4 ms·

Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows, not necessarily the hardware. I get it they want to stop the MacBook Pro, but: Windows is slow for no reason; it co

Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows, not necessarily the hardware. I get it they want to stop the MacBook Pro, but: Windows is slow for no reason; it collects everything it can about the user; takes screenshots of whatever the user is doing; has ads - even though you pay for the OS; drivers are still a mess; hardware is made by different companies and no actual proper integration like Apple does. I could go on, but like someone here said: you have to pay me a hefty sum to use a Windows portable device ever again.

Npovview 4mo ago
Similarly on the higher end, I want to run linux on Apple Macbook laptops.
- ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
  Isn't there Asahi Linux that boots on Apple Silicon? Never tried it, but people here on HN mention it from time to time.
  - nbf_1995 4mo ago
    There is but it lags behind the latest apple hardware. Asahi only supports M1, M2, and alpha support for M3. Not that I blame them for the lag, there's a lot of reversing work because apple doesn't document this stuff.
- rafaelmn 4mo ago
  Leave the drivers/power management to the optimized OS and do your work in VM ?
  - fsflover 4mo ago
    This will not save you from things like this: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application (twitter.com/lapcatsoftware) 2603 points by mattsolle on Nov 12, 2020 | 1292 comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25074959 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25074959
- jjtheblunt 4mo ago
  I do this nonstop using the UTM app in Apple Silicon virtualization, not QEMU, mode. I've done this from M2, M2 Max, and M5 machines, it basically wraps the hypervisor.framework (or the current name) and i had used Asahi on an M1 before that. With UTM wrapping hypervisor.framework, i have a complete fullscreen desktop running Linux (i use fedora earlier but Arch the last several months) with full graphics as if it were on a dedicated host. Because it's running in an Apple Silicon hypervisor, i have macos tahoe running concurrently on separate desktops: no dual booting unlike when i was using Asahi. I haven't looked to see if i can access graphics hardware directly or if it's hidden behind a virtio layer in UTM's wrapping of the hypervisor.framewirk.
  - gigatexal 4mo ago
    It’s surprisingly good to do with full screen and the Apple hvm is very nice. Don’t let the experimental tag scare you.
  - OsrsNeedsf2P 4mo ago
    Are you able to play Steam games?
    - mswphd 4mo ago
      posted as a sibling to your comment, but you'd likely be interested in https://scottjg.com/posts/2026-05-05-egpu-mac-gaming/ https://scottjg.com/posts/2026-05-05-egpu-mac-gaming/
    - jjtheblunt 4mo ago
      never tried so I don't know. it's easy for you to fire it up and try though
    - musicale 4mo ago
      You can play 64-bit macOS Steam games using ... Steam for macOS. This works fine (at least until they kill Rosetta2), though you are still translating x86. And most Windows Steam games (32- or 64-bit) via Crossover. (Expect about half the frame rate of a native ARM/Metal port at the same settings.) But you may be asking whether you can run Proton well in a Linux VM. I think it would depend on having a good Vulkan implementation that works well with a hardware GPU, so I expect the answer is yes with an eGPU, no with the internal GPU.
troupo 4mo ago
> Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows, not necessarily the hardware. Thing is, MacOS was heading the same way until the new chips saved it. The last few versions that were still running on Intel shouldn't have been as slow as they were. Software is going to shit everywhere, it's just there's now M* equivalent for Windows and Intel. All that to say: yes, I think you're spot on, the problem is sowftware, not hardware.
- ryandrake 4mo ago
  More specifically, the problem is software that the user has less and less control of every year. We have no control over the bloat Apple and Microsoft perpetually add to their operating systems. We just have to take it, or hardware and ecosystem leave us behind. I wouldn't mind Windows if it were easy to rein it in, if I had granular control over what updates get applied and what gets trashed, and the ability to opt-out of updates. I wouldn't mind macOS if I could more easily control the UI bloat, preinstalled apps, and hundreds of background daemons/processes that are running that I never asked for. I want to take my Operating Systems back to 2009 and have a version of Windows 7 and OSX Snow Leopard that runs on my modern computers and have all 3rd party apps work on those operating systems. Or, just install Linux.
- troupo 4mo ago
  s/it's just there's now M* equivalent for Windows and Intel/it's just there's no M* equivalent for Windows and Intel (no instead of now)
- elxr 4mo ago
  Apple is lucky so many talented devs have built alternatives and fixes for the sorry state of factory MacOS. The settings app, the finder app, spotlight, the general lack of innovation are just a few things that really should've been fixed about a trillion dollars ago. It's gotten to the point that I've switched to omarchy and somehow this tiling-only, arch based distro, with big changes every ~2 months is still more sensible and just gets out my way better than MacOS in early 2026. Don't think Windows is unique in having their long-time users being unhappy with them. MacOS really isn't any different.
zamadatix 4mo ago
It's a bit of column A and a bit of column B. Of laptops I'd like to run Windows on, I'd definitely choose the latest MacBook. Of reasons I don't run Windows on all of my desktop hardware, it's mostly because it's loaded with bullshit.
- elxr 4mo ago
  > the latest MacBook Which one? Outside the macbook pro 16, almost every other macbook has pretty reasonable competition now. At least hardware wise, and excluding the raw single-thread performance of the SoC. On the windows laptop side, the zephyrus g14 and g16 (among others) are honestly just as nice as what Apple sells on the high-end. And better in certain ways, like the keyboards.
  - ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
    > Outside the macbook pro 16, almost every other macbook has pretty reasonable competition now. It depends on how you look at it. I've been a happy Air user since the launch of the M2 air. I did not find any Windows laptop comparable in build quality to match it. Not to mention performance. It is not a bash on Windows per se, but on the hardware manufacturers that make crappy plasticky laptops that bend wildly. And don't get me started on display quality.
    - elxr 4mo ago
      The display quality of a 14 inch 1800p oled at 120Hz (asus, lenovo, dell all offer this) is honestly a league above the 60Hz IPS panel the air has had for way too long now. In response time, vibrance, smoothness, contrast ratio, and even display size at the same overall weight. This year, you're starting to see tandem oleds too, which are even better than those. Do some more research, and don't just blindly regurgitate statements. Display quality?? That's the one thing macbook airs have lost out on for many generations at this point.
      - ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
giancarlostoro 4mo ago
I've stopped using Windows as a Microsoft fanboy (I use C# to put bread on my table). I loved Windows, I think it peaked at 8 (yeah I know, unpopular take!) because 10 started out niceish, but went downhill and has been going downhill since, and Windows 11 is similar, just downhill to the max. I wish Microsoft would separate their marketing shenanigans from Windows more drastically and stop requiring online accounts. My OS should be able to fully install and function without any internet, and continue to do so. I'll default to buying Macs and Linux first systems instead. I do hope these new Nvidia laptops see Linux flavors, I'd love to buy one. Maybe System 76 might build one? Not sure.
- dijit 4mo ago
  > I think it peaked at 8 Practically every benchmark agrees with you, aside from the Metro start menu, it was solid.
  - 1attice 4mo ago
    I am old enough to declare it peaked with Windows 2000, which was mercifully a version of NT that crashed less and had a UI that was intended for serious use, rather than consumer market thrills. Which is why it was on the market so briefly. Every commit since has been for the bottom line, not the user.
    - cobbaut 4mo ago
      NT 4.0 did not crash that often if you rebooted it weekly (not uncommon at the time). And it had a simpler menu. But I agree about W2000 being peak Windows.
      - rvnx 4mo ago
        Same with iOS 18, "Windows 2000" was great, then Apple went downhill with iOS 26 "Windows ME"
- quintu5 4mo ago
  You're the first person I've seen call out 10 as going downhill. What were your complaints about 10? I migrated to macOS for development years ago and going back to Windows for development always felt gross, but I never had any issues with windows for entertainment/general productivity workflows. It's only once I tried 11 that I noped out for everything other than use as a Steam launcher.
game_the0ry 4mo ago
> Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows... You're not a hater, windows is hot garbage. Windows is so damaged a this point, both in terms of rep and functionality, that microsoft might as well start form scratch with linux as the kernel. I am not even joking. And fire every mba that ever influenced the product.
- patates 4mo ago
  I'm pretty sure if they threw the Windows 7 source in a room with a mighty (sufficiently advanced) LLM, the only instruction being "make this better, make no mistakes" (as in the meme), it'd still be better than the current Win11 situation. This thing is horribly broken. At least with LLMs, I get a "you're absolutely right" when I complain.
delfinom 4mo ago
> hardware is made by different companies and no actual proper integration like Apple does This is literally a Microsoft made hardware product which is extra integrated with Windows.
- ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
  To be picky, it is Nvidia made hardware with Windows bolted on top. And who knows how many other hardware components whose drivers are shipped by their respective manufacturers. I wouldn't hold my breath on the quality of the final software product and user experience.
dayvid 4mo ago
[dead]
thewebguyd 4mo ago
Microsoft knows this. Just now at the BUILD keynote they showed off some kind of dev edition of Windows that didn't have the widgets and crap, they're shipping coreutils (uutils) in windows, improving the terminal, etc. It's too late, I think they should have done all of this a really long time ago, but at least they see that they are bleeding mind and marketshare and recognize why.
sitzkrieg 4mo ago
windows 10 LTSC has none of these problems and every software i use on it runs faster than on my 2023 mac. but decruddibg up your install , which is a 5 minute and massgravel away, is only valid from one direction for apple fanboys
fmajid 4mo ago
I ordered a ThinkPad about a year ago, and removing Windows 11 Pro from the configurator saved me a cool £110 ($150). Despite this ridiculous overpricing, the surprising thing is, Windows isn't even in the top 5 businesses at Microsoft any more, even Xbox makes more money.

Npovview 4mo ago

Similarly on the higher end, I want to run linux on Apple Macbook laptops.

ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
Isn't there Asahi Linux that boots on Apple Silicon? Never tried it, but people here on HN mention it from time to time.
- nbf_1995 4mo ago
  There is but it lags behind the latest apple hardware. Asahi only supports M1, M2, and alpha support for M3. Not that I blame them for the lag, there's a lot of reversing work because apple doesn't document this stuff.
rafaelmn 4mo ago
Leave the drivers/power management to the optimized OS and do your work in VM ?
- fsflover 4mo ago
  This will not save you from things like this: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application (twitter.com/lapcatsoftware) 2603 points by mattsolle on Nov 12, 2020 | 1292 comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25074959 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25074959
jjtheblunt 4mo ago
I do this nonstop using the UTM app in Apple Silicon virtualization, not QEMU, mode. I've done this from M2, M2 Max, and M5 machines, it basically wraps the hypervisor.framework (or the current name) and i had used Asahi on an M1 before that. With UTM wrapping hypervisor.framework, i have a complete fullscreen desktop running Linux (i use fedora earlier but Arch the last several months) with full graphics as if it were on a dedicated host. Because it's running in an Apple Silicon hypervisor, i have macos tahoe running concurrently on separate desktops: no dual booting unlike when i was using Asahi. I haven't looked to see if i can access graphics hardware directly or if it's hidden behind a virtio layer in UTM's wrapping of the hypervisor.framewirk.
- gigatexal 4mo ago
  It’s surprisingly good to do with full screen and the Apple hvm is very nice. Don’t let the experimental tag scare you.
- OsrsNeedsf2P 4mo ago
  Are you able to play Steam games?
  - mswphd 4mo ago
    posted as a sibling to your comment, but you'd likely be interested in https://scottjg.com/posts/2026-05-05-egpu-mac-gaming/ https://scottjg.com/posts/2026-05-05-egpu-mac-gaming/
  - jjtheblunt 4mo ago
    never tried so I don't know. it's easy for you to fire it up and try though
  - musicale 4mo ago
    You can play 64-bit macOS Steam games using ... Steam for macOS. This works fine (at least until they kill Rosetta2), though you are still translating x86. And most Windows Steam games (32- or 64-bit) via Crossover. (Expect about half the frame rate of a native ARM/Metal port at the same settings.) But you may be asking whether you can run Proton well in a Linux VM. I think it would depend on having a good Vulkan implementation that works well with a hardware GPU, so I expect the answer is yes with an eGPU, no with the internal GPU.

troupo 4mo ago

> Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows, not necessarily the hardware. Thing is, MacOS was heading the same way until the new chips saved it. The last few versions that were still running on Intel shouldn't have been as slow as they were. Software is going to shit everywhere, it's just there's now M* equivalent for Windows and Intel. All that to say: yes, I think you're spot on, the problem is sowftware, not hardware.

ryandrake 4mo ago
More specifically, the problem is software that the user has less and less control of every year. We have no control over the bloat Apple and Microsoft perpetually add to their operating systems. We just have to take it, or hardware and ecosystem leave us behind. I wouldn't mind Windows if it were easy to rein it in, if I had granular control over what updates get applied and what gets trashed, and the ability to opt-out of updates. I wouldn't mind macOS if I could more easily control the UI bloat, preinstalled apps, and hundreds of background daemons/processes that are running that I never asked for. I want to take my Operating Systems back to 2009 and have a version of Windows 7 and OSX Snow Leopard that runs on my modern computers and have all 3rd party apps work on those operating systems. Or, just install Linux.
troupo 4mo ago
s/it's just there's now M* equivalent for Windows and Intel/it's just there's no M* equivalent for Windows and Intel (no instead of now)
elxr 4mo ago
Apple is lucky so many talented devs have built alternatives and fixes for the sorry state of factory MacOS. The settings app, the finder app, spotlight, the general lack of innovation are just a few things that really should've been fixed about a trillion dollars ago. It's gotten to the point that I've switched to omarchy and somehow this tiling-only, arch based distro, with big changes every ~2 months is still more sensible and just gets out my way better than MacOS in early 2026. Don't think Windows is unique in having their long-time users being unhappy with them. MacOS really isn't any different.

zamadatix 4mo ago

It's a bit of column A and a bit of column B. Of laptops I'd like to run Windows on, I'd definitely choose the latest MacBook. Of reasons I don't run Windows on all of my desktop hardware, it's mostly because it's loaded with bullshit.

elxr 4mo ago
> the latest MacBook Which one? Outside the macbook pro 16, almost every other macbook has pretty reasonable competition now. At least hardware wise, and excluding the raw single-thread performance of the SoC. On the windows laptop side, the zephyrus g14 and g16 (among others) are honestly just as nice as what Apple sells on the high-end. And better in certain ways, like the keyboards.
- ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
  > Outside the macbook pro 16, almost every other macbook has pretty reasonable competition now. It depends on how you look at it. I've been a happy Air user since the launch of the M2 air. I did not find any Windows laptop comparable in build quality to match it. Not to mention performance. It is not a bash on Windows per se, but on the hardware manufacturers that make crappy plasticky laptops that bend wildly. And don't get me started on display quality.
  - elxr 4mo ago
    The display quality of a 14 inch 1800p oled at 120Hz (asus, lenovo, dell all offer this) is honestly a league above the 60Hz IPS panel the air has had for way too long now. In response time, vibrance, smoothness, contrast ratio, and even display size at the same overall weight. This year, you're starting to see tandem oleds too, which are even better than those. Do some more research, and don't just blindly regurgitate statements. Display quality?? That's the one thing macbook airs have lost out on for many generations at this point.
    - ExoticPearTree 4mo ago

giancarlostoro 4mo ago

I've stopped using Windows as a Microsoft fanboy (I use C# to put bread on my table). I loved Windows, I think it peaked at 8 (yeah I know, unpopular take!) because 10 started out niceish, but went downhill and has been going downhill since, and Windows 11 is similar, just downhill to the max. I wish Microsoft would separate their marketing shenanigans from Windows more drastically and stop requiring online accounts. My OS should be able to fully install and function without any internet, and continue to do so. I'll default to buying Macs and Linux first systems instead. I do hope these new Nvidia laptops see Linux flavors, I'd love to buy one. Maybe System 76 might build one? Not sure.

dijit 4mo ago
> I think it peaked at 8 Practically every benchmark agrees with you, aside from the Metro start menu, it was solid.
- 1attice 4mo ago
  I am old enough to declare it peaked with Windows 2000, which was mercifully a version of NT that crashed less and had a UI that was intended for serious use, rather than consumer market thrills. Which is why it was on the market so briefly. Every commit since has been for the bottom line, not the user.
  - cobbaut 4mo ago
    NT 4.0 did not crash that often if you rebooted it weekly (not uncommon at the time). And it had a simpler menu. But I agree about W2000 being peak Windows.
    - rvnx 4mo ago
      Same with iOS 18, "Windows 2000" was great, then Apple went downhill with iOS 26 "Windows ME"
quintu5 4mo ago
You're the first person I've seen call out 10 as going downhill. What were your complaints about 10? I migrated to macOS for development years ago and going back to Windows for development always felt gross, but I never had any issues with windows for entertainment/general productivity workflows. It's only once I tried 11 that I noped out for everything other than use as a Steam launcher.

game_the0ry 4mo ago

> Call me a hater, but the problem is Windows... You're not a hater, windows is hot garbage. Windows is so damaged a this point, both in terms of rep and functionality, that microsoft might as well start form scratch with linux as the kernel. I am not even joking. And fire every mba that ever influenced the product.

patates 4mo ago
I'm pretty sure if they threw the Windows 7 source in a room with a mighty (sufficiently advanced) LLM, the only instruction being "make this better, make no mistakes" (as in the meme), it'd still be better than the current Win11 situation. This thing is horribly broken. At least with LLMs, I get a "you're absolutely right" when I complain.

delfinom 4mo ago

> hardware is made by different companies and no actual proper integration like Apple does This is literally a Microsoft made hardware product which is extra integrated with Windows.

ExoticPearTree 4mo ago
To be picky, it is Nvidia made hardware with Windows bolted on top. And who knows how many other hardware components whose drivers are shipped by their respective manufacturers. I wouldn't hold my breath on the quality of the final software product and user experience.

dayvid 4mo ago

[dead]

thewebguyd 4mo ago

Microsoft knows this. Just now at the BUILD keynote they showed off some kind of dev edition of Windows that didn't have the widgets and crap, they're shipping coreutils (uutils) in windows, improving the terminal, etc. It's too late, I think they should have done all of this a really long time ago, but at least they see that they are bleeding mind and marketshare and recognize why.

sitzkrieg 4mo ago

windows 10 LTSC has none of these problems and every software i use on it runs faster than on my 2023 mac. but decruddibg up your install , which is a 5 minute and massgravel away, is only valid from one direction for apple fanboys

fmajid 4mo ago

I ordered a ThinkPad about a year ago, and removing Windows 11 Pro from the configurator saved me a cool £110 ($150). Despite this ridiculous overpricing, the surprising thing is, Windows isn't even in the top 5 businesses at Microsoft any more, even Xbox makes more money.