can't use it for more than 10 minutes without it crashing, which is a shame because it looks really nice.
- silasb 14y agoIs this based on QT Creator?
- stevoski 14y agoHow does this compare to PyCharm?
- ecaroth 14y agoI'm wondering the exact same thing.
- jra101 14y agoWould be nice to be able to selectively disable some PEP 8 rules in the style checker. I don't care about lines longer than 80 characters and I don't like separating functions by two empty lines.
- Derbasti 14y agoBut, PEP8, man. It's the LAW! /kidding
- Luyt 14y agoYes, and no: from the PEP8 style guide: (my emphasis) "Consistency with this style guide is important. Consistency within a project is more important. Consistency within one module or function is most important. But most importantly: know when to be inconsistent -- sometimes the style guide just doesn't apply."
- nirvanatikku 14y agoCrashed while scrolling =( Was curious, but can't see myself moving away from PyCharm/Sublime.
- misleading_name 14y agoDitto.
- yuvadam 14y agoDon't know about the IDE but that font is horrendous.
- jlujan 14y agoOn mountain lion, it requires X11. Not sure why as my PyQT apps do not.
- endtime 14y agoHaving very recently switched to Sublime Text 2 (from Komodo Edit), I'm curious if this offers anything that can't be done with Sublime + mature existing plugins...?
- camus 14y agoI use python with sublime text 2 which is great but not as great as eclipse with the python plugin. I'm learning django right now and even with the code intel , it is hard to discover the api without going to the doc. ST2 is blazing fast ,but sometimes a more heavier ide is better ( and i can launch manage.py shell from eclise which is top notch )
- Derbasti 14y agoDoes ST2 have a REPL? (This is no value statement. I honestly want to know.)
- heartbreak 14y agoYes. View >> Show Console.
- isxek 14y agoThere's also a separate ST2 package called SublimeREPL that supports other languages (https://github.com/wuub/SublimeREPL https://github.com/wuub/SublimeREPL).
- zdanozdan 14y agowhats wrong with emacs ?
- hack_edu 14y agoApples, meet oranges.
- Derbasti 14y agoNothing at all. Emacs is wonderful. But that says nothing at all about Ninja.
- martinced 14y agoThe thing wrong with Emacs is that not enough people know Lisp / elisp / CL well enough to enhance Emacs and hence prefer to create new "non programmable editors" instead of enhancing Emacs : ( As a long time Emacs user this saddens me a lot.
- kstenerud 14y agoSome people just want a specialized tool for a particular job, rather than a swiss army knife that requires a lot of fiddling and presents you with a ton of stuff you can't use for your current task.
- zlapper 14y agoAs others have already mentioned, PEP8 validation is enable by default, which is a little excessive in my opinion (specially with the line < 80 chars rule). It would be great to be able to disable individual rules, a la Ecliplse/Netbeans. All in all it looks very nice, thanks for sharing.
- mikle 14y agoI think that we as an industry need to drop the 80 char per line rule.
- mgrouchy 14y agoI don't. I have a fairly large screen (27inch cinema display) and use Vim. 80 Character lines are perfect. They look nicer, are easy to read (in the same way books are easy to read when lines are not super long) and with vim can accommodate ~4 split windows side by side which is useful.
- wildranter 14y agoNo, we shouldn't. It's about just the right line length to mate reading a lot easier. Take a look at this to see what I mean [1]. Another thing, one liners are great, and I love them too. But they don't hurt only readability. [1] http://desktoppub.about.com/cs/finetypography/ht/line_length.htm http://desktoppub.about.com/cs/finetypography/ht/line_length...
- sho_hn 14y agoCan someone explain to me why this is at the top of the front page despite a website devoid of useful detail, while this completely fails to catch on: http://scummos.blogspot.de/2012/11/kdev-python-14-stable-released.html http://scummos.blogspot.de/2012/11/kdev-python-14-stable-rel... (Seriously, check it out - KDevelop's Python plugin and Microsoft's PTVS are currently the two projects doing serious work on static analysis of Python for live editing purposes. Here's a nice subthread comparing the two: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4725634 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4725634)
- streptomycin 14y agoI'd guess it's due to KDE's general lack of popularity. Typically, nothing done under the KDE umbrella gets noticed.
- sho_hn 14y agoI'm going to guess you're based in the US, because the two big Linux desktop camps are indeed somewhat split along the continents as far as mindshare goes. Makes me wonder about the exact breakdown by geographical area of the HN readership :).
- Kliment 14y agoI'm not based in the US and I rarely see people use KDE compared to other Linux DEs
- klearvue 14y agoAgainst your anecdotal evidence I'll present a somewhat less anecdotal evidence in the fact that KDE was voted best desktop environment in the last annual LinuxQuestions members choice awards. Clearly people voting for it are the ones using it, don't you think?
- streptomycin 14y ago
- DodgyEggplant 14y agoWing IDE is great
- xyzzy123 14y ago"Me too". I've tried many Python IDEs, settled down with Wing IDE. The one feature I truly love in that IDE is "debug probe". Once you breakpoint (or hit an unhandled exception), you can walk up and down the call stack and evaluate arbitrary expressions in any frame. SO handy.
- btipling 14y agoIt can't seem to create or open JavaScript files. How does one use it with Django?
- shill 14y agoI am already extremely satisfied with PyCharm. I'll keep an eye on this though. Being able to write plugins in Python is promising.
- masukomi 14y agoam i the only one who's really wishing there were some real screenshots to check out before downloading the thing?
- spindritf 14y ago"For Ubuntu Users: You can add the NINJA-IDE PPA and install it from there (you will get automatic updates!)" http://ninja-ide.org/downloads/ http://ninja-ide.org/downloads/ Thank you.
- gatox 14y agoHello, I'm part of the NINJA-IDE Team, and first to all, I would like to thank everyone for the feedback (good ones, as much as bad). Currently we are working to make NINJA-IDE compatible with Python3 (among other features) and taking care of several issues to ensure better stability (and guide the development process with tests). I hope we can find the time to take care of some of the stuff mentioned here as videos, screenshots, user guide, etc. It's a lot of work, but we are proud of what we can achieve with a free software project. Thx everyone!
- ketralnis 14y agoI realise these are at first blush, but: * Scrolling is way too slow. This isn't nitpicking, this is really very important to me * I like PEP8 warnings and use them in other editors, but I don't like not being able to pick which style stuff I care about * I don't like the PEP8 tooltips. They cover up my code and that's the worst possible place to put them. Even if I do plan to "fix" the issue, coming up over the code that I'm typing right now is never okay. * It's really quite a lot of work through some confusing terminology to get a test run of the IDE going on an existing project. I don't want to move my code into your workspace. I don't want to import my existing project (that sounds scary) * Some glaring bugs seem to indicate that this is more young than is indicated on the very flashy project site. For instance, if I try to import a project but cancel the "select a directory" popup, I inconsistently get it either removing my previous selection or crashing the whole IDE
- mikle 14y agoI hate to be that guy, but after almost a decade doing Python one thing I learned is that we prefer Pythonista, not Pythonist.
- mememememememe 14y agoBut then.... there is PyCharm which is more solid and well-supported. IDE or not depends on your application. For me, even doing Django stuff, I use VIM all the time on the terminal. No GUI. Well, I use a desktop version of Ubuntu. Fine....
- pablosanta 14y agoIt keeps crashing on me. I'm on Lion. :( Looks good though. I thought it was going to be YET ANOTHER ECLIPSE distribution, but apparently it's not. It seems to be pretty fast. Hope they fix the crashing issue on Lion soon.
- neil_s 14y agoThe name of the IDE emphasizes that its not just yet another IDE, and yet I don't see anything new here, or any difference from existing IDEs, other than heavy Python support.
- veeti 14y agoAlthough vim has almost completely sucked me in already, does this thing have support for 1) separate indentation settings for different file formats and 2) separate indentation settings for different "projects"? I've been looking forever for a text editor that does this and surprisingly few do.
- jarito 14y agoThe IntelliJ family of PyCharm, RubyMine and WebStorm can do this.
- amishforkfight 14y agoConfirmed -- I've used WebStorm and it's derivative PHPStorm for several years, they are excellent IDEs.
- azinman2 14y agoTried it out on existing code. Was complaining that spacing wasn't a multiple of 4, when I set it to 2 spaces in the prefs. I even reloaded it and verified the setting. Back to Sublime!
- adamrt 14y agoI don't use this editor but I can almost guarantee that its actually pep8 complaining about spaces. Not that this solves your problem but there is a disconnect between editor configuration and pep8. Side note: Hope you use 4 spaces on new projects! :)
- jotaass 14y agoJust tried it. Looks nice but a bit lacking on the code completion, i think. Maybe I need to give it another chance. Also, I think would be nice if there was a way to interact with the console after running a script. I realize this may be sort of an odd request, but it is very convenient when you're not quite sure on how you want to solve a problem, and you need to try out some solutions interactively. I greatly enjoy this in spyder, my current python ide of choice.
- dmd 14y agoCrashes on launch for me.
- jsilence 14y agosame here
- gruuby 14y agoI cannot use an IDE that doesn't feature a vi mode for the editor. I'd be very, very lost. I'm yet to find an IDE that doesn't get in my way, vi mode or not.
- datashaman 14y agoQT toolkit. urgh...
- Bullshituserid 14y agoThe term is "plug-in", not "plugin".
- pacman128 14y agoTried it out on Windows. Was liking it, but then discovered that it is converting my files to UNIX format when saving them on Windows!
- ezolotko 14y agoTried it on Windows. Why it is never a commercial-grade UI in projects like this? Why it is not like Idea? Why it is not like Visual Studio? Why it is still glitchy, blinky, brogrammer-art thing?
- wcoenen 14y agoMy experience when I tried it on Windows 7: 0) Downloaded and installed it. For some reason the installer was in Spanish. Launched the IDE itself. Fortunately it was in English. 1) clicked file - new project, selected python, named it "test" 2) tried to type the project location, it wouldn't let me. Selected the project location via the "Examine..." button instead. (The filesystem browser launched in program files instead of my home folder.) 3) typed print("hello world") in __init__.py 4) hit F6 to run. This doesn't seem to do anything except pop up a save dialog. The only output I get is "Failed to start" with no further indication of what is wrong. Chosing a "main file" in the project properties didn't seem to make any difference. I don't know how to make this thing execute code.
- rplnt 14y ago> I don't know how to make this thing execute code. This happens to me basically in every IDE, with every language. I somehow got used to the fact that IDE requires some maintenance prior to working with it. I guess it shouldn't be the case but it is my (limited) experience.
- misleading_name 14y agoLooks pretty, but I opened a 200 line python file on Mountain Lion and it crashed after 30 seconds. Also the scrolling was annoyingly "jumpy".... just not smooth.