5 ms·

To be more precise, the late stage capitalism phase we are in has designed itself around destroying anything that contributes to society. Nothing can exist wi

To be more precise, the late stage capitalism phase we are in has designed itself around destroying anything that contributes to society. Nothing can exist without making a profit. If there is something that is useful, our system makes sure it will be exploited for maximum profit which will in turn destroy that very things.

ModernMech 5mo ago
The people leading this society right now sincerely believe that empathy is the fundamental weakness of our civilization, and introspection is something to be avoided as much as possible. I believe our state of affairs stems from those two propositions.
- cogogo 5mo ago
  And much of our society believes those two things. You see it every day watching people interact in public with a sense of extreme entitlement. Toxic individualism.
- freeopinion 5mo ago
  I believe in local societies. Very few of us are in a position to affect things at a global scale. If you want to change your world, demonstrate empathy in your very small, very local society. I'll try to do better in my small world, too. Maybe some day your little society will extend out to touch my little society. Let's hope that together they would form a bigger bubble where empathy is a strength.
fwipsy 5mo ago
That's not true. Capitalism is merely indifferent to things without economic value. If something is monetizable it will be monetized, which can be very harmful in itself, but capitalism does not seek destruction for it's own sake.
- mentalgear 5mo ago
  Have you meet the military-industrial complex? President/General Eisenhower famously warned us about it becoming a self-serving entity 65 years ago: > On January 17, 1961, in this farewell address, President Dwight Eisenhower warned against the establishment of a "military-industrial complex." https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/president-dwight-d-eisenhowers-farewell-address https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/president-dwigh... The latest examples are the current war-profiteers in office who drive conflict to fuel a war economy, capitalizing on the rising stock shares of 'defense' contractors.
  - fwipsy 5mo ago
    Right. It's destruction for the sake of profit, not (generally) for it's own sake. Different motivation, same outcome.
    - mentalgear 5mo ago
      Also probably the US's biggest sector at 1 Trillion USD .
- amanaplanacanal 5mo ago
  The destruction is a natural byproduct of the tragedy of the commons. Unfortunately many (most?) in the capitalist class don't seem to think the commons is worth protecting. And why would they?
- abdullahkhalids 5mo ago
  Someone who "speaks the truth" without caring about how other people might feel, is rightfully termed an asshole, and generally not considered a good person. Similarly, when politicians pass laws that maximize a single value while disregarding the harm it does on other consequential values, they are considered bad people. The world is complex. Systems of decision making must do careful multi-value optimization to be considered good. Single value maximization is evil because it abdicates responsibility. In the specific case of modern capitalism as-is-implemented, structures like ETFs and bank saving accounts are specifically designed to launder moral responsibility. "I just allocated my capital to the highest return instruments as recommended by my financial advisor. How could I know through all the opaqueness that I was directly enabling child labor and environmental destruction?"
freeopinion 5mo ago
I have spent my entire adult life getting paid for a particular skillset. At the same time I have donated that skillset to family, friends, neighbors, and strangers. Every single time I have been paid for my skillset I have guaranteed that the results of my labor were reusable by everyone on the planet, not just the party paying me. I am a very devout capitalist. I believe very deeply in contributing to society. I don't think I am that unusual in this respect. I see people acting very capitalistic to operate community gardens with the maximum margins. I see highly trained experts volunteer as educators. I see well-paid doctors and lawyers raking up leaves for their neighbors. I see accountants freelancing to keep the blind center afloat. There is a lot of greed in the world. I don't deny it. I confess it in myself. But there are a lot of people doing a lot of good as well. If you're feeling discouraged about the dimmer side of human nature, start up something bright and wholesome and be amazed at how many people flock to help you. Surround yourself with these people. If you don't feel you have the energy to start your own thing, be one of the people who flock to somebody else's bright efforts. What kind of world do you want to live in? Spend your effort building that world. (Even if it takes a lot of effort.)
- wolvesechoes 5mo ago
  > am a very devout capitalist. I believe very deeply in contributing to society. I don't think I am that unusual in this respect. I see people acting very capitalistic to operate community gardens with the maximum margins. I see highly trained experts volunteer as educators. I see well-paid doctors and lawyers raking up leaves for their neighbors. I see accountants freelancing to keep the blind center afloat. Charity won't save us, and all these "good" and "moral" people actively resist any change that could actually solve systemic issues, like progressive tax.
  - freeopinion 5mo ago
    Charity is the only thing that can save us. Tax is just a different take on charity. We all agree to pay into the community chest to provide for a pubic commons. Resistance to progressive tax is resistance to a type of charity. One important difference between charity and tax is who gets to decide on how it is spent. If charity won't save us taxes never will.

ModernMech 5mo ago

The people leading this society right now sincerely believe that empathy is the fundamental weakness of our civilization, and introspection is something to be avoided as much as possible. I believe our state of affairs stems from those two propositions.

cogogo 5mo ago
And much of our society believes those two things. You see it every day watching people interact in public with a sense of extreme entitlement. Toxic individualism.
freeopinion 5mo ago
I believe in local societies. Very few of us are in a position to affect things at a global scale. If you want to change your world, demonstrate empathy in your very small, very local society. I'll try to do better in my small world, too. Maybe some day your little society will extend out to touch my little society. Let's hope that together they would form a bigger bubble where empathy is a strength.

fwipsy 5mo ago

That's not true. Capitalism is merely indifferent to things without economic value. If something is monetizable it will be monetized, which can be very harmful in itself, but capitalism does not seek destruction for it's own sake.

mentalgear 5mo ago
Have you meet the military-industrial complex? President/General Eisenhower famously warned us about it becoming a self-serving entity 65 years ago: > On January 17, 1961, in this farewell address, President Dwight Eisenhower warned against the establishment of a "military-industrial complex." https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/president-dwight-d-eisenhowers-farewell-address https://www.archives.gov/milestone-documents/president-dwigh... The latest examples are the current war-profiteers in office who drive conflict to fuel a war economy, capitalizing on the rising stock shares of 'defense' contractors.
- fwipsy 5mo ago
  Right. It's destruction for the sake of profit, not (generally) for it's own sake. Different motivation, same outcome.
  - mentalgear 5mo ago
    Also probably the US's biggest sector at 1 Trillion USD .
amanaplanacanal 5mo ago
The destruction is a natural byproduct of the tragedy of the commons. Unfortunately many (most?) in the capitalist class don't seem to think the commons is worth protecting. And why would they?
abdullahkhalids 5mo ago
Someone who "speaks the truth" without caring about how other people might feel, is rightfully termed an asshole, and generally not considered a good person. Similarly, when politicians pass laws that maximize a single value while disregarding the harm it does on other consequential values, they are considered bad people. The world is complex. Systems of decision making must do careful multi-value optimization to be considered good. Single value maximization is evil because it abdicates responsibility. In the specific case of modern capitalism as-is-implemented, structures like ETFs and bank saving accounts are specifically designed to launder moral responsibility. "I just allocated my capital to the highest return instruments as recommended by my financial advisor. How could I know through all the opaqueness that I was directly enabling child labor and environmental destruction?"

freeopinion 5mo ago

I have spent my entire adult life getting paid for a particular skillset. At the same time I have donated that skillset to family, friends, neighbors, and strangers. Every single time I have been paid for my skillset I have guaranteed that the results of my labor were reusable by everyone on the planet, not just the party paying me. I am a very devout capitalist. I believe very deeply in contributing to society. I don't think I am that unusual in this respect. I see people acting very capitalistic to operate community gardens with the maximum margins. I see highly trained experts volunteer as educators. I see well-paid doctors and lawyers raking up leaves for their neighbors. I see accountants freelancing to keep the blind center afloat. There is a lot of greed in the world. I don't deny it. I confess it in myself. But there are a lot of people doing a lot of good as well. If you're feeling discouraged about the dimmer side of human nature, start up something bright and wholesome and be amazed at how many people flock to help you. Surround yourself with these people. If you don't feel you have the energy to start your own thing, be one of the people who flock to somebody else's bright efforts. What kind of world do you want to live in? Spend your effort building that world. (Even if it takes a lot of effort.)

wolvesechoes 5mo ago
> am a very devout capitalist. I believe very deeply in contributing to society. I don't think I am that unusual in this respect. I see people acting very capitalistic to operate community gardens with the maximum margins. I see highly trained experts volunteer as educators. I see well-paid doctors and lawyers raking up leaves for their neighbors. I see accountants freelancing to keep the blind center afloat. Charity won't save us, and all these "good" and "moral" people actively resist any change that could actually solve systemic issues, like progressive tax.
- freeopinion 5mo ago
  Charity is the only thing that can save us. Tax is just a different take on charity. We all agree to pay into the community chest to provide for a pubic commons. Resistance to progressive tax is resistance to a type of charity. One important difference between charity and tax is who gets to decide on how it is spent. If charity won't save us taxes never will.