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> Being on the plane doesn't remove your right to free speech While I agree with you that this was obviously a ridiculous overreaction, an air plane is not a p

> Being on the plane doesn't remove your right to free speech While I agree with you that this was obviously a ridiculous overreaction, an air plane is not a public space. It's more akin to being in someones living room in that the pilot has absolute authority over whom to kick out for whatever reason. If they don't like your hair, they can have you escorted out by police if you don't comply. They won't do it normally because it's bad PR and their employer wouldn't like it, but they could. Not free speech amendment violated.

imoverclocked 5mo ago
This. Many people are unaware of just how much authority a captain has; Failing to follow their instructions is (basically) a felony. It's best to just not mess around on an aircraft.
- joxdosba 5mo ago
  Am a pilot, this is totally wrong. PIC authority is strictly limited to in-scope items, this very obviously wasn’t in scope unless it was e.g. causing other passengers to behave in an unruly manner.
  - tefkah 5mo ago
    thanks for clarifying, this whole thread was sounding a bit ridiculous
  - imoverclocked 5mo ago
    The Pilot in Command (PIC) holds absolute, ultimate responsibility and final authority for the operation and safety of the aircraft. Also, in another reply you state, "aircrew has actual legal authority which stems from the fact that they’re aircrew." Do your pilot credentials include an ATP cert?
    - joxdosba 5mo ago
      I’m not sure what point you are trying to make. PIC has authority over things which relate to the operation of the aircraft, yep. The PIC does not get to make a passenger blow him, just like he can’t come read your emails if he feels like it. The PIC might not like a shirt you’re wearing, he can’t make you take it off. >Do your pilot credentials include an ATP cert? I’m lacking on the 1500 hours, but other than that, yeah.
      - imoverclocked 5mo ago
        > I’m lacking on the 1500 hours, but other than that, yeah. Hmm. So by, "yeah," you mean, "no." > The PIC does not get to make a passenger blow him, just like he can’t come read your emails if he feels like it. Straw man much? A captain of a 121-op is not going to get on the intercom and ask for this ... and expect to keep their job. Given that most people don't know where the line is drawn, there is an expectation that you do need to follow all directions. There are definitely directions that, if not followed, result in committing a felony. The other side of the expectation is that of professionalism on behalf of the crew: Google "professionalism" > It is a combination of competence, ethical behavior, and respectful communication. You would do well to consider the effects of this statement before continuing too far past 1500 hours.
        joxdosba 5mo ago
        > Hmm. So by, "yeah," you mean, "no." “Frozen ATPL” is the industry term, and I could never have imagined an adult trying to debate the difference when it comes to theoretical education (hint: it’s the same). > There are definitely directions that, if not followed, result in committing a felony So? Nobody is disputing that! It’s certainly not a felony to disobey directions that are not relevant to flight operations or safety. You’ve utterly failed to communicate what it is that you apparently disagree with me about, instead you’ve just dropped a bunch of unnecessary personal attacks.
        imoverclocked 5mo ago
- jolmg 5mo ago
  It's not about a special status of flight captains. Same can be said of e.g. a store manager acting in-place of the owner. It's a matter of one being on someone's private property, instead of on public property.
  - joxdosba 5mo ago
    Hi, when I was in flight school it wasn’t explicitly stated but certainly heavily implied that as pilots were not allowed to trespass passengers and kick them off the plane mid-flight. If you have information to the contrary, I would like to be made aware because occasionally I have ended up stuck for hours in the air with unpleasant passengers.
    - jolmg 5mo ago
      Was just clarifying GP's general point and not stating anything specific to pilots.
      - joxdosba 5mo ago
        You’re badly wrong, aircrew has actual legal authority which stems from the fact that they’re aircrew. Absolutely nothing to do with private property, especially considering that you can’t trespass people on a plane.

imoverclocked 5mo ago

This. Many people are unaware of just how much authority a captain has; Failing to follow their instructions is (basically) a felony. It's best to just not mess around on an aircraft.

joxdosba 5mo ago
Am a pilot, this is totally wrong. PIC authority is strictly limited to in-scope items, this very obviously wasn’t in scope unless it was e.g. causing other passengers to behave in an unruly manner.
- tefkah 5mo ago
  thanks for clarifying, this whole thread was sounding a bit ridiculous
- imoverclocked 5mo ago
  The Pilot in Command (PIC) holds absolute, ultimate responsibility and final authority for the operation and safety of the aircraft. Also, in another reply you state, "aircrew has actual legal authority which stems from the fact that they’re aircrew." Do your pilot credentials include an ATP cert?
  - joxdosba 5mo ago
    I’m not sure what point you are trying to make. PIC has authority over things which relate to the operation of the aircraft, yep. The PIC does not get to make a passenger blow him, just like he can’t come read your emails if he feels like it. The PIC might not like a shirt you’re wearing, he can’t make you take it off. >Do your pilot credentials include an ATP cert? I’m lacking on the 1500 hours, but other than that, yeah.
    - imoverclocked 5mo ago
      > I’m lacking on the 1500 hours, but other than that, yeah. Hmm. So by, "yeah," you mean, "no." > The PIC does not get to make a passenger blow him, just like he can’t come read your emails if he feels like it. Straw man much? A captain of a 121-op is not going to get on the intercom and ask for this ... and expect to keep their job. Given that most people don't know where the line is drawn, there is an expectation that you do need to follow all directions. There are definitely directions that, if not followed, result in committing a felony. The other side of the expectation is that of professionalism on behalf of the crew: Google "professionalism" > It is a combination of competence, ethical behavior, and respectful communication. You would do well to consider the effects of this statement before continuing too far past 1500 hours.
      - joxdosba 5mo ago
        > Hmm. So by, "yeah," you mean, "no." “Frozen ATPL” is the industry term, and I could never have imagined an adult trying to debate the difference when it comes to theoretical education (hint: it’s the same). > There are definitely directions that, if not followed, result in committing a felony So? Nobody is disputing that! It’s certainly not a felony to disobey directions that are not relevant to flight operations or safety. You’ve utterly failed to communicate what it is that you apparently disagree with me about, instead you’ve just dropped a bunch of unnecessary personal attacks.
        imoverclocked 5mo ago
jolmg 5mo ago
It's not about a special status of flight captains. Same can be said of e.g. a store manager acting in-place of the owner. It's a matter of one being on someone's private property, instead of on public property.
- joxdosba 5mo ago
  Hi, when I was in flight school it wasn’t explicitly stated but certainly heavily implied that as pilots were not allowed to trespass passengers and kick them off the plane mid-flight. If you have information to the contrary, I would like to be made aware because occasionally I have ended up stuck for hours in the air with unpleasant passengers.
  - jolmg 5mo ago
    Was just clarifying GP's general point and not stating anything specific to pilots.
    - joxdosba 5mo ago
      You’re badly wrong, aircrew has actual legal authority which stems from the fact that they’re aircrew. Absolutely nothing to do with private property, especially considering that you can’t trespass people on a plane.