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This seems like confirmation bias, mixed with a healthy dose of overestimating the importance of your profession. If a similar story came out about Obama's cam

This seems like confirmation bias, mixed with a healthy dose of overestimating the importance of your profession. If a similar story came out about Obama's campaign, would you have really written that it's crazy that he got elected? I'm not a Romney fan, and I think this story should be embarrassing for him, but let's not get carried away. Running a software project (even if not directly) is notoriously hard. Make it a prerequisite to be a presidential candidate at your peril.

thrownaway2424 14y ago
Running the nation isn't easy, either. You're supposed to delegate responsibility to people who know what they are doing.
pwthornton 14y ago
I do agree that presidents shouldn't need to be technologists. It's nice if they are, but being able to run a software product is not the most important thing for a potential president to run. However, that doesn't mean lessons can't be gleamed and abstracted. The President has to outsource a lot of knowledge and work. Presidents are typically experts at something, but not at most things. President Obama is a former Constitutional Law Professor. It's reasonable to assume that he understands Constitutional Law at a very high level; it's also reasonable to assume that Constitutional Law is one of the few things that he has a very high level of expertise at. All Presidents have to work with other experts and teams to get things done. The fact that Governor Romney's tech teams failed so badly can be looked at a mark of his management abilities. He doesn't need to be a tech expert, but he does need to know how to put the right people in place to be successful. I look at these failings as a case study as to what could of happened with other areas Governor Romney could have had to outsource: defense leadership, diplomacy, transportation policy and vision, etc. At some point, you can't pass the buck. Steve Jobs said reasons stop mattering when you hit the vp level at Apple. Assuredly reasons have to stop mattering when you reach the level of potential president of the United States of America.
james-skemp 14y ago
I don't think he was focusing on the software aspect, as much as the business aspect. Again, I might be bias, but I agree with him, and if Obama had the same mess of where money was going to, I'd be disappointed. This doesn't read like a leader/manager controlling where time and money is spent, but rather a bunch of people going their own route and buying whatever servers their needs. As a developer, I'd definitely like the latter route. But after time you come to realize that management stepping in and focusing direction is what's really best in the long term. And if you can't do it yourself, you delegate to someone who can. In short, this looks like what happens when the workers are running the show, instead of working together under a single driving force.
- mikeash 14y ago
  > I don't think he was focusing on the software aspect, as much as the business aspect. You're exactly right. We don't really know much of the software side anyway, aside from little details like that it was not adequately tested. I'd be thinking the same thing if a similar failure had happened in any area of Romney's campaign, it just so happens that software failure is 1) what happened and 2) is what gets discussed on HN.
- Evbn 14y ago
  It is hardly an improvement to have centralized micromanagement instead of getting whatever serves their needs.
uptown 14y ago
"Running a software project (even if not directly) is notoriously hard. Make it a prerequisite to be a presidential candidate at your peril." Isn't that essentially the entire premise of effective leadership? Substitute "software project" with "X" - knowing who to bring on-board, and how to execute by effectively using those resources to the best of your and their ability despite an endless stream of opposition.
mikeash 14y ago
Yes, if a similar story came out about Obama, I would probably say the same thing. Why not? Don't assume I'm automatically for the "other guy" just because I'm against Romney. As for overestimating the importance of my profession, I don't buy it. It's the importance of project management, not software, that's in play here. The president needs to be the sort of person who can find people who will know that Best Buy is a bad choice. He doesn't need to actually know it himself, but he absolutely needs to be able to find them, in all sorts of areas, and then listen to them. Honestly, if I had my way, not a single presidential candidate since I've been alive would be qualified. I think our current politicians are atrociously bad. So your point that the bar I'm setting is too high for current candidates may be true, but I don't think it makes me wrong.

thrownaway2424 14y ago

Running the nation isn't easy, either. You're supposed to delegate responsibility to people who know what they are doing.

pwthornton 14y ago

I do agree that presidents shouldn't need to be technologists. It's nice if they are, but being able to run a software product is not the most important thing for a potential president to run. However, that doesn't mean lessons can't be gleamed and abstracted. The President has to outsource a lot of knowledge and work. Presidents are typically experts at something, but not at most things. President Obama is a former Constitutional Law Professor. It's reasonable to assume that he understands Constitutional Law at a very high level; it's also reasonable to assume that Constitutional Law is one of the few things that he has a very high level of expertise at. All Presidents have to work with other experts and teams to get things done. The fact that Governor Romney's tech teams failed so badly can be looked at a mark of his management abilities. He doesn't need to be a tech expert, but he does need to know how to put the right people in place to be successful. I look at these failings as a case study as to what could of happened with other areas Governor Romney could have had to outsource: defense leadership, diplomacy, transportation policy and vision, etc. At some point, you can't pass the buck. Steve Jobs said reasons stop mattering when you hit the vp level at Apple. Assuredly reasons have to stop mattering when you reach the level of potential president of the United States of America.

james-skemp 14y ago

I don't think he was focusing on the software aspect, as much as the business aspect. Again, I might be bias, but I agree with him, and if Obama had the same mess of where money was going to, I'd be disappointed. This doesn't read like a leader/manager controlling where time and money is spent, but rather a bunch of people going their own route and buying whatever servers their needs. As a developer, I'd definitely like the latter route. But after time you come to realize that management stepping in and focusing direction is what's really best in the long term. And if you can't do it yourself, you delegate to someone who can. In short, this looks like what happens when the workers are running the show, instead of working together under a single driving force.

mikeash 14y ago
> I don't think he was focusing on the software aspect, as much as the business aspect. You're exactly right. We don't really know much of the software side anyway, aside from little details like that it was not adequately tested. I'd be thinking the same thing if a similar failure had happened in any area of Romney's campaign, it just so happens that software failure is 1) what happened and 2) is what gets discussed on HN.
Evbn 14y ago
It is hardly an improvement to have centralized micromanagement instead of getting whatever serves their needs.

uptown 14y ago

"Running a software project (even if not directly) is notoriously hard. Make it a prerequisite to be a presidential candidate at your peril." Isn't that essentially the entire premise of effective leadership? Substitute "software project" with "X" - knowing who to bring on-board, and how to execute by effectively using those resources to the best of your and their ability despite an endless stream of opposition.

mikeash 14y ago

Yes, if a similar story came out about Obama, I would probably say the same thing. Why not? Don't assume I'm automatically for the "other guy" just because I'm against Romney. As for overestimating the importance of my profession, I don't buy it. It's the importance of project management, not software, that's in play here. The president needs to be the sort of person who can find people who will know that Best Buy is a bad choice. He doesn't need to actually know it himself, but he absolutely needs to be able to find them, in all sorts of areas, and then listen to them. Honestly, if I had my way, not a single presidential candidate since I've been alive would be qualified. I think our current politicians are atrociously bad. So your point that the bar I'm setting is too high for current candidates may be true, but I don't think it makes me wrong.