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I mean what is real work anyways? Like take finance where people just email broken spreadsheets around all day. If they stop doing that then farmers can't get

I mean what is real work anyways? Like take finance where people just email broken spreadsheets around all day. If they stop doing that then farmers can't get loans to buy crops which means crops don't get planted and so on-so-forth. Certainly emailing spreadsheets doesn't seem very "real" but there's actual value in providing liquidity it's just not physically demanding. On the flip side, professional sports is very physically demanding but can you really call what kids do for fun "real work"?

ryanmcbride 6mo ago
From the perspective of these kids real work probably involves working with your hands. I don't think we need to get too upset over what people who have yet to enter the workforce have to say about "real work". They need to be employed for a few years before they learn the lesson that almost ALL work is fake work.
- bombcar 6mo ago
  My definition of real work is - can I point at something and be proud of it? It might not even be something physical (but often is) and my involvement may not be obvious (say, managing the spreadsheets for a building project), but there it is, the thing I worked on.
  - hirvi74 6mo ago
    That seems like more of test of self-esteem. I can work on something yet still not be proud of it, for example.
    - bombcar 6mo ago
      Yes - but it’s part of it for me. Digging a giant hole would be real hard work, and something I can point at, but I might not be proud of it; it may have no point.
      - hirvi74 6mo ago
        Sure, and my goal is to not that part away from you. Just to clarify, if said hole had no point, then would it be real work or not? What if the hole was merely a step in a grand plan? As in, if the end result provides a sense of pride, then does the aggregated amount of real vs. fake work that lead to final product have any bearing on the pride of the final product?
        bombcar 6mo ago
        I guess it comes down to the teleology - the reason why the work is done. If the end has no relation to the work (e.g., it comes down to the dollars) then I think you’re going to be a bit unsatisfied no matter how well remunerated. Terms like “pointless” and “busywork” come into play.
Henchman21 6mo ago
It if makes you tired and you're tired of it, it's work.

ryanmcbride 6mo ago

From the perspective of these kids real work probably involves working with your hands. I don't think we need to get too upset over what people who have yet to enter the workforce have to say about "real work". They need to be employed for a few years before they learn the lesson that almost ALL work is fake work.

bombcar 6mo ago
My definition of real work is - can I point at something and be proud of it? It might not even be something physical (but often is) and my involvement may not be obvious (say, managing the spreadsheets for a building project), but there it is, the thing I worked on.
- hirvi74 6mo ago
  That seems like more of test of self-esteem. I can work on something yet still not be proud of it, for example.
  - bombcar 6mo ago
    Yes - but it’s part of it for me. Digging a giant hole would be real hard work, and something I can point at, but I might not be proud of it; it may have no point.
    - hirvi74 6mo ago
      Sure, and my goal is to not that part away from you. Just to clarify, if said hole had no point, then would it be real work or not? What if the hole was merely a step in a grand plan? As in, if the end result provides a sense of pride, then does the aggregated amount of real vs. fake work that lead to final product have any bearing on the pride of the final product?
      - bombcar 6mo ago
        I guess it comes down to the teleology - the reason why the work is done. If the end has no relation to the work (e.g., it comes down to the dollars) then I think you’re going to be a bit unsatisfied no matter how well remunerated. Terms like “pointless” and “busywork” come into play.

Henchman21 6mo ago

It if makes you tired and you're tired of it, it's work.