4 ms·

This is not how it works. My partner is Ugandan, we live in France - I'm used to ship to various countries in Africa. Never use the "regular" post - it is just

by liotier 5mo ago

This is not how it works. My partner is Ugandan, we live in France - I'm used to ship to various countries in Africa. Never use the "regular" post - it is just as OP described. Don't use high-end couriers (DHL, Fedex etc.) either - very expensive for scant value added. Do what every local does: use one of the innumerable grey market freight forwarders. One way or the other (for a typical "line haul" example, they entrust extra carry-on luggage to airline passengers remunerated for the service), they get packages to their destination, and they are not even expensive. They know the thicket of rules and petty fiefdoms, what rules apply and which don't, what to pay and to whom... Regular post just acts as if everything works by the book - and that doesn't fly. Use word-of-mouth to find the good couriers, trawl through your local community of people from the destination country - it is a very common service, so you'll soon find a good provider. Test it with a couple of low-stakes deliveries and you'll have a solid channel. Meet your guy in a metro station, or find the shop in Barbès that smells like a marketplace across the Mediterranean, hand over your package with the recipient's name, destination city (Addresses ? Where we're going we don't need addresses !), your phone number and the recipient's phone number scrawled on it with a felt-tip marker (make sure they are Whatsapp numbers), pay in cash, don't get a receipt (lol) - and there you go ! Operating in Africa will soon tire you if you attempt to force European ways. Going with the flow (with appropriate caution - a nose for issues, borne from experience, is invaluable) works and makes the experience enjoyable !

petertodd 5mo ago
I've done some military charity work in Ukraine, getting donations from people in my community and ensuring that money gets turned into vehicles and equipment reaching soldiers that I personally know in Eastern Ukraine. Just a small "hobby" really, not on a big scale; I'm certainly not a charity professional. On multiple occasions I've shipped things with the Nova Poshta service to units very close to the front line. In some cases they're getting picked up at Nova Poshta shipping outlets so close to the front lines that FPV drones are a genuine risk. It just works. Nova Poshta has a nice app. There's complete and accurate tracking, you can easily redirect shipments on the fly to different locations and even different people, and they have package lockers everywhere. The staff are very friendly and go above and beyond to help out. I once showed up at a Kyiv branch with four used truck tires covered with mud, without any packaging, and said I needed to get them to a unit in Sloviansk, a town 20kms from the front lines. They handled everything for me for the equivalent of ~$30 and they showed up the next day. If Ukraine can manage shipping at scale in the middle of a war, WTF is Africa doing? Why do you have to rely on sketchy shit like trusting random airline passengers getting some extra cash on the side? You can't have a modern economy without good shipping services. I'm reminded of the time I visited both Kyiv and South Africa in Febuary 2024... Cape Town and Johannesburg had more scheduled blackouts than Kyiv, even with Russia actively trying to destroy the electricity grid. The GDP/capita of South Africa is higher than Ukraine!
- liotier 5mo ago
  Technology isn't the problem - African developers produce apps just fine. It isn't even local logistics - addresses are being deployed in major cities, and alternative processes work fine elsewhere. The problem is rule of law, or lack thereof. Rule of law is critical infrastructure. Also, South Africa isn't sub-Saharan Africa.
  - petertodd 5mo ago
    > The problem is rule of law, or lack thereof. Rule of law is critical infrastructure. I agree 100% > Also, South Africa isn't sub-Saharan Africa. Indeed. Which made me even less impressed by my example of power outages. South Africa clearly has a massive political problem with corruption; they have the money and technology to keep the power on.
    - lovasoa 5mo ago
      The details are interesting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskom#Corruption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskom#Corruption
  - tim333 5mo ago
    South Africa is in Africa and south of the Sahara and usually qualifies. Culturally it's a mix. There are a bunch of people from black African areas who are culturally African and then a bunch originating from Holland and England who are culturally European. It's changed a bit as to which lot run different things.
- rcxdude 5mo ago
  Ukraine has put a lot of effort into combating corruption, ans a war going on does tend to focus things. But it is generally true that a situation where 'by the book' doesn't work is corrosive and should generally result in some effort to bring the book and reality back into sync (Generally I think the book should be what's changed, but if bring reality into the light by putting it into the book reveals something unacceptable then that should also be changed).
scraft 5mo ago
But this process, including sending smaller items first etc sounds like it would have taken longer than what the OP did? And the OP was trying to do it quickly to tie in with the beginning of the semester?
- liotier 5mo ago
  Forwarders work with batches: small batches (consolidate packages in a suitcase to travel as airline luggage) or large batches (up to a whole 40 feet container)... So, delay is a matter of luck - ask around if a batch is due to depart and available slots remain. Express remains the province of traditional players - though I've managed to find a forwarder to urgently ship a small blister of drugs, but such service isn't guaranteed.
james_marks 5mo ago
It’s funny to me that this is increasingly how packages are delivered in the US, too. Asking someone who’s going that way already to drop it on their way is inherently efficient in some circumstances. Once there’s remuneration, it’s not a big jump to making the trip just for that. Add an app and the gig economy is born.
- stevezsa8 5mo ago
  The first day of this new app... half the workers will be arrested after they ended up drugs mules.
  - throwaway85825 5mo ago
    Doesn't USPS ship a lot of drugs
doxeddaily 5mo ago
This all sounds like really good reasons not to have anything to do with the place.
- nekzn 5mo ago
  The best part is how, as per the comment, they are bringing this to the first world.

by liotier 5mo ago

petertodd 5mo ago

I've done some military charity work in Ukraine, getting donations from people in my community and ensuring that money gets turned into vehicles and equipment reaching soldiers that I personally know in Eastern Ukraine. Just a small "hobby" really, not on a big scale; I'm certainly not a charity professional. On multiple occasions I've shipped things with the Nova Poshta service to units very close to the front line. In some cases they're getting picked up at Nova Poshta shipping outlets so close to the front lines that FPV drones are a genuine risk. It just works. Nova Poshta has a nice app. There's complete and accurate tracking, you can easily redirect shipments on the fly to different locations and even different people, and they have package lockers everywhere. The staff are very friendly and go above and beyond to help out. I once showed up at a Kyiv branch with four used truck tires covered with mud, without any packaging, and said I needed to get them to a unit in Sloviansk, a town 20kms from the front lines. They handled everything for me for the equivalent of ~$30 and they showed up the next day. If Ukraine can manage shipping at scale in the middle of a war, WTF is Africa doing? Why do you have to rely on sketchy shit like trusting random airline passengers getting some extra cash on the side? You can't have a modern economy without good shipping services. I'm reminded of the time I visited both Kyiv and South Africa in Febuary 2024... Cape Town and Johannesburg had more scheduled blackouts than Kyiv, even with Russia actively trying to destroy the electricity grid. The GDP/capita of South Africa is higher than Ukraine!

liotier 5mo ago
Technology isn't the problem - African developers produce apps just fine. It isn't even local logistics - addresses are being deployed in major cities, and alternative processes work fine elsewhere. The problem is rule of law, or lack thereof. Rule of law is critical infrastructure. Also, South Africa isn't sub-Saharan Africa.
- petertodd 5mo ago
  > The problem is rule of law, or lack thereof. Rule of law is critical infrastructure. I agree 100% > Also, South Africa isn't sub-Saharan Africa. Indeed. Which made me even less impressed by my example of power outages. South Africa clearly has a massive political problem with corruption; they have the money and technology to keep the power on.
  - lovasoa 5mo ago
    The details are interesting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskom#Corruption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskom#Corruption
- tim333 5mo ago
  South Africa is in Africa and south of the Sahara and usually qualifies. Culturally it's a mix. There are a bunch of people from black African areas who are culturally African and then a bunch originating from Holland and England who are culturally European. It's changed a bit as to which lot run different things.
rcxdude 5mo ago
Ukraine has put a lot of effort into combating corruption, ans a war going on does tend to focus things. But it is generally true that a situation where 'by the book' doesn't work is corrosive and should generally result in some effort to bring the book and reality back into sync (Generally I think the book should be what's changed, but if bring reality into the light by putting it into the book reveals something unacceptable then that should also be changed).

scraft 5mo ago

But this process, including sending smaller items first etc sounds like it would have taken longer than what the OP did? And the OP was trying to do it quickly to tie in with the beginning of the semester?

liotier 5mo ago
Forwarders work with batches: small batches (consolidate packages in a suitcase to travel as airline luggage) or large batches (up to a whole 40 feet container)... So, delay is a matter of luck - ask around if a batch is due to depart and available slots remain. Express remains the province of traditional players - though I've managed to find a forwarder to urgently ship a small blister of drugs, but such service isn't guaranteed.

james_marks 5mo ago

It’s funny to me that this is increasingly how packages are delivered in the US, too. Asking someone who’s going that way already to drop it on their way is inherently efficient in some circumstances. Once there’s remuneration, it’s not a big jump to making the trip just for that. Add an app and the gig economy is born.

stevezsa8 5mo ago
The first day of this new app... half the workers will be arrested after they ended up drugs mules.
- throwaway85825 5mo ago
  Doesn't USPS ship a lot of drugs

doxeddaily 5mo ago

This all sounds like really good reasons not to have anything to do with the place.

nekzn 5mo ago
The best part is how, as per the comment, they are bringing this to the first world.