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Personally I'd rather see the payment card companies nationalized. Make them operate at zero profit, and vastly reduce the friction in the flow of capital. Or,

Personally I'd rather see the payment card companies nationalized. Make them operate at zero profit, and vastly reduce the friction in the flow of capital. Or, if you prefer not to nationalize, institute a government-operated competing global payment card system that's free for merchants and consumers alike. Watch the payment card companies collapse under their own weight. It makes a lot of sense to me: the governments of the world are in the business of governing currency, and payment card systems are superseding that power. Time to take it back and return the power to citizens.

jivatmanx 14y ago
The actions of these companies were done at behest of the U.S. government. How would this problem be reduced if the companies were eliminated and a nationalized system implemented? And if you think nationalization will increase efficiency, please compare the U.S. post office to European post offices, which were nearly all privatized decades ago. (They're operating with significant profits b/c they've combined with convenience stores, allow you to opt out of spam, offer scanning services, etc)
- mullingitover 14y ago
  Well for one thing, the private nature of the card companies means that they can be 'pressured' by the government and they have no accountability. If the government operated the payment card systems, the constitutional constraints would apply (so for example, wikileaks could have some shelter under the first amendment). As for the postal system, it's being sabotaged from within - http://my.firedoglake.com/mmonk/2011/08/19/the-pre-funding-mandate-bringing-down-the-american-postal-workers-union/ http://my.firedoglake.com/mmonk/2011/08/19/the-pre-funding-m...
  - jivatmanx 14y ago
    The legal restitution is likely to be identical, as this is a post-Patriot act age of gag orders. However, with multiple competitors it's a lot harder to shut down something like wikileaks in a completely silent and uniform manner, without indication that it's been silenced. Most important of all, however, is that a us gov monopoly precludes the use of foreign competitors from countries with better speech laws. As far as the post office is concerned: Leaving their numerical financial situation aside (which is hard to ascertain exactly due to the opaque nature of government spending) there is simply no excuse for why, after decades and decades, they haven't implemented any of the modern efficiency mechanisms or services that modern post offices have.
    - mullingitover 14y ago
      Also as far as the post office is concerned: one troubled branch of the government != indictment of all government involvement in public utilities (which is what a government-operated payment card system would amount to). Not every government project is a bureaucratic failure. For example, this internet thing we're using to argue about how the government can't do anything right...

jivatmanx 14y ago

The actions of these companies were done at behest of the U.S. government. How would this problem be reduced if the companies were eliminated and a nationalized system implemented? And if you think nationalization will increase efficiency, please compare the U.S. post office to European post offices, which were nearly all privatized decades ago. (They're operating with significant profits b/c they've combined with convenience stores, allow you to opt out of spam, offer scanning services, etc)

mullingitover 14y ago
Well for one thing, the private nature of the card companies means that they can be 'pressured' by the government and they have no accountability. If the government operated the payment card systems, the constitutional constraints would apply (so for example, wikileaks could have some shelter under the first amendment). As for the postal system, it's being sabotaged from within - http://my.firedoglake.com/mmonk/2011/08/19/the-pre-funding-mandate-bringing-down-the-american-postal-workers-union/ http://my.firedoglake.com/mmonk/2011/08/19/the-pre-funding-m...
- jivatmanx 14y ago
  The legal restitution is likely to be identical, as this is a post-Patriot act age of gag orders. However, with multiple competitors it's a lot harder to shut down something like wikileaks in a completely silent and uniform manner, without indication that it's been silenced. Most important of all, however, is that a us gov monopoly precludes the use of foreign competitors from countries with better speech laws. As far as the post office is concerned: Leaving their numerical financial situation aside (which is hard to ascertain exactly due to the opaque nature of government spending) there is simply no excuse for why, after decades and decades, they haven't implemented any of the modern efficiency mechanisms or services that modern post offices have.
  - mullingitover 14y ago
    Also as far as the post office is concerned: one troubled branch of the government != indictment of all government involvement in public utilities (which is what a government-operated payment card system would amount to). Not every government project is a bureaucratic failure. For example, this internet thing we're using to argue about how the government can't do anything right...