5 ms·

Just what kind of evidence do you suppose they could have?

by Auracle 5mo ago

troupo 5mo ago
Showing actual improved products and features. Showing actual code. etc.
- hparadiz 5mo ago
  I shipped a project at work in 3 months instead of the estimated original 6-9 months.
  - evgen 5mo ago
    Sure you did. We can't see the project, of course, because she lives in Canada...
    - hparadiz 5mo ago
      I had to convert a build pipeline from just one linux distro to multiple and then get arm64 going. Not the most difficult thing in the world but quite annoying when there's 100 binaries and a complex dep tree with lots of moving pieces. Anyway AI for sure increased project cadence by at least 2x. Not sure why there's so much denial in these threads.
      - troupo 5mo ago
        I can also claim a bunch of things. If you manage to read the comment I was originally replying to, and my reply: --- start quote --- - Just what kind of evidence do you suppose they could have? - Showing actual improved products and features. Showing actual code. etc. --- end quote --- Note how you provided neither. It's just claims. > Anyway AI for sure increased project cadence by at least 2x. As in: you claim this. Also, no one denies that you can ship a lot of code much faster with AI. However, somehow, very little actual evidence of grandiose claims (see farther up in the context) besides anecdotal "I'm so faster and features are being shipped left and right". See also a sibling comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48158565 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48158565
        hparadiz 5mo ago
        The amount of critical CVEs released in a week is a metric.
      - microtonal 5mo ago
        Oh, I certainly believe this. LLMs tend to be quite good at the: I'll give you a well-designed example, now extrapolate to other cases-cases. I think it's a great example of using LLMs effectively. In the end becoming more productive is understanding where LLMs work great and where they fail miserably. But it is a step similar to, say going from assembly to a higher-level programming language, not the silver bullet that AI astroturfers like you to believe (fire all the programmers to buy more tokens!)
- ChrisMarshallNY 5mo ago
  Not a bot (although I have been accused of it, due to my activity here, and on GitHub, but I’ve been this way for longer than LLMs have been a thing. I’m retired, “on the spectrum,” and don’t participate in any other social media). I’m currently working on a rewrite of an app that originally took two years. It’s been about three months, and I’m probably about 70% done. It’s a total “from scratch” rewrite; both client and server (two versions of each, as I also have administrative code). It’s a pretty big system, for one guy. I couldn’t do it, without the LLM. It’s not been a cakewalk. I’ve needed to toss out large swaths of LLM-generated code, and rewrite by hand, but, for the most part, it’s been a huge help. But I’m also not doing it in a manner that eats tokens. I just use the standard $20/month subscription as a chat. I suspect my workflow is not one that Anthropic or OpenAI really wants out there. But I also bet that many HN accounts are bots; although I think many may be ones run by enthusiasts, not some AI cabal.
  - troupo 5mo ago
    > It’s not been a cakewalk. I’ve needed to toss out large swaths of LLM-generated code, and rewrite by hand, but, for the most part, it’s been a huge help. Same here :) > not some AI cabal. There are enough enthusiasts to make it feel like one. Also an unhealthy doze of marketers, people buying into hype, AI psychosis etc.
    - ChrisMarshallNY 5mo ago
      > There are enough enthusiasts to make it feel like one. Also an unhealthy doze of marketers, people buying into hype, AI psychosis etc. There's absolutely no question that AI is a real thing, and that there's going to be a lot of money made, so there's a bunch of folks with commercial interest in pushing it. It's just different from crypto. This has actual real-world utility for just about everyone. I am increasingly hearing people say "Ask ChatGPT," where they used to say "Google It" (where they used to say "Look it Up at the Library").
  - customguy 5mo ago
    For 5 million comments like yours I haven't seen a single one with the old code vs. the new code. I understand that not all code is public that way, of course, and I don't mean to put you on the spot personally. But where are all the open source projects that now do the same with better error handling using less resources? Where are 100+ MB Electron apps reduced to more correct sizes like a few MB, or even a few dozen kB? Why aren't startup times getting slashed across the board? Why isn't RAM usage falling faster than RAM prices are increasing?

Just what kind of evidence do you suppose they could have?

by Auracle 5mo ago

Just what kind of evidence do you suppose they could have?

troupo 5mo ago

Showing actual improved products and features. Showing actual code. etc.

hparadiz 5mo ago
I shipped a project at work in 3 months instead of the estimated original 6-9 months.
- evgen 5mo ago
  Sure you did. We can't see the project, of course, because she lives in Canada...
  - hparadiz 5mo ago
    I had to convert a build pipeline from just one linux distro to multiple and then get arm64 going. Not the most difficult thing in the world but quite annoying when there's 100 binaries and a complex dep tree with lots of moving pieces. Anyway AI for sure increased project cadence by at least 2x. Not sure why there's so much denial in these threads.
    - troupo 5mo ago
      I can also claim a bunch of things. If you manage to read the comment I was originally replying to, and my reply: --- start quote --- - Just what kind of evidence do you suppose they could have? - Showing actual improved products and features. Showing actual code. etc. --- end quote --- Note how you provided neither. It's just claims. > Anyway AI for sure increased project cadence by at least 2x. As in: you claim this. Also, no one denies that you can ship a lot of code much faster with AI. However, somehow, very little actual evidence of grandiose claims (see farther up in the context) besides anecdotal "I'm so faster and features are being shipped left and right". See also a sibling comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48158565 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48158565
      - hparadiz 5mo ago
        The amount of critical CVEs released in a week is a metric.
    - microtonal 5mo ago
      Oh, I certainly believe this. LLMs tend to be quite good at the: I'll give you a well-designed example, now extrapolate to other cases-cases. I think it's a great example of using LLMs effectively. In the end becoming more productive is understanding where LLMs work great and where they fail miserably. But it is a step similar to, say going from assembly to a higher-level programming language, not the silver bullet that AI astroturfers like you to believe (fire all the programmers to buy more tokens!)
ChrisMarshallNY 5mo ago
Not a bot (although I have been accused of it, due to my activity here, and on GitHub, but I’ve been this way for longer than LLMs have been a thing. I’m retired, “on the spectrum,” and don’t participate in any other social media). I’m currently working on a rewrite of an app that originally took two years. It’s been about three months, and I’m probably about 70% done. It’s a total “from scratch” rewrite; both client and server (two versions of each, as I also have administrative code). It’s a pretty big system, for one guy. I couldn’t do it, without the LLM. It’s not been a cakewalk. I’ve needed to toss out large swaths of LLM-generated code, and rewrite by hand, but, for the most part, it’s been a huge help. But I’m also not doing it in a manner that eats tokens. I just use the standard $20/month subscription as a chat. I suspect my workflow is not one that Anthropic or OpenAI really wants out there. But I also bet that many HN accounts are bots; although I think many may be ones run by enthusiasts, not some AI cabal.
- troupo 5mo ago
  > It’s not been a cakewalk. I’ve needed to toss out large swaths of LLM-generated code, and rewrite by hand, but, for the most part, it’s been a huge help. Same here :) > not some AI cabal. There are enough enthusiasts to make it feel like one. Also an unhealthy doze of marketers, people buying into hype, AI psychosis etc.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 5mo ago
    > There are enough enthusiasts to make it feel like one. Also an unhealthy doze of marketers, people buying into hype, AI psychosis etc. There's absolutely no question that AI is a real thing, and that there's going to be a lot of money made, so there's a bunch of folks with commercial interest in pushing it. It's just different from crypto. This has actual real-world utility for just about everyone. I am increasingly hearing people say "Ask ChatGPT," where they used to say "Google It" (where they used to say "Look it Up at the Library").
- customguy 5mo ago
  For 5 million comments like yours I haven't seen a single one with the old code vs. the new code. I understand that not all code is public that way, of course, and I don't mean to put you on the spot personally. But where are all the open source projects that now do the same with better error handling using less resources? Where are 100+ MB Electron apps reduced to more correct sizes like a few MB, or even a few dozen kB? Why aren't startup times getting slashed across the board? Why isn't RAM usage falling faster than RAM prices are increasing?