3 ms·

Safari and Firefox change how big sites render based on the domain

80 points by cdrnsf 5mo ago

robthebrew 5mo ago
Just ditch Chrome and then the website owners see shrinking traffic.
- cybercatgurrl 5mo ago
  and how, pray tell, might we convince the masses to do this?
  - AuthAuth 5mo ago
    Mindcontrol, space lazers, weather machines, genetically engineer actual firefoxes. Just a few ideas worth considering.
    - halJordan 5mo ago
      I'll have my ai agent get on this right away
- pseudohadamard 5mo ago
  This is the exact same situation that got Microsoft tied up in endless antitrust investigations 30 years ago. Of course that was back when the US still had a government rather than a service bureau for billionaires.
phillipseamore 5mo ago
If Safari and Firefox had the exact same lists of sites and fixes I might agree, but they don't.
- cpeterso 5mo ago
  That’s why they suggested one developer use Firefox and another one use Safari. Ideally websites should also test with the beta versions of Firefox, Safari, and Chrome to find and report regressions (browser bugs or web spec changes) so they can get fixed before the release breaks your website.
tracker1 5mo ago
I've seen similar issues simply by using Linux as my main desktop... some sites just won't work because of it, or seem to filter out "Linux" in the user agent. Which kinda sucks.
- pmontra 5mo ago
  Could you give an example? I've been working with a Linux desktop since 2009 and everything seems to work.
  - abrowne 5mo ago
    Ditto. The only thing I can remember of is Apple Maps. They used to allow only Windows or something? But they relented eventually.
  - tracker1 5mo ago
    There was some site/app for creating dinner reservations that I had trouble with... I used my phone in the end. I don't recall the specific site. I also saw it a few months ago on a site, where the backend api seemed to be blocking any useragent with linux.
- sli 5mo ago
  This is one of the reasons why all of my browsers identify as a recent Chrome version. All of those problems just up and disappear. I started doing that when Google claimed (lied) that some of their products no longer support Firefox and would block me from accessing right up until my browser identified itself as Chrome. No bugs, no issues.
  - like_any_other 5mo ago
    If market competition law wasn't reduced to dead ink, lying about your competitor's product, or abusing your dominance in one market to dominate another market, would at minimum carry painful fines.
    - 5mo ago
pmontra 5mo ago
Web services could have at least one developer using Firefox and another one using Safari. I'm the one with Firefox for my customers. Their web apps work with at least Chrome and Firefox. Safari is on them, if they have a Mac. Nobody ever complained.
- petre 5mo ago
  Go debug a web app on Safari yourself then. I use Firefox because the Developer Tools rock. Safari is the IE of our times.
jamesfinlayson 5mo ago
Oh, I thought Chrome did have a similar list - maybe I got confused with WebKit. This very site has one quirk: https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/blob/25738effd8eeca9b8d15e492048bdc61c44dd91a/Source/WebCore/page/Quirks.cpp https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/blob/25738effd8eeca9b8d15e4...
- phillipseamore 5mo ago
  That HN exception from text autosizing shows very well that most of these quirks have nothing to do with Chrome.
1718627440 5mo ago
> Safari and Firefox change how big sites render based on the domain. TikTok, Netflix, Instagram… even SeatGuru. Chrome doesn’t. Why is that? Because the Chrome implementation is implemented server-side.
varun_ch 5mo ago
I noticed the WebKit quirks file even has rules for new websites, like claude.ai. That feels like a bad idea in my opinion… in my mind it would make sense to wait for Anthropic to address any browser compatibility issues, especially since claude.ai is clearly software that is being regularly worked on. I can understand quirks for old websites/ones from companies that work very slowly, but this seems strange to me.
- maverwa 5mo ago
  The reason stated in the article seems sound to me: if it’s broken ins safari/ff but works in chrome, users conclude that the browser is the problem and switch to chrome.

80 points by cdrnsf 5mo ago

robthebrew 5mo ago

Just ditch Chrome and then the website owners see shrinking traffic.

cybercatgurrl 5mo ago
and how, pray tell, might we convince the masses to do this?
- AuthAuth 5mo ago
  Mindcontrol, space lazers, weather machines, genetically engineer actual firefoxes. Just a few ideas worth considering.
  - halJordan 5mo ago
    I'll have my ai agent get on this right away
pseudohadamard 5mo ago
This is the exact same situation that got Microsoft tied up in endless antitrust investigations 30 years ago. Of course that was back when the US still had a government rather than a service bureau for billionaires.

phillipseamore 5mo ago

If Safari and Firefox had the exact same lists of sites and fixes I might agree, but they don't.

cpeterso 5mo ago
That’s why they suggested one developer use Firefox and another one use Safari. Ideally websites should also test with the beta versions of Firefox, Safari, and Chrome to find and report regressions (browser bugs or web spec changes) so they can get fixed before the release breaks your website.

tracker1 5mo ago

I've seen similar issues simply by using Linux as my main desktop... some sites just won't work because of it, or seem to filter out "Linux" in the user agent. Which kinda sucks.

pmontra 5mo ago
Could you give an example? I've been working with a Linux desktop since 2009 and everything seems to work.
- abrowne 5mo ago
  Ditto. The only thing I can remember of is Apple Maps. They used to allow only Windows or something? But they relented eventually.
- tracker1 5mo ago
  There was some site/app for creating dinner reservations that I had trouble with... I used my phone in the end. I don't recall the specific site. I also saw it a few months ago on a site, where the backend api seemed to be blocking any useragent with linux.
sli 5mo ago
This is one of the reasons why all of my browsers identify as a recent Chrome version. All of those problems just up and disappear. I started doing that when Google claimed (lied) that some of their products no longer support Firefox and would block me from accessing right up until my browser identified itself as Chrome. No bugs, no issues.
- like_any_other 5mo ago
  If market competition law wasn't reduced to dead ink, lying about your competitor's product, or abusing your dominance in one market to dominate another market, would at minimum carry painful fines.
  - 5mo ago

pmontra 5mo ago

Web services could have at least one developer using Firefox and another one using Safari. I'm the one with Firefox for my customers. Their web apps work with at least Chrome and Firefox. Safari is on them, if they have a Mac. Nobody ever complained.

petre 5mo ago
Go debug a web app on Safari yourself then. I use Firefox because the Developer Tools rock. Safari is the IE of our times.

jamesfinlayson 5mo ago

Oh, I thought Chrome did have a similar list - maybe I got confused with WebKit. This very site has one quirk: https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/blob/25738effd8eeca9b8d15e492048bdc61c44dd91a/Source/WebCore/page/Quirks.cpp https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/blob/25738effd8eeca9b8d15e4...

phillipseamore 5mo ago
That HN exception from text autosizing shows very well that most of these quirks have nothing to do with Chrome.

1718627440 5mo ago

> Safari and Firefox change how big sites render based on the domain. TikTok, Netflix, Instagram… even SeatGuru. Chrome doesn’t. Why is that? Because the Chrome implementation is implemented server-side.

varun_ch 5mo ago

I noticed the WebKit quirks file even has rules for new websites, like claude.ai. That feels like a bad idea in my opinion… in my mind it would make sense to wait for Anthropic to address any browser compatibility issues, especially since claude.ai is clearly software that is being regularly worked on. I can understand quirks for old websites/ones from companies that work very slowly, but this seems strange to me.

maverwa 5mo ago
The reason stated in the article seems sound to me: if it’s broken ins safari/ff but works in chrome, users conclude that the browser is the problem and switch to chrome.