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I really hate how German environmental activists resort to hyperbole and alarmist language by default when voicing concerns. This only makes it harder for me to
by gmueckl 6mo ago
I really hate how German environmental activists resort to hyperbole and alarmist language by default when voicing concerns. This only makes it harder for me to take them seriously.
And then there is this tried and true tradition of commissioning studies with the sole intent to support a predefined viewpoint rather than taking an unbiased approach. This makes it so hard to trust any information when political arguments become heated.
To make the connection back to the tunnel: it consumes a huge amount of concrete and that releases the associated amount of CO2. Thisnpart is fairly easy to estimate. But estimating the impact on traffic emissions is fraught with issues. There are so many assumptions about lifetime, amount of traffic, types of vehicles that I can easily imagine the error bars to stack up to the point where a little tuning of model parameters gives just about any desired result.
- lukan 6mo agoAgreed to that, but they are right with stating, that digging up so much ocean soil in a direct line might disrupt entire maritime ecosystems.
- peterfirefly 5mo ago"Environmentalists" also made a big fuzz about the Øresund connection, claiming that the artificial island midway would disrupt the entire Baltic Sea ecosystem by drastically reducing the flow of water. Didn't happen. The (fairly small) compensatory digging had the effect the engineers had calculated and the water flow actually increased slightly and the Baltic Sea ecosystem is fine -- or at least not harmed by this particular project. I think we should trust the people who can (and do) make calculations over those who can't (and don't).
- msandford 5mo agoThe tunnel will very likely be less disruptive to marine animals than ferry boats. During the construction yes it will be worse but 10 years after? The ecosystem will have forgotten the disruption and will have gained additional peace from reduced/eliminated ferries.
- lukan 5mo agoFerries do not mess up the ground and the riffs which is where most sea life is to be found. Big ships are only a problem to sea life if they dump their old oil there, their anchors ... or well, trawling (which is forbidden there for a reason).
- gmueckl 5mo agoShips also produce noise. At least marine mammals are affected by ship noises.
- tokai 5mo agoGerman environmental activists have always been like that. They also love to receive support from foreign state actors to harm Germany.
- lukan 5mo agoThey have been dogmatic, but the claim of being enemy agents would require a source for me.
- tokai 5mo agohttps://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/russia-funding-european-environmental-activists-202846 https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/russia-funding-europe... https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP85M00364R001001530019-5.pdf https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP85M00364R0010015...
- lukan 5mo agoWhere exactly is there a claim that "They also love to receive support from foreign state actors to harm Germany"? In the first link there the evidence is a statement from Hillary Clinton as well as unnamed other NATO members. "WWF Germany, BUND (Friends of the Earth), and NABU (Nature and Biodiversity Conservation Union), three environmental organisations who were avowed opponents of Germany’s NordStream pipelines with Russia, dropped their opposition after Gazprom promised funding for environmental protection" And this says they dropped opposition that the russian state does good for environment elsewhere, not that they get money. And the second link is about the peace movement which is not exactly the same.