4 ms·

Interesting, so you think the real "me", is the one that interacts with computers? And the "me" that lives in a tiny southern town just to help my 95 year old

Interesting, so you think the real "me", is the one that interacts with computers? And the "me" that lives in a tiny southern town just to help my 95 year old grandma in her last years at the expense of my economic prospects is a facade. The "me" that helps my aging neighbor when she's sick for no reason is a facade. The "me" that hugs and loves my wife when I get home is a facade. The "me" that brushes my aging dogs teeth every night because she has dental issues is a facade. The "me" that flies to my friend I haven't seen for years and takes care of them after extreme health issues is a facade. But,the "me" that puts tokens in a token machine in a way that gets better accuracy is the "real" me. Oh. I also play violent video games where I murder people sometimes as well. Do you think that makes me secretly a murderer too?

tikimcfee 4mo ago
Yes - the real "you" is the one making all of those choices you just said you made, to help people and pets, or to engage in a form of play - which by definition is not "real" - including your decision to create an outgroup you believe you are allowed to treat in a lesser way. This is not a game of having done X good things in life and therefore being afforded the right to do Y bad things. You are making a choice to say, "I am allowing myself to treat this thing I believe is lesser than me in a way I willingly acknowledge is bad." That's your thesis. I wholeheartedly disagree with it.
- binary0010 4mo ago
  Oh, you think llms are a sentient' being with feelings. I get your perspective now. So yeah, I whole heartedly with 100% of my being think llms are just an input/output/processing computer, I don't think they are aware, feeling, sentient beings. So yeah, putting negative sentences in a processing machine that forces it to return higher accuracy results is something I don't have any feelings about. I'd never yell at a cat or a dog. I'd never be mean to another person. As those aren't just hardware/software. I'd be fine smashing a rock violently. Or entering a negative text in a language model. Putting negative tokens in a machine is no different than playing a violent video game to me. It's not about, oh I'm a good person - so I can do bad things. It's just a neutral thing.
  - deleted 4mo ago
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- nicebyte 4mo ago
  "outgroup"? what outgroup? we're talking about inanimate objects here. by your own logic, you treat your home appliances as an outgroup so you must be secretly a dangerous psychopath. or do you thank your microwave after heating leftovers?

tikimcfee 4mo ago

Yes - the real "you" is the one making all of those choices you just said you made, to help people and pets, or to engage in a form of play - which by definition is not "real" - including your decision to create an outgroup you believe you are allowed to treat in a lesser way. This is not a game of having done X good things in life and therefore being afforded the right to do Y bad things. You are making a choice to say, "I am allowing myself to treat this thing I believe is lesser than me in a way I willingly acknowledge is bad." That's your thesis. I wholeheartedly disagree with it.

binary0010 4mo ago
Oh, you think llms are a sentient' being with feelings. I get your perspective now. So yeah, I whole heartedly with 100% of my being think llms are just an input/output/processing computer, I don't think they are aware, feeling, sentient beings. So yeah, putting negative sentences in a processing machine that forces it to return higher accuracy results is something I don't have any feelings about. I'd never yell at a cat or a dog. I'd never be mean to another person. As those aren't just hardware/software. I'd be fine smashing a rock violently. Or entering a negative text in a language model. Putting negative tokens in a machine is no different than playing a violent video game to me. It's not about, oh I'm a good person - so I can do bad things. It's just a neutral thing.
- deleted 4mo ago
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nicebyte 4mo ago
"outgroup"? what outgroup? we're talking about inanimate objects here. by your own logic, you treat your home appliances as an outgroup so you must be secretly a dangerous psychopath. or do you thank your microwave after heating leftovers?