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Judge temporarily saves girl facing suspension for refusing to wear RFID tag
- bravoyankee 14y agoI'm not sure staying in that public school system is a victory. She already won when she courageously stood up for what she believes in.
- snapdata 14y agoPlenty of people stand up for what they believe in and go unnoticed. She is doing the right thing. If she stepped down now, the program would be enforced without resistance.
- nateabele 14y agoGiven the hackability of RFID, wouldn't it be faster, cheaper, and more effective to just pull some hijinx and make the school look like idiots? Also, women in tech! :-)
- TazeTSchnitzel 14y agoSomething that came to mind is if you put an RFID detector near toilet doors and visibly show a count of how many people it thinks are in there, you could easily demonstrate what a terrible violation of privacy it is. Edit: You could also show who and how often, but I'm scared you'd be arrested...
- user24 14y agoNot only how many but who, and how often they go.
- chimeracoder 14y agoI think it's time for one of these students to start a webpage which displays how much time each student spends in the restroom. Searchable, and indexed by a person's real first + last name. If that doesn't make the school realize how appalling this violation of privacy is, then they're too far gone for anything!
- afterburner 14y agoThen they just suspend you for that.
- grecy 14y agoI'll bet that's illegal, and they'd be all over you for a "privacy violation".
- vaadu 14y agoStudent’s Social Security number? Why does the school need the student's SSN? Why not just brand the kids?
- snapdata 14y agoI came up with this great idea, maybe we could just tattoo permanent identification on them so that they're easy to control. Perhaps a number...
- grecy 14y agoDo kids even have SSN's? In the countries I've lived and worked in, you don't get such a number until you want to file a tax return, so usually somewhere around age 15 (depending on the country)
- elwin 14y agoYes, SSN's get assigned shortly after birth.
- alttag 14y agoBut perhaps part of the point of the GP is that SSNs (or even citizenship) are not required for attendance. In fact, it is illegal to even inquire about citizenship status due to federal access laws, so even the school asking for then SSN is ... interesting.
- kclay 14y agoThis is my home state.. city/county mind you in fact. I can remember back in middle school we were giving our SSN as a way to purchase our food, it was our pin code. Thinking back it makes you think if some of those kids have worst credit then others. Privacy doesn't seem to be a big concern in the state anymore, I was just reading that a few states, Texas being the only one to, wanted to conceded from the United States, I just don't understand it, times are changing.
- phene 14y ago
- Steveism 14y ago“Regimes in the past have always started with the schools, where they develop a compliant citizenry,” Whitehead continued. “These ‘Student Locator’ programs are ultimately aimed at getting students used to living in a total surveillance state where there will be no privacy, and wherever you go and whatever you text or email will be watched by the government.” This raises a very valid concern. Human beings aren't cattle. Contrary to what many high school administrators might think, teenagers deserve the right to not be treated as such. If children are taught to be complacent with their privacy that can absolutely extend into adulthood. It would be a shame to raise a generation of Americans who support the idea that they are not trustworthy and therefore subject to probationary measures.
- fleitz 14y agoPerhaps it's time the school district brought back the flag salute to better illustrate the relation it wishes to create between citizens and their state.
- jvdh 14y ago"Human beings aren't cattle." Approaching an airport security control a while back where security agents where shouting "Remove your shoes, belts and jackets, and move along!" repeatedly gave me the distinct impression that the TSA strongly disagrees with you.
- deleted 14y ago
- schnaars 14y agoI'm not sure I see the difference between this program and a company that distributes a similar system for employees to track all the same information?
- jivatmanx 14y agoEmployment is voluntary, and in most contexts minors aren't capable of consent to contracts.
- betterunix 14y agoMinors are more easily indoctrinated into accepting that sort of thing. Employers who do this are being just as antisocial and psychopathic as this school district; the difference is that adults are mature enough to say, "This is not right," whereas children will grow up thinking, "This is how the world works, I better accept it."
- philwelch 14y agoI don't know if you've ever worked at a company that used ID badges, but I don't know anyone who's refused employment over the issue.
- antonID 14y ago"Employers who do this are being just as antisocial and psychopathic as this school district" Because using rfid badges to unlock doors at an office building/control and log access to server rooms, etc is a psychopathic and antisocial thing to do
- freehunter 14y agoAs an information security professional, I am so glad we use RFID badges. I want to know who is getting into my secure datacenter and when, and be able to revoke that right with the click of a button if things start going pear-shaped with their activities.
- 14y ago
- no_fans_please 14y agoI must say, I'm extremely worried about the USA, and this article demonstrates why. Should we really commend someone for being unable to tell the difference between an electronic component & radio transmission system, and the magical 'mark of the beast'? I'm also pretty sure that forcing people to wear tags is going to be overturned by a judge on the point of religious freedom, not based on a common sense decision. And so we're overturning a practical cost saving practicality because: 1) One person believes in magical symbols, and can't tell an electronic component from magic. 2) Some people (commenters in this article) believe we're all magical special snowflakes that should never be treated as a 'group', despite the practicalities of dealing with a large group of people at the same time. Now all we need is for a bunch of nudists to decide that clothes are the mark of the beast. Or concert goers to say that tickets are a mark of the beast. Or flight-attendents to decide that passports are a mark of the beast. Or Hacker News commenters to decide that login details are the mark of the beast. Where does the insanity stop?
- johndavidback 14y agoYou mention 'cost saving practicalities' several times in your comment, however you haven't mentioned any. I'd be interested to hear them.
- no_fans_please 14y agoI think you've missed the point of my commentary, if you think that's key here. Neither you nor I have access to that information; the school board, teachers, government workers, and parent representatives do, and they made a combined choice to implement this. They could be wrong (and they have been before, of course) - but this family isn't arguing that. They are arguing on religious and privacy grounds. Reductio in absurdum: take the "I won't do it because it's the mark of the beast" to it's next level (hacker news comments, library membership, news articles, theaters), and you have a dysfunctional society.
- dchichkov 14y agoI think that this girl can tell electronic components from magic perfectly well. It is you, who is unable to understand what she is saying. Yes, she is using language with religious roots and very expressive 'mark of the beast' phrase. But these are just words, part of the language and culture. Fact that she uses them doesn't make her stupid or insane.
- anon987 14y agoAm I the only one who thought technology was awesome while I was growing up but now it's just getting scary and creepy?
- eCa 14y agoTechnology is amoral, its uses are not.
- PacketNinja 14y agoThis is crap. How many of us have to where some I similar at work? Don't suspend her for not wearing it, just keep her out if class if she doesn't check in with it. Her attendance will falter in the system and she'll be expelled for lack of attendance. This is not big brother, its what every sane parent wants to know: where is my kid?
- crpatino 14y agoI am sure every sane parent also wants to know "who else knows where my kid is" and "with which other third parties this someone else may (knowingly or otherwise) share that information".
- shinratdr 14y ago> How many of us have to where some I similar at work? Those with broken souls or those that work in high-security institutions? This is hardly the average experience in an office FFS. > This is not big brother, its what every sane parent wants to know: where is my kid? You're joking right? This is completely big brother, and in my mind sane and endlessly controlling aren't compatible concepts. Indicting every other parent who doesn't want to ChildTracker(TM) their kids as insane is by far the most ridiculous part of your comment. Wanting to know where you kid is at all times and going to invasive lengths to gather that information are two completely different things. If your child is out and unaccounted for, you should be worried. You shouldn't be checking their GPS tracker on your phone to gain that peace of mind. Sane parents have another key skill: self control. It's a disgusting invasion of privacy, akin to ransacking your child's room to check for undesirable items. Feel free to do it, just don't be surprised when nobody visits you at the home in 20 years. You broke that bond of trust and respect a long time ago and it won't just suddenly re-appear.
- philwelch 14y agoSo what does this girl do when she grows up and wants to do things like get a job, use public transit, drive across a toll bridge, or get a passport? RFID is just part of the world now and it's not entirely clear why schools should be any different.
- logn 14y agoCan't they do what my employers have always done? Make you swipe in at the door. That would earn their revenue from the state while not creating a panopticon.
- philwelch 14y agoI'm pretty sure that's all this is.
- warmwaffles 14y agoThe RFID tags are used for attendance tracking and other various tasks. ALL of the schools in the Bexar county area have students who have to wear ID tags on their shirts. The gang problems here are pretty high, they don't want people that look like students to just walk in and start problems. True, it wont stop a student from just handing an id card to another person to walk around in, but the teacher will record the student as absent and the office will see where the student is if they are in school. Checkpoints aren't near the bathrooms, but they are in the halways and the last time I heard, they were in the rooms as well. This is also a test by only these two schools. If it passes, they will use them in the entire county, otherwise they will abandon the project all together. I don't necessarily believe that she should be using the "Mark of the Beast" excuse. But this does cut REALLY close to invasion of privacy.
- orenjacob 14y agoAs this gets rolled out to the whole district, has anyone looked into how this plan meshes with COPPA? Seems like a very significant amount of PII will be collected for under-13 year olds on internet connected servers. At the same time, parents are legally compelled to send their kids to school and students are legally compelled to attend. Therefore, how can there be informed consent when there is no choice being offered, since one cannot opt out?