4 ms·

Anything over 150 seats means you need to pay at token rates plus the $20/user. My day job is operational (no coding at all) and I'm spending ~$300 a month on a

Anything over 150 seats means you need to pay at token rates plus the $20/user. My day job is operational (no coding at all) and I'm spending ~$300 a month on a few chats with Claude/Cowork a day over the course of a month.

stymaar 4mo ago
I hope your company is keeping the input/response pair in case they need to break free at some point.
- dd8601fn 4mo ago
  Wouldn’t people mostly just want any artifacts?
  - speed_spread 4mo ago
    Like Slack history, LLM history can be used to build searchable knowledge base. Questions are often more valuable than answers.
m_kos 4mo ago
$300 is my employer's monthly cap on Claude Enterprise. It lasts me at most a week of moderate use. I would much rather get Codex Pro and Claude Pro or Max, which would cost ≤ $200. For $300, one could also add Gemini Ultra to the mix so I could have all three review each other's code, etc. Claude can be very good but enterprise pricing doesn't make sense to me.
- lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
  The $200 plan you're talking about is subsidized by Anthropic. They cannot afford to keep offering that to everyone indefinitely. Absolute best case scenario for current users is that they can continue to subsidize it as way to sell enterprise plans, but there's no way that they can keep offering it to everyone at those prices.
  - wahnfrieden 4mo ago
    They can if it is a way to get individuals hooked on it to then introduce it at their workplaces, who pay enterprise rates.
    - lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
      Right, they can do it to sell enterprise plans, but they can't offer said plans to those enterprise customers indefinitely. So if your employer wants to spend $200/month on tokens, you're going to get however many tokens $200 buys you each month, not the order of magnitude more you can get with a consumer subscription.
      - wahnfrieden 4mo ago
        That’s what I’m saying. Enterprise customers don’t use the subscription plan
        addedGone 4mo ago
        Except that they do, we do. A lot of startups pile up enormous amount of accounts, companies don't need the Enterprise Anthropic solution, they can just subscribe to many accounts and have their own staff KYC for each (1 codex, 1 claude, 1 google and so-on).
        Bnjoroge 4mo ago
        I imagine it’s also really trivial to build some kind of local “enterprise” proxy that gives you the same visibility in usage as the anthropic dashboard would give you. I use one for aggregating all my subs.
        lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
        That will be clamped down on by Anthropic (and other providers) for the same reason they don't offer those plans to enterprise customers already.
- ilikehurdles 4mo ago
  That’s a shocking number. I don’t know how much my employer is billed, but based on the numbers reported by Claude code in its optional status bar, I’m often exceeding $300 in a day across sessions, when working on meatier tickets.
stavros 4mo ago
We deployed OpenWebUI with the Claude API the other day for employees. Someone sent ten messages (which appeared to just be reasonable day-to-day work), and we paid $200 for it. There were 44M input tokens, 100k output tokens, no cache hits at all. OpenWebUI reports 3M tokens used, Claude reports 44M, and I have no idea where the rest of the tokens went. This was all on a brand new API key, installed directly to the service, too. With this kind of opaque billing, how can I reasonably deploy any AI?
- deleted 4mo ago
  [deleted]
- SyneRyder 4mo ago
  No cache hits seems ominous, could this be an OpenWebUI issue? It also seems ominous that Anthropic models are basically nowhere on the OpenWebUI leaderboards. I'm only doing a cursory search, but it seems OpenWebUI doesn't support Anthropic caching, and they don't intend to? Other providers handle caching automatically (apparently?) but caching has to be specifically managed by the client with Anthropic. If that's correct that OpenWebUI doesn't support it, it would really send your costs spiralling, because you're being billed for all the tokens in the entire multi-turn conversation on every turn: https://github.com/open-webui/open-webui/issues/4887 https://github.com/open-webui/open-webui/issues/4887 I have no experience with OpenWebUI though (honestly, first time I've heard of it). Just trying to be helpful. If I'm completely incorrect then apologies in advance for sending you down the wrong path.
  - stavros 4mo ago
    Really? Huh, I've never heard of Anthropic caching needing to be specifically enabled. I'll look into that, thank you! Sounds like the culprit.

stymaar 4mo ago

I hope your company is keeping the input/response pair in case they need to break free at some point.

dd8601fn 4mo ago
Wouldn’t people mostly just want any artifacts?
- speed_spread 4mo ago
  Like Slack history, LLM history can be used to build searchable knowledge base. Questions are often more valuable than answers.

m_kos 4mo ago

$300 is my employer's monthly cap on Claude Enterprise. It lasts me at most a week of moderate use. I would much rather get Codex Pro and Claude Pro or Max, which would cost ≤ $200. For $300, one could also add Gemini Ultra to the mix so I could have all three review each other's code, etc. Claude can be very good but enterprise pricing doesn't make sense to me.

lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
The $200 plan you're talking about is subsidized by Anthropic. They cannot afford to keep offering that to everyone indefinitely. Absolute best case scenario for current users is that they can continue to subsidize it as way to sell enterprise plans, but there's no way that they can keep offering it to everyone at those prices.
- wahnfrieden 4mo ago
  They can if it is a way to get individuals hooked on it to then introduce it at their workplaces, who pay enterprise rates.
  - lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
    Right, they can do it to sell enterprise plans, but they can't offer said plans to those enterprise customers indefinitely. So if your employer wants to spend $200/month on tokens, you're going to get however many tokens $200 buys you each month, not the order of magnitude more you can get with a consumer subscription.
    - wahnfrieden 4mo ago
      That’s what I’m saying. Enterprise customers don’t use the subscription plan
      - addedGone 4mo ago
        Except that they do, we do. A lot of startups pile up enormous amount of accounts, companies don't need the Enterprise Anthropic solution, they can just subscribe to many accounts and have their own staff KYC for each (1 codex, 1 claude, 1 google and so-on).
        Bnjoroge 4mo ago
        I imagine it’s also really trivial to build some kind of local “enterprise” proxy that gives you the same visibility in usage as the anthropic dashboard would give you. I use one for aggregating all my subs.
        lunar_mycroft 4mo ago
        That will be clamped down on by Anthropic (and other providers) for the same reason they don't offer those plans to enterprise customers already.
ilikehurdles 4mo ago
That’s a shocking number. I don’t know how much my employer is billed, but based on the numbers reported by Claude code in its optional status bar, I’m often exceeding $300 in a day across sessions, when working on meatier tickets.

stavros 4mo ago

We deployed OpenWebUI with the Claude API the other day for employees. Someone sent ten messages (which appeared to just be reasonable day-to-day work), and we paid $200 for it. There were 44M input tokens, 100k output tokens, no cache hits at all. OpenWebUI reports 3M tokens used, Claude reports 44M, and I have no idea where the rest of the tokens went. This was all on a brand new API key, installed directly to the service, too. With this kind of opaque billing, how can I reasonably deploy any AI?

deleted 4mo ago
[deleted]
SyneRyder 4mo ago
No cache hits seems ominous, could this be an OpenWebUI issue? It also seems ominous that Anthropic models are basically nowhere on the OpenWebUI leaderboards. I'm only doing a cursory search, but it seems OpenWebUI doesn't support Anthropic caching, and they don't intend to? Other providers handle caching automatically (apparently?) but caching has to be specifically managed by the client with Anthropic. If that's correct that OpenWebUI doesn't support it, it would really send your costs spiralling, because you're being billed for all the tokens in the entire multi-turn conversation on every turn: https://github.com/open-webui/open-webui/issues/4887 https://github.com/open-webui/open-webui/issues/4887 I have no experience with OpenWebUI though (honestly, first time I've heard of it). Just trying to be helpful. If I'm completely incorrect then apologies in advance for sending you down the wrong path.
- stavros 4mo ago
  Really? Huh, I've never heard of Anthropic caching needing to be specifically enabled. I'll look into that, thank you! Sounds like the culprit.