4 ms·

> In the real world, the internet is TCP/IP I guess he missed http3, which now makes up 35% of web traffic.

by stkdump 5mo ago

ablob 5mo ago
http3 operates on a different OSI layer
- stkdump 5mo ago
  Yes, which the article claims is just a theory now, irrelevant for the real world. More crucially though, http3 doesn't use TCP because it is built on top of UDP.
  - magicalhippo 5mo ago
    It's like how people say "pass me the butter" despite there's just a tub of margarine on the table.
wmf 5mo ago
Technically the Internet runs on "the Internet Protocol Suite" but people just say "TCP/IP" for short. That doesn't mean to exclude UDP, SCTP, or whatever.
- stkdump 5mo ago
  So what exactly does he mean then?
  - wmf 5mo ago
    He means the Internet runs on the Internet Protocol Suite and not the "superior" OSI Protocol Suite (that people under age 50 have never heard of because it failed).
    - p_l 5mo ago
      And because of that, badly reinvented mostly through HTTP
    - opan 5mo ago
      The OSI model still gets taught in networking classes to people in their teens and 20s.
      - justin66 5mo ago
        That was baffling a quarter of a century ago and it's even more baffling now.
    - deleted 5mo ago
      [deleted]
marshray 5mo ago
> something that comes from consensus from a big, top-down standardisation body usually fails. So IETF is the "big, top-down standardisation body" producing "bloated, inefficient and largely unused standards" here? Wouldn't be the first time someone characterized it as such. > The internet is an example of the implementation of a top-down approach when a scientist submits a paper for an RFC and iterates on it until it's de-facto protocol of the internet. Yeah, he must be talking about the IETF. Very consensus-driven, most participants funded by vendors, difficult to iterate after RFC approval. > While their nimbler competition is being adopted, iterated, and expanded. In the internet protocol use cases, OSI Model is now essentially just a theory taught in networking training, certification, and classes. In the real world, the internet is TCP/IP, and it's TCP IP that runs on computers, phones, and other devices. Now I'm confused. TCP/IP are literally defined by IETF RFCs.

> In the real world, the internet is TCP/IP I guess he missed http3, which now makes up 35% of web traffic.

by stkdump 5mo ago

> In the real world, the internet is TCP/IP I guess he missed http3, which now makes up 35% of web traffic.

ablob 5mo ago

http3 operates on a different OSI layer

stkdump 5mo ago
Yes, which the article claims is just a theory now, irrelevant for the real world. More crucially though, http3 doesn't use TCP because it is built on top of UDP.
- magicalhippo 5mo ago
  It's like how people say "pass me the butter" despite there's just a tub of margarine on the table.

wmf 5mo ago

Technically the Internet runs on "the Internet Protocol Suite" but people just say "TCP/IP" for short. That doesn't mean to exclude UDP, SCTP, or whatever.

stkdump 5mo ago
So what exactly does he mean then?
- wmf 5mo ago
  He means the Internet runs on the Internet Protocol Suite and not the "superior" OSI Protocol Suite (that people under age 50 have never heard of because it failed).
  - p_l 5mo ago
    And because of that, badly reinvented mostly through HTTP
  - opan 5mo ago
    The OSI model still gets taught in networking classes to people in their teens and 20s.
    - justin66 5mo ago
      That was baffling a quarter of a century ago and it's even more baffling now.
  - deleted 5mo ago
    [deleted]

marshray 5mo ago

> something that comes from consensus from a big, top-down standardisation body usually fails. So IETF is the "big, top-down standardisation body" producing "bloated, inefficient and largely unused standards" here? Wouldn't be the first time someone characterized it as such. > The internet is an example of the implementation of a top-down approach when a scientist submits a paper for an RFC and iterates on it until it's de-facto protocol of the internet. Yeah, he must be talking about the IETF. Very consensus-driven, most participants funded by vendors, difficult to iterate after RFC approval. > While their nimbler competition is being adopted, iterated, and expanded. In the internet protocol use cases, OSI Model is now essentially just a theory taught in networking training, certification, and classes. In the real world, the internet is TCP/IP, and it's TCP IP that runs on computers, phones, and other devices. Now I'm confused. TCP/IP are literally defined by IETF RFCs.