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It suggests we need to find cheaper materials from which to build homes.

by pfdietz 5mo ago

toomuchtodo 5mo ago
I’m unsure if this solves the problem. Like childcare, we may need to collectively subsidize housing construction to make it affordable. Example: China. The problem is that the costs of labor and materials from the past are behind us, and there are potentially no material cost and productivity improvements to be had. The costs are the costs and potentially unavoidable.
- why_only_15 5mo ago
  Does China subsidize housing construction? Is your claim something like "China encourages/forces consumers to save at high rates which lowers interest rates and makes there be more construction"?
  - toomuchtodo 5mo ago
    https://www.reuters.com/world/china/key-features-chinas-affordable-housing-policy-2024-06-04/ https://www.reuters.com/world/china/key-features-chinas-affo... https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2666165923001047 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S266616592...
Animats 5mo ago
Most of the world builds low-end homes from reinforced concrete. Most US buyers don't like that. (I live in a house built from cinder blocks filled with concrete and rebar, like a commercial building. It was built by a commercial builder as his own house. It looks industrial from the outside, and nice inside. I'm fine with that, but most people are not.)
- pfdietz 5mo ago
  The underlying problem, I think, is that homes are used as displays of wealth. Veblen goods.
- dilyevsky 5mo ago
  Most of the world doesnt have access to good/cheap canadian lumber and we do. It would make sfhs and even small multihome projects more expensive not less if you start building them from concrete and steel. Also at the risk of stating the obvious - frame is on the order of 10-20% of the total construction cost so wouldn’t really make much of difference anyway
  - pfdietz 5mo ago
    I was noticing on my last trip to Europe that telephone/power poles were made of concrete, not wood. This was near Budapest.
    - dilyevsky 5mo ago
      Same reason - US had a lot of timber and Europe generally didn't by the time industrial revolution came. In addition, a lot of eastern europe had to be totally rebuilt from scratch after ww2 and especially soviets were never really good with money (duh) and did a lot of the things for the show.

It suggests we need to find cheaper materials from which to build homes.

by pfdietz 5mo ago

It suggests we need to find cheaper materials from which to build homes.

I’m unsure if this solves the problem. Like childcare, we may need to collectively subsidize housing construction to make it affordable. Example: China. The problem is that the costs of labor and materials from the past are behind us, and there are potentially no material cost and productivity improvements to be had. The costs are the costs and potentially unavoidable.

why_only_15 5mo ago
Does China subsidize housing construction? Is your claim something like "China encourages/forces consumers to save at high rates which lowers interest rates and makes there be more construction"?
- toomuchtodo 5mo ago
  https://www.reuters.com/world/china/key-features-chinas-affordable-housing-policy-2024-06-04/ https://www.reuters.com/world/china/key-features-chinas-affo... https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2666165923001047 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S266616592...

Animats 5mo ago

Most of the world builds low-end homes from reinforced concrete. Most US buyers don't like that. (I live in a house built from cinder blocks filled with concrete and rebar, like a commercial building. It was built by a commercial builder as his own house. It looks industrial from the outside, and nice inside. I'm fine with that, but most people are not.)

pfdietz 5mo ago
The underlying problem, I think, is that homes are used as displays of wealth. Veblen goods.
dilyevsky 5mo ago
Most of the world doesnt have access to good/cheap canadian lumber and we do. It would make sfhs and even small multihome projects more expensive not less if you start building them from concrete and steel. Also at the risk of stating the obvious - frame is on the order of 10-20% of the total construction cost so wouldn’t really make much of difference anyway
- pfdietz 5mo ago
  I was noticing on my last trip to Europe that telephone/power poles were made of concrete, not wood. This was near Budapest.
  - dilyevsky 5mo ago
    Same reason - US had a lot of timber and Europe generally didn't by the time industrial revolution came. In addition, a lot of eastern europe had to be totally rebuilt from scratch after ww2 and especially soviets were never really good with money (duh) and did a lot of the things for the show.