4 ms·

Owing child support is a negative on children and society in general, but I'm sure there are plenty who will argue in favor of it.

by UberFly 5mo ago

mjd 5mo ago
I accidentally read the comments on the post and got as far as this one: “Honestly, since we're going towards socialism, we need to abolish child support. Women have the right to get an abortion because it is their body their choice. A man has to use his body …” That was enough for me.
- eowln 5mo ago
  [flagged]
  - deleted 5mo ago
    [deleted]
  - atmavatar 5mo ago
    It's rather unfortunate that so many people are against genuine equality when it comes to reproductive rights. While it makes perfect sense to me that a pregnant woman should have final (only?) say in whether or not she carries a child to term, it strikes me as rather off that: * Outside of marriage, the biological father has no rights when it comes to participating in their child's life, whether we're talking custody or mere visitation. * The father has no right to avoid child support despite having no say in either its birth or participation in their lives. * Upon being targeted by the state for child support responsibilities, the court system virtually never allows cessation of payments upon a failed paternity test (i.e., paternity fraud). Note: roughly 30% of paternity tests that are performed reveal children are not biologically related to their presumed fathers. * In about half the states, it's illegal to even perform a paternity test without consent of the mother. I do find it fascinating that many people will use the very same blase "you should have thought of that before having sex" dismissals when bringing up any of the above issues as are used so often against women fighting for their right to abortion. tl;dr: child support should be linked with visitation/custody rights. If a father abandons or is denied those rights, they should be absolved of child support, especially if it's proven they aren't actually the biological father.
- piltdownman 5mo ago
  I mean that's just reductio ad absurdum to be haughtily oblique about the whole issue. Social programs =/= socialism. There are plenty of capitalist economies with robust social safety nets - most EU countries provide free healthcare, education, and forms of UBI in the forms of grants for artists and social welfare for those incapable of working.
bsder 5mo ago
I don't have much of a problem with the $100K penalties. I have a lot more issue with a $2.5K limit--that could be just one or two (intentionally or unintentionally) misreported payments. Or a paycheck hiccup. Or a layoff. Or a government error (because we all know how infallible DOGE was). Or a government shutdown. Or ... We specifically decry the concepts of debtor's prisons and social credit in the US. For good reasons. This is leaving aside the whole discussion about your passport being an identity document that isn't subject to control of a single US state government like your driver's license.
- bawolff 5mo ago
  > I have a lot more issue with a $2.5K limit--that could be just one or two (intentionally or unintentionally) misreported payments. Or a paycheck hiccup. Or a layoff. Or a government error (because we all know how infallible DOGE was). Or a government shutdown. Or ... In all of those situations, the child still has needs that need to be paid for.
  - actionfromafar 5mo ago
    But it's a small sum of money for potentially a large screwup with potential permanent side effects, like losing a cross border job. Of course, cross border anything is less and less likely these days.
  - rho138 5mo ago
    Then those responsibilities should fall on the state. If we all give a shit that kids are going without then lets solve the issue instead of ringing out our pearls.
  - potsandpans 5mo ago
    Your right, let's jail the parent until they pay.
RiverCrochet 5mo ago
I never understood this line of logic: - X doesn't pay child support because X lost their job. - X gets their driver's license revoked because they missed child support payments. So ... how are you supposed to find a new job with out a car in most U.S. communities? This doesn't improve the situation for anyone involved, but allows the state to make it much, much worse.
- marcusverus 5mo ago
  Who said anything about revoking drivers licenses?
  - casefields 5mo ago
    California revoked license to those who dont pay child support. Many other states do it too.
  - RiverCrochet 5mo ago
    Every state it seems. I found this link informative. https://www.ncsl.org/human-services/license-restrictions-for-failure-to-pay-child-support https://www.ncsl.org/human-services/license-restrictions-for...
    - mothballed 5mo ago
      Whoever had the idea of revoking business and professional licenses of those behind on paying their kids were real geniuses. I can understand doing it after a contempt hearing where it was determined the person absolutely will not be using them to help the child.... but an administrative revocation for being delinquent is insane. It's crazy how obsessed America is with kicking people in the teeth when they are down. Your kids are broke? Sorry, we won't help you, but how about we take away your ability to work domestically or abroad.
- Henchman21 5mo ago
  [flagged]

Owing child support is a negative on children and society in general, but I'm sure there are plenty who will argue in favor of it.

by UberFly 5mo ago

Owing child support is a negative on children and society in general, but I'm sure there are plenty who will argue in favor of it.

mjd 5mo ago

I accidentally read the comments on the post and got as far as this one: “Honestly, since we're going towards socialism, we need to abolish child support. Women have the right to get an abortion because it is their body their choice. A man has to use his body …” That was enough for me.

eowln 5mo ago
[flagged]
- deleted 5mo ago
  [deleted]
- atmavatar 5mo ago
  It's rather unfortunate that so many people are against genuine equality when it comes to reproductive rights. While it makes perfect sense to me that a pregnant woman should have final (only?) say in whether or not she carries a child to term, it strikes me as rather off that: * Outside of marriage, the biological father has no rights when it comes to participating in their child's life, whether we're talking custody or mere visitation. * The father has no right to avoid child support despite having no say in either its birth or participation in their lives. * Upon being targeted by the state for child support responsibilities, the court system virtually never allows cessation of payments upon a failed paternity test (i.e., paternity fraud). Note: roughly 30% of paternity tests that are performed reveal children are not biologically related to their presumed fathers. * In about half the states, it's illegal to even perform a paternity test without consent of the mother. I do find it fascinating that many people will use the very same blase "you should have thought of that before having sex" dismissals when bringing up any of the above issues as are used so often against women fighting for their right to abortion. tl;dr: child support should be linked with visitation/custody rights. If a father abandons or is denied those rights, they should be absolved of child support, especially if it's proven they aren't actually the biological father.
piltdownman 5mo ago
I mean that's just reductio ad absurdum to be haughtily oblique about the whole issue. Social programs =/= socialism. There are plenty of capitalist economies with robust social safety nets - most EU countries provide free healthcare, education, and forms of UBI in the forms of grants for artists and social welfare for those incapable of working.

bsder 5mo ago

I don't have much of a problem with the $100K penalties. I have a lot more issue with a $2.5K limit--that could be just one or two (intentionally or unintentionally) misreported payments. Or a paycheck hiccup. Or a layoff. Or a government error (because we all know how infallible DOGE was). Or a government shutdown. Or ... We specifically decry the concepts of debtor's prisons and social credit in the US. For good reasons. This is leaving aside the whole discussion about your passport being an identity document that isn't subject to control of a single US state government like your driver's license.

bawolff 5mo ago
> I have a lot more issue with a $2.5K limit--that could be just one or two (intentionally or unintentionally) misreported payments. Or a paycheck hiccup. Or a layoff. Or a government error (because we all know how infallible DOGE was). Or a government shutdown. Or ... In all of those situations, the child still has needs that need to be paid for.
- actionfromafar 5mo ago
  But it's a small sum of money for potentially a large screwup with potential permanent side effects, like losing a cross border job. Of course, cross border anything is less and less likely these days.
- rho138 5mo ago
  Then those responsibilities should fall on the state. If we all give a shit that kids are going without then lets solve the issue instead of ringing out our pearls.
- potsandpans 5mo ago
  Your right, let's jail the parent until they pay.

RiverCrochet 5mo ago

I never understood this line of logic: - X doesn't pay child support because X lost their job. - X gets their driver's license revoked because they missed child support payments. So ... how are you supposed to find a new job with out a car in most U.S. communities? This doesn't improve the situation for anyone involved, but allows the state to make it much, much worse.

marcusverus 5mo ago
Who said anything about revoking drivers licenses?
- casefields 5mo ago
  California revoked license to those who dont pay child support. Many other states do it too.
- RiverCrochet 5mo ago
  Every state it seems. I found this link informative. https://www.ncsl.org/human-services/license-restrictions-for-failure-to-pay-child-support https://www.ncsl.org/human-services/license-restrictions-for...
  - mothballed 5mo ago
    Whoever had the idea of revoking business and professional licenses of those behind on paying their kids were real geniuses. I can understand doing it after a contempt hearing where it was determined the person absolutely will not be using them to help the child.... but an administrative revocation for being delinquent is insane. It's crazy how obsessed America is with kicking people in the teeth when they are down. Your kids are broke? Sorry, we won't help you, but how about we take away your ability to work domestically or abroad.
Henchman21 5mo ago
[flagged]