4 ms·

I think it's actively harmful to your own cause when you suggest corruption without any evidence. Just because politicians don't take action on an issue you thi

I think it's actively harmful to your own cause when you suggest corruption without any evidence. Just because politicians don't take action on an issue you think is important doesn't mean they're corrupt. It's more likely that the issue you think is important is simply not important to most voters. Suggesting politicians are corrupt without any evidence will make that worse. If people think their politicians are corrupt they will further disengage with the political process, which will ensure there's even less pressure on politicians to take action on niche issues like this.

EmbarrassedHelp 5mo ago
The EU Commission was caught breaking the law in order to lobby for Chat Control: https://noyb.eu/en/gdpr-complaint-against-x-twitter-over-illegal-micro-targeting-chat-control-ads https://noyb.eu/en/gdpr-complaint-against-x-twitter-over-ill... The EU Commission also gave a foreign tech company called Thorn (they pretend to be a charity), special access to government officials: https://netzpolitik.org/2022/dude-wheres-my-privacy-how-a-hollywood-star-lobbies-the-eu-for-more-surveillance/ https://netzpolitik.org/2022/dude-wheres-my-privacy-how-a-ho... I think both of those cases would be examples of lobbying and corruption.
- surgical_fire 5mo ago
  The thing is that "The EU commission" is an entity composed os politicians, appointed by member states. It's little coincidence that national governments want Chat Control (laundering that through EU), and the EU parliament is the entity that shots it down (coincidentally the entity that is most beholden to the public). It would be nice to learn which comissioners are lobbying for it.
- armada651 5mo ago
  Neither examples are evidence of corruption. That doesn't mean they're not problematic, but there's no evidence here of a politician receiving a kickback for any of these actions.
  - Asraelite 5mo ago
    Corruption does not necessarily mean a politician receiving a kickback. It can be a lot more indirect and subversive.
  - hedora 5mo ago
    https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-ylva-johansson-csam-csa-regulation-european-commission-encryption-privacy-surveillance/ https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-y... $600K+ went to kickbacks, er… “lobbying”, and thorn was hit with some pretty nasty scandals involving sex crimes.
    - armada651 5mo ago
      That's my point though, conflating lobbying and corruption doesn't help. Both are indeed problematic, but unlike actual corruption lobbying can be countered with activism.
nolroz 5mo ago
I think a hearty fuck off is warranted for responses like this. What the shit do you base the converse off? Pretend there's no corruption and there won't be any??
- armada651 5mo ago
  Of course not, if there's evidence of corruption then those involved should be rooted out and prosecuted to the full extent of the law. What I'm saying is that if there's no evidence of corruption, then simply assuming corruption will harm your cause because it will make it seem like political activism is futile in the face of supposedly hidden corruption.
- labcomputer 5mo ago
  > Pretend there's no corruption and there won't be any?? If you look at that person's responses to others in this thread, that is exactly what they are doing. I do hope they have proper health and safety training for moving the goalposts so much.
varispeed 5mo ago
[flagged]

EmbarrassedHelp 5mo ago

The EU Commission was caught breaking the law in order to lobby for Chat Control: https://noyb.eu/en/gdpr-complaint-against-x-twitter-over-illegal-micro-targeting-chat-control-ads https://noyb.eu/en/gdpr-complaint-against-x-twitter-over-ill... The EU Commission also gave a foreign tech company called Thorn (they pretend to be a charity), special access to government officials: https://netzpolitik.org/2022/dude-wheres-my-privacy-how-a-hollywood-star-lobbies-the-eu-for-more-surveillance/ https://netzpolitik.org/2022/dude-wheres-my-privacy-how-a-ho... I think both of those cases would be examples of lobbying and corruption.

surgical_fire 5mo ago
The thing is that "The EU commission" is an entity composed os politicians, appointed by member states. It's little coincidence that national governments want Chat Control (laundering that through EU), and the EU parliament is the entity that shots it down (coincidentally the entity that is most beholden to the public). It would be nice to learn which comissioners are lobbying for it.
armada651 5mo ago
Neither examples are evidence of corruption. That doesn't mean they're not problematic, but there's no evidence here of a politician receiving a kickback for any of these actions.
- Asraelite 5mo ago
  Corruption does not necessarily mean a politician receiving a kickback. It can be a lot more indirect and subversive.
- hedora 5mo ago
  https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-ylva-johansson-csam-csa-regulation-european-commission-encryption-privacy-surveillance/ https://fortune.com/europe/2023/09/26/thorn-ashton-kutcher-y... $600K+ went to kickbacks, er… “lobbying”, and thorn was hit with some pretty nasty scandals involving sex crimes.
  - armada651 5mo ago
    That's my point though, conflating lobbying and corruption doesn't help. Both are indeed problematic, but unlike actual corruption lobbying can be countered with activism.

nolroz 5mo ago

I think a hearty fuck off is warranted for responses like this. What the shit do you base the converse off? Pretend there's no corruption and there won't be any??

armada651 5mo ago
Of course not, if there's evidence of corruption then those involved should be rooted out and prosecuted to the full extent of the law. What I'm saying is that if there's no evidence of corruption, then simply assuming corruption will harm your cause because it will make it seem like political activism is futile in the face of supposedly hidden corruption.
labcomputer 5mo ago
> Pretend there's no corruption and there won't be any?? If you look at that person's responses to others in this thread, that is exactly what they are doing. I do hope they have proper health and safety training for moving the goalposts so much.

varispeed 5mo ago

[flagged]