12 ms·

"In 1975, Dr. Joseph Sharp proved that correct modulation of microwave energy can result in wireless and receiverless transmission of audible speech."

by Lapsa 5mo ago

Tuna-Fish 5mo ago
That's entire unrelated to ELF. The frequencies used by Sharp were in the VHF to UHF bands, and the effect just plain doesn't work at the rock bottom of the spectrum used by ELF and VLF. This highlights a huge problem that ELF faced: Most people don't understand this stuff at all, and cannot tell the difference. On the other hand, the researchers and Navy were always very reluctant to go into the specifics of the technology, for military secrecy concerns. Beyond the sensible secret keeping, this always results in a much larger vague area where people don't want to talk even though nothing serious would be leaked because the laws are strict and figuring out the exact limits of what's classified is itself fraught. So if on the other side you got people who are chaining together all the even vaguely EMF-related news and discoveries, and associating it all with a huge military secret project that no-one wants to talk about, and on the other side you got a bunch of people who actually know what's going on but are unwilling to give straight answers to even relatively simple questions because they are scared of accidentally divulging some key details that are classified, lots of people drew the frankly reasonable conclusion that there is something rotten here. To put it simply, the kind of massive transmitters used by ELF and VLF projects would not be useful for working in the bands where the Frey effect works. The most efficient antennas are half- or quarter-wavelength, which for the Frey effect would be somewhere around 10-20cm (4-8 inches).
- Tuna-Fish 5mo ago
  Also, ironically for the opposition 5th gen communications networks received, 4th gen stuff operates largely in the relevant bands, but 5th gen moves to higher frequencies. Both of those of course use a way too high frequency signal for it to be meaningfully received by the Frey effect.
- Lapsa 5mo ago
  and therefore I'm one of the most people. I do realize ELF & VLF ain't microwaves but I think it is somewhat related compared to other articles. point is - someone is blasting constant speech straight to heads of population and nobody is willing to do anything about it. it's 21st century yet the world we live in has gone back to Dachau methods.
  - ta11fd885e4ef4b 5mo ago
    [dead]
  - Tuna-Fish 5mo ago
    There is no mechanism by which ELF or VLF could be accidentally received without physically large antennas, or very fancy signal processing. The wavelengths are just too long, VLF is 10-100km and ELF is longer. The slopes are just imperceptible. Imagine trying to notice a wave in water that's 10 km long (and not very tall). You cannot even transmit speech with ELF, it carries information so slowly it's only usable for more code or very slow digital signals. Heterodyne systems don't let you pack more information into a lower-frequency signal, they go the other way.
    - Lapsa 5mo ago
      Sounds like you know a thing or two which is what I appreciate. I don't know what's used and don't have a budget to perform any meaningful analysis. But I do know that GWEN towers are 30 years old tech that's capable of transmitting signal in 200mhz to whatever ghz range 200 miles afar. Frey effect according to wikipedia is audible in 200 mhz - 3 ghz range. According to James C Lin research - signal doesn't have to be strong (in fact, strong signal can get hazardous to health and used like a weapon like in Venezuela operation). Surely radio folks can match up 30 years old tech. And signal processing capabilities nowadays can get absurdly sophisticated.
    - Lapsa 5mo ago
      What are your thoughts on FMCW radars? "Emotion recognition method using millimetre wave radar based on deep learning" research paper is what I find interesting. There also exists research paper that deals with recognition of drivers behavior (logically meaning - FMCW radars are capable of locking onto moving targets in quite long radius). From what I understood (with my limited understanding of the subject) - such radars are capable of picking up EMG signals. and according to wikipedia - EMG is enough to feed neural networks and decipher so called "silent talk" aka your inner monologue.
- Lapsa 5mo ago
  also - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterodyne https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterodyne

"In 1975, Dr. Joseph Sharp proved that correct modulation of microwave energy can result in wireless and receiverless transmission of audible speech."

by Lapsa 5mo ago

"In 1975, Dr. Joseph Sharp proved that correct modulation of microwave energy can result in wireless and receiverless transmission of audible speech."

Tuna-Fish 5mo ago

That's entire unrelated to ELF. The frequencies used by Sharp were in the VHF to UHF bands, and the effect just plain doesn't work at the rock bottom of the spectrum used by ELF and VLF. This highlights a huge problem that ELF faced: Most people don't understand this stuff at all, and cannot tell the difference. On the other hand, the researchers and Navy were always very reluctant to go into the specifics of the technology, for military secrecy concerns. Beyond the sensible secret keeping, this always results in a much larger vague area where people don't want to talk even though nothing serious would be leaked because the laws are strict and figuring out the exact limits of what's classified is itself fraught. So if on the other side you got people who are chaining together all the even vaguely EMF-related news and discoveries, and associating it all with a huge military secret project that no-one wants to talk about, and on the other side you got a bunch of people who actually know what's going on but are unwilling to give straight answers to even relatively simple questions because they are scared of accidentally divulging some key details that are classified, lots of people drew the frankly reasonable conclusion that there is something rotten here. To put it simply, the kind of massive transmitters used by ELF and VLF projects would not be useful for working in the bands where the Frey effect works. The most efficient antennas are half- or quarter-wavelength, which for the Frey effect would be somewhere around 10-20cm (4-8 inches).

Tuna-Fish 5mo ago
Also, ironically for the opposition 5th gen communications networks received, 4th gen stuff operates largely in the relevant bands, but 5th gen moves to higher frequencies. Both of those of course use a way too high frequency signal for it to be meaningfully received by the Frey effect.
Lapsa 5mo ago
and therefore I'm one of the most people. I do realize ELF & VLF ain't microwaves but I think it is somewhat related compared to other articles. point is - someone is blasting constant speech straight to heads of population and nobody is willing to do anything about it. it's 21st century yet the world we live in has gone back to Dachau methods.
- ta11fd885e4ef4b 5mo ago
  [dead]
- Tuna-Fish 5mo ago
  There is no mechanism by which ELF or VLF could be accidentally received without physically large antennas, or very fancy signal processing. The wavelengths are just too long, VLF is 10-100km and ELF is longer. The slopes are just imperceptible. Imagine trying to notice a wave in water that's 10 km long (and not very tall). You cannot even transmit speech with ELF, it carries information so slowly it's only usable for more code or very slow digital signals. Heterodyne systems don't let you pack more information into a lower-frequency signal, they go the other way.
  - Lapsa 5mo ago
    Sounds like you know a thing or two which is what I appreciate. I don't know what's used and don't have a budget to perform any meaningful analysis. But I do know that GWEN towers are 30 years old tech that's capable of transmitting signal in 200mhz to whatever ghz range 200 miles afar. Frey effect according to wikipedia is audible in 200 mhz - 3 ghz range. According to James C Lin research - signal doesn't have to be strong (in fact, strong signal can get hazardous to health and used like a weapon like in Venezuela operation). Surely radio folks can match up 30 years old tech. And signal processing capabilities nowadays can get absurdly sophisticated.
  - Lapsa 5mo ago
    What are your thoughts on FMCW radars? "Emotion recognition method using millimetre wave radar based on deep learning" research paper is what I find interesting. There also exists research paper that deals with recognition of drivers behavior (logically meaning - FMCW radars are capable of locking onto moving targets in quite long radius). From what I understood (with my limited understanding of the subject) - such radars are capable of picking up EMG signals. and according to wikipedia - EMG is enough to feed neural networks and decipher so called "silent talk" aka your inner monologue.
Lapsa 5mo ago
also - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterodyne https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterodyne