7 ms·

I really like how he approaces AI. Not the tone other leaders are talking, but much more human and much more collaborative. How young people actually can help w

I really like how he approaces AI. Not the tone other leaders are talking, but much more human and much more collaborative. How young people actually can help with the AI shaping. For example Eric Schmidt was really terrible at his speach in front of University of Arizona.

ramon156 5mo ago
Do tell me how young people can help with AI shaping, as this just sounds like "how cows can help shape the meat industry"
- block_dagger 5mo ago
  Ah, so the students were saying “moo,” not “boo.”
- sweetheart 5mo ago
  They can learn the skills to advance research and fill the roles that help determine what sorts of guard rails there should/could be to ensure it’s used in as helpful a manner as possible.
  - muddi900 5mo ago
    Do you think in the world of the Military Industrial Complex and the zero-sum game that is Great Power geopolitics, we will have any guardrails?
    - sweetheart 5mo ago
      I think it’s possible.
    - darkwater 5mo ago
      Trying to be optimistic, at least we didn't experience nuclear destruction at planetary scale...
  - mherkender 5mo ago
    If you are naive enough to believe that, the moment you create problems for your bosses, you can be fired and replaced by some other naive person.
  - globalnode 5mo ago
    Any why would I want to work as a prompt engineer? or with AI tech at all? when I trained as a software developer using my brain to solve problems with data structures and algorithms, not prompts. I outright refuse to do such a thing.
    - sweetheart 5mo ago
      Okay!
      - globalnode 5mo ago
        found the prompt "engineer"
- jappgar 5mo ago
  They can start by voting for politicians who will rein in big tech
  - aduwah 5mo ago
    There is no politician who stands against big tech and by extension big money
    - coffeefirst 5mo ago
      We are about to test that theory.
    - master-lincoln 5mo ago
      not even Bernie Sanders?
      - mythrwy 5mo ago
        probably not
  - maratc 5mo ago
    In the US, the politicians need money to be elected in the first place, and a lot of it. Lots of money comes from the big tech (to both parties), and the big tech won't give money to anyone with a plan to "rein them in."
    - jappgar 5mo ago
      They don't need money they just need votes. If money can buy votes then the problem rests with an apathetic and distracted electorate. You change that by giving a fuck and telling everyone you know what you actually think.
      - maratc 5mo ago
        > If money can buy votes It's not that "money can buy votes," but for a given party money can buy facilities (offices, transportation, food, etc.) and people (activists, coordinators, etc.) and that can bring (not buy) votes. Printing one "Rodriguez 2027" sign and putting that on your front lawn can be done for free at someone's office; printing ten million of them is a major financial, logistical and organisational undertaking, all of which costs money. Printers, truckers, warehouses, coordinators don't care how many "fucks" you're giving; they just prefer being given dollars to being given "fucks." Maybe you have more ... workable (?) solutions than "let's get everybody to give a fuck and vote in a different way"?
- embedding-shape 5mo ago
  To be fair, if you're a cow, you don't have much say in it, the world continues to revolve, and not around you, but you still need to find your place, or at least find peace with not finding your place. Every teenager goes through it, some still try to find their place until the day they day, but we all grow up in vastly different contexts and environments compared to what we experience as adults, and stuff keeps happening around us that we don't like, maybe don't even want to participate in, but because of the lack of alternatives, you don't really have a choice.
- limflick 5mo ago
  I guess an optimistic way to look at this would be to treat this as just another layer of abstraction, meaning people could focus on larger scale problems moving forward, similar to how the evolution of programming languages influenced development time, quality and the quantity of software being put out. The question is at what price does all of this abstraction come at, assuming AI continues to evolve at its current rate.
  - master-lincoln 5mo ago
    This can not be seen as layer of abstraction as it's non deterministic and not trustworthy. So we still need to inspect and understand that abstraction layer output if we want to have a reliable product
    - bayindirh 5mo ago
      Adding non deterministic layers on top of a painfully deterministic layer to make more betterer deterministic things is an oxymoron. ...and many people choose to ignore that fact.
- SecretDreams 5mo ago
  Now, more than ever, I think young people are cows for the economic meat grinder. It takes me to one of my favourite quotes: "We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children." I think we've forgotten this. We are not paying it forward any more as a society.
  - Jtarii 5mo ago
    The world is a significantly better place than it was when my parents were my age.
    - SecretDreams 5mo ago
      By what metrics? Current young generations are the first that will, on average, work harder than their parents and have less to show for it. Affordability is absolutely vile and oligarchs have more decision making power then they've ever had in my lifetime, at least. No. Prospects are poor and governmental debt is absolutely unsustainable. But I guess they've ve got cell phones and social anxiety, so not all bad. Basically, what's the state QOL, and first/second derivatives of the that state? What direction is everything going? What's the world state young people are growing into? What advice would you give a young person to enable them to achieve the same success as you? - be realistic. You being the average poster on this forum, enriched by the tech boom of the 2000s-2020s - but not necessarily you specifically.
limflick 5mo ago
I wonder how Steve Jobs would've reacted to this GenAI boom. He constantly talked about the intersection of Humanities and tech, as well as fostering creativity by pushing people to their limits (for the better or worse), so I don't think he'd be one of those CEOs that's first in line to get rid of human workers as much as possible. Or maybe he would be and I'm just giving him too much credit. On an unrelated note, I haven't used an Iphone since 2018 and I wonder if Siri has gotten any better. I do see "Apple Intelligence" being advertised everywhere and besides AI summaries of texts on the notifications bar I haven't seen anything to understand what Apple Intelligence actually means.
- embedding-shape 5mo ago
  Yeah, hard to guess how a person would react to transformative technology, together with whatever context it'd be brought up, their reaction could differ. I too would say Jobs probably would have an human angle on it, but he also famously was a tyrant who struggled with people not doing exactly what he asked, and could be slightly nitpicky about that, maybe having a robot that follows exactly what he wrote, to a fault, would be a machine he'd greatly enjoy. Or he'd throw it in the trash with some flourish of words explaining how a machine could never feel frustrated so therefore couldn't great excellent products, or something.
- porknbeans00 5mo ago
  no this is a fair question. he was enough of a sociopath to disown his own kid, but his narcissistic tendencies and love of the arts would have been a weird counter point to that.
- cheschire 5mo ago
  His reaction probably still would not have been solidified yet, given how long his response took to other tectonic shifts in technology. That isn’t to say he wouldn’t have an opinion to voice, I just suspect it wouldn’t have resulted in a product direction for at least a few more years.
- simonh 5mo ago
  It's just a broad term for whatever AI integration they put into their various Apps and services. So, a combination of the neural engine stuff they've been doing for years, and integration with white label AI services from Google or OpenAI. Siri is basically unchanged, it looks like they have had serious problems getting LLMs, or generative AI in general to be reliable and 'safe' enough to put their own name on it. By 'safe' I mean thinks like not generating emails based on Mein Kampf, or doodles of genitals, or hallucinating false 'facts'. Not a concern for many of the frontier AI providers with no reputation to burn, but not exactly on-brand for Apple. I very much doubt Jobs would have viewed that differently.
embedding-shape 5mo ago
There seems to be a mental shift that happens around 30-50 (depending on the person) where the mindset changes from "How can I learn and contribute to world?" to "How can I make the world work the way I want?" and it's very noticeable in the public speaking engagements these people do, as this mindset seems to blend with all their other thoughts and feelings. Luckily, this doesn't seem to happen to everyone, especially if you aren't a public figure, a billionaire nor a successful startup founder, but that particular combination seems to make it extra likely you experience this transformation.

ramon156 5mo ago

Do tell me how young people can help with AI shaping, as this just sounds like "how cows can help shape the meat industry"

block_dagger 5mo ago
Ah, so the students were saying “moo,” not “boo.”
sweetheart 5mo ago
They can learn the skills to advance research and fill the roles that help determine what sorts of guard rails there should/could be to ensure it’s used in as helpful a manner as possible.
- muddi900 5mo ago
  Do you think in the world of the Military Industrial Complex and the zero-sum game that is Great Power geopolitics, we will have any guardrails?
  - sweetheart 5mo ago
    I think it’s possible.
  - darkwater 5mo ago
    Trying to be optimistic, at least we didn't experience nuclear destruction at planetary scale...
- mherkender 5mo ago
  If you are naive enough to believe that, the moment you create problems for your bosses, you can be fired and replaced by some other naive person.
- globalnode 5mo ago
  Any why would I want to work as a prompt engineer? or with AI tech at all? when I trained as a software developer using my brain to solve problems with data structures and algorithms, not prompts. I outright refuse to do such a thing.
  - sweetheart 5mo ago
    Okay!
    - globalnode 5mo ago
      found the prompt "engineer"
jappgar 5mo ago
They can start by voting for politicians who will rein in big tech
- aduwah 5mo ago
  There is no politician who stands against big tech and by extension big money
  - coffeefirst 5mo ago
    We are about to test that theory.
  - master-lincoln 5mo ago
    not even Bernie Sanders?
    - mythrwy 5mo ago
      probably not
- maratc 5mo ago
  In the US, the politicians need money to be elected in the first place, and a lot of it. Lots of money comes from the big tech (to both parties), and the big tech won't give money to anyone with a plan to "rein them in."
  - jappgar 5mo ago
    They don't need money they just need votes. If money can buy votes then the problem rests with an apathetic and distracted electorate. You change that by giving a fuck and telling everyone you know what you actually think.
    - maratc 5mo ago
      > If money can buy votes It's not that "money can buy votes," but for a given party money can buy facilities (offices, transportation, food, etc.) and people (activists, coordinators, etc.) and that can bring (not buy) votes. Printing one "Rodriguez 2027" sign and putting that on your front lawn can be done for free at someone's office; printing ten million of them is a major financial, logistical and organisational undertaking, all of which costs money. Printers, truckers, warehouses, coordinators don't care how many "fucks" you're giving; they just prefer being given dollars to being given "fucks." Maybe you have more ... workable (?) solutions than "let's get everybody to give a fuck and vote in a different way"?
embedding-shape 5mo ago
To be fair, if you're a cow, you don't have much say in it, the world continues to revolve, and not around you, but you still need to find your place, or at least find peace with not finding your place. Every teenager goes through it, some still try to find their place until the day they day, but we all grow up in vastly different contexts and environments compared to what we experience as adults, and stuff keeps happening around us that we don't like, maybe don't even want to participate in, but because of the lack of alternatives, you don't really have a choice.
limflick 5mo ago
I guess an optimistic way to look at this would be to treat this as just another layer of abstraction, meaning people could focus on larger scale problems moving forward, similar to how the evolution of programming languages influenced development time, quality and the quantity of software being put out. The question is at what price does all of this abstraction come at, assuming AI continues to evolve at its current rate.
- master-lincoln 5mo ago
  This can not be seen as layer of abstraction as it's non deterministic and not trustworthy. So we still need to inspect and understand that abstraction layer output if we want to have a reliable product
  - bayindirh 5mo ago
    Adding non deterministic layers on top of a painfully deterministic layer to make more betterer deterministic things is an oxymoron. ...and many people choose to ignore that fact.
SecretDreams 5mo ago
Now, more than ever, I think young people are cows for the economic meat grinder. It takes me to one of my favourite quotes: "We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children." I think we've forgotten this. We are not paying it forward any more as a society.
- Jtarii 5mo ago
  The world is a significantly better place than it was when my parents were my age.
  - SecretDreams 5mo ago
    By what metrics? Current young generations are the first that will, on average, work harder than their parents and have less to show for it. Affordability is absolutely vile and oligarchs have more decision making power then they've ever had in my lifetime, at least. No. Prospects are poor and governmental debt is absolutely unsustainable. But I guess they've ve got cell phones and social anxiety, so not all bad. Basically, what's the state QOL, and first/second derivatives of the that state? What direction is everything going? What's the world state young people are growing into? What advice would you give a young person to enable them to achieve the same success as you? - be realistic. You being the average poster on this forum, enriched by the tech boom of the 2000s-2020s - but not necessarily you specifically.

limflick 5mo ago

I wonder how Steve Jobs would've reacted to this GenAI boom. He constantly talked about the intersection of Humanities and tech, as well as fostering creativity by pushing people to their limits (for the better or worse), so I don't think he'd be one of those CEOs that's first in line to get rid of human workers as much as possible. Or maybe he would be and I'm just giving him too much credit. On an unrelated note, I haven't used an Iphone since 2018 and I wonder if Siri has gotten any better. I do see "Apple Intelligence" being advertised everywhere and besides AI summaries of texts on the notifications bar I haven't seen anything to understand what Apple Intelligence actually means.

embedding-shape 5mo ago
Yeah, hard to guess how a person would react to transformative technology, together with whatever context it'd be brought up, their reaction could differ. I too would say Jobs probably would have an human angle on it, but he also famously was a tyrant who struggled with people not doing exactly what he asked, and could be slightly nitpicky about that, maybe having a robot that follows exactly what he wrote, to a fault, would be a machine he'd greatly enjoy. Or he'd throw it in the trash with some flourish of words explaining how a machine could never feel frustrated so therefore couldn't great excellent products, or something.
porknbeans00 5mo ago
no this is a fair question. he was enough of a sociopath to disown his own kid, but his narcissistic tendencies and love of the arts would have been a weird counter point to that.
cheschire 5mo ago
His reaction probably still would not have been solidified yet, given how long his response took to other tectonic shifts in technology. That isn’t to say he wouldn’t have an opinion to voice, I just suspect it wouldn’t have resulted in a product direction for at least a few more years.
simonh 5mo ago
It's just a broad term for whatever AI integration they put into their various Apps and services. So, a combination of the neural engine stuff they've been doing for years, and integration with white label AI services from Google or OpenAI. Siri is basically unchanged, it looks like they have had serious problems getting LLMs, or generative AI in general to be reliable and 'safe' enough to put their own name on it. By 'safe' I mean thinks like not generating emails based on Mein Kampf, or doodles of genitals, or hallucinating false 'facts'. Not a concern for many of the frontier AI providers with no reputation to burn, but not exactly on-brand for Apple. I very much doubt Jobs would have viewed that differently.

embedding-shape 5mo ago

There seems to be a mental shift that happens around 30-50 (depending on the person) where the mindset changes from "How can I learn and contribute to world?" to "How can I make the world work the way I want?" and it's very noticeable in the public speaking engagements these people do, as this mindset seems to blend with all their other thoughts and feelings. Luckily, this doesn't seem to happen to everyone, especially if you aren't a public figure, a billionaire nor a successful startup founder, but that particular combination seems to make it extra likely you experience this transformation.