4 ms·

There is a market for an S&P 500 ETF without those companies. I'll immediately switch over

by mohsen1 5mo ago

zzleeper 5mo ago
Let me know if you find one! I'm at a loss. (And even then, if I switch I have to pay $$$ taxes on capital gains)
- _delirium 5mo ago
  Any of the direct indexing providers will let you blacklist individual stocks from the index. The intended use is to exclude stocks you hold elsewhere (or receive as stock grants) to avoid causing wash sales, but it can also be easily used to make a custom "S&P 499".
  - zzleeper 5mo ago
    I'm looking at Schwab (and saw a few others) and couldn't find anything: https://www.schwab.com/learn/story/primer-on-wash-sales https://www.schwab.com/learn/story/primer-on-wash-sales I would assume this is not an ETF but sth else?
    - zparky 5mo ago
      https://www.schwab.com/direct-indexing https://www.schwab.com/direct-indexing
- stouset 5mo ago
  You can sidestep this entirely with a total-market fund like VTSAX/VTI, which hold the entire market and should be more resistant to being gamed. They’re free-float adjusted so entities like SpaceX are valued only by what’s available on public markets. And Vanguard (and its funds) are owned by its investors, which makes it seem implausible that the rules would be rewritten in a way that would damage investors.
  - SilverElfin 5mo ago
    VTI lists fast even before these recent changes as I recall. So it’s more vulnerable, not less.
    - LPisGood 5mo ago
      It may list fast, but it covers many more securities from what I understand so it’s insulated. I think the fact is that any broad market ETF is gonna own at least some piece of a $1 trillion company.
      - felixgallo 5mo ago
        well that's the problem, right? There is no justification for a trillion dollar Elon Musk valuation. And he and his investors know this. That's why they're trying to change the rules to dump the stock while it's irrational on every investor in the world. If they really believed in the value of the company, would they be bribing people to scam the index funds?
        toomuchtodo 5mo ago
        Indeed, it's like robbing a bank while the bank is holding a party. Except its everyone's portfolios who are invested in the index funds with potential exposure in scope. High level, it's concerning to observe this unfold while almost every asset class is at its peak and there is no one willing to purchase (office real estate [1] [2], private equity [3], us equities [4], crypto, etc). Late Stage Capital Markets when you've exhausted greater fools available. [1] Office Real Estate Is Facing ‘a Year of Reckoning’ in 2025 - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-12-18/commercial-real-estate-can-no-longer-ignore-its-problems https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-12-18/commercia... | https://archive.today/fTPSY https://archive.today/fTPSY - December 18, 2024 [2] Blackstone Is About to Take a 54% Loss on Iconic Seattle Tower - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackstone-is-about-to-take-a-54-loss-on-iconic-seattle-tower https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackston... | https://archive.today/fcA8W https://archive.today/fcA8W - May 29, 2026 [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47049024 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47049024 (citations) [4] BlackRock Scales Back Equities After ‘Generational’ Earnings [Peak S&P] - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackrock-scales-back-equities-after-generational-earnings https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackrock... | https://archive.today/lMIcH https://archive.today/lMIcH - May 29th, 2026
rlkf 5mo ago
You probably want an ETF that follows something like the MSCI USA Ex Mega Cap index then: <https://www.msci.com/indexes/index/758086 https://www.msci.com/indexes/index/758086>
fsckboy 5mo ago
you can buy S&P 500, and short the component companies you don't like, but caution, this will achieve the solvency you want, but you will likely remain irrational

There is a market for an S&P 500 ETF without those companies. I'll immediately switch over

by mohsen1 5mo ago

There is a market for an S&P 500 ETF without those companies. I'll immediately switch over

zzleeper 5mo ago

Let me know if you find one! I'm at a loss. (And even then, if I switch I have to pay $$$ taxes on capital gains)

_delirium 5mo ago
Any of the direct indexing providers will let you blacklist individual stocks from the index. The intended use is to exclude stocks you hold elsewhere (or receive as stock grants) to avoid causing wash sales, but it can also be easily used to make a custom "S&P 499".
- zzleeper 5mo ago
  I'm looking at Schwab (and saw a few others) and couldn't find anything: https://www.schwab.com/learn/story/primer-on-wash-sales https://www.schwab.com/learn/story/primer-on-wash-sales I would assume this is not an ETF but sth else?
  - zparky 5mo ago
    https://www.schwab.com/direct-indexing https://www.schwab.com/direct-indexing
stouset 5mo ago
You can sidestep this entirely with a total-market fund like VTSAX/VTI, which hold the entire market and should be more resistant to being gamed. They’re free-float adjusted so entities like SpaceX are valued only by what’s available on public markets. And Vanguard (and its funds) are owned by its investors, which makes it seem implausible that the rules would be rewritten in a way that would damage investors.
- SilverElfin 5mo ago
  VTI lists fast even before these recent changes as I recall. So it’s more vulnerable, not less.
  - LPisGood 5mo ago
    It may list fast, but it covers many more securities from what I understand so it’s insulated. I think the fact is that any broad market ETF is gonna own at least some piece of a $1 trillion company.
    - felixgallo 5mo ago
      well that's the problem, right? There is no justification for a trillion dollar Elon Musk valuation. And he and his investors know this. That's why they're trying to change the rules to dump the stock while it's irrational on every investor in the world. If they really believed in the value of the company, would they be bribing people to scam the index funds?
      - toomuchtodo 5mo ago
        Indeed, it's like robbing a bank while the bank is holding a party. Except its everyone's portfolios who are invested in the index funds with potential exposure in scope. High level, it's concerning to observe this unfold while almost every asset class is at its peak and there is no one willing to purchase (office real estate [1] [2], private equity [3], us equities [4], crypto, etc). Late Stage Capital Markets when you've exhausted greater fools available. [1] Office Real Estate Is Facing ‘a Year of Reckoning’ in 2025 - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-12-18/commercial-real-estate-can-no-longer-ignore-its-problems https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-12-18/commercia... | https://archive.today/fTPSY https://archive.today/fTPSY - December 18, 2024 [2] Blackstone Is About to Take a 54% Loss on Iconic Seattle Tower - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackstone-is-about-to-take-a-54-loss-on-iconic-seattle-tower https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackston... | https://archive.today/fcA8W https://archive.today/fcA8W - May 29, 2026 [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47049024 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47049024 (citations) [4] BlackRock Scales Back Equities After ‘Generational’ Earnings [Peak S&P] - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackrock-scales-back-equities-after-generational-earnings https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-05-29/blackrock... | https://archive.today/lMIcH https://archive.today/lMIcH - May 29th, 2026

rlkf 5mo ago

You probably want an ETF that follows something like the MSCI USA Ex Mega Cap index then: <https://www.msci.com/indexes/index/758086 https://www.msci.com/indexes/index/758086>

fsckboy 5mo ago

you can buy S&P 500, and short the component companies you don't like, but caution, this will achieve the solvency you want, but you will likely remain irrational