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Anthropic doesn't even use their own harnesses for their support chatbots (they're using fin.ai) - that's how little support matters to them. Seems like either

by avree 5mo ago

Anthropic doesn't even use their own harnesses for their support chatbots (they're using fin.ai) - that's how little support matters to them. Seems like either you get attention on HN, know someone working there, or are at a large enough company to have an enterprise contact - otherwise, no reply.

yu3zhou4 5mo ago
Maybe it’s in order to have an external provider to blame for failures and shift the blame/responsibility?
- pdpi 5mo ago
  A less cynical explanation is that it helps decouple product failures from support failures. Last thing you want is for your customer support to break whenever your product breaks.
  - lwhi 5mo ago
    That makes good sense
  - yu3zhou4 5mo ago
    Good idea, too! Why do you see my explanation as cynical, though?
    - irthomasthomas 5mo ago
      A cynic is what an optimist calls a realist.
    - pdpi 5mo ago
      Your explanation is literally "blame somebody else, shift responsibility". It's a pretty straightforward case of assuming bad intentions. Obviously, I don't know for a fact what Anthropic's motivations are, but I don't believe I'm being overly optimistic because I know for a fact that "use a third party as a way to de-risk" is a tried and true strategy. E.g. when I was at Facebook, all regular day-to-day comms were on Workplace, but they kept an IRC server hosted by some vendor or other, specifically to coordinate responses for serious SEVs that disrupted the normal channels. Of course, an even simpler explanation is that they perceive building their own support harness as just low value work for engineers who could be working on their core product instead, and the cost of buying that service from somebody else is probably a drop in the ocean.
Master_Odin 5mo ago
They saw how Google providing absolutely terrible customer service for a very long time has done nothing to hurt their bottom line and decided to copy.
- itsthejb 5mo ago
  Tell me about it. As an individual user you absolutely CANNOT get support is some (if not many or all) circumstances. It’s really quite shocking
  - mothballed 5mo ago
    We all miss the old days of calling a real Filipino or Dominican slave-center where you got a script loop or suddenly the English runs out whenever it's time to ask for a refund.
    - jack_pp 5mo ago
      In the good old days of 2011 when I started to learn C++ "for real" I did it using learncpp.com, google and "support" from freenode's #c++ where truly masterful wizards would help me with the most inane questions. I don't think anything I've ever found has come close to freenode's level of "support". In the old days where we didn't depend on services and everything was local even if you needed something truly arcane if you knew where to ask you could find a niche expert willing to help out or at least that's how I remember it. Nowadays if you have a problem with a service you literally are shit out of luck because there is absolutely NOTHING you can do about it, you can't debug it, you can't hack it, NOTHING.
      - cwnyth 5mo ago
        I truly miss those days. Programming forums from the turn of the millennium were very exciting places. I still have my account on Linux Forums from 2004, but it seems the rest are long gone. And no one will ever convince me that Discord is an adequate replacement for IRC.
      - 5mo ago
conception 5mo ago
Huh? Why wouldn’t they just spin up the current help-desk darling? (Intercom) Rolling their own seems silly.
- stevenally 5mo ago
  "Rolling their own seems silly". But isn't AI going to destroy all current software vendors?? Everybody is going to roll their own?? In fact, AIs will handle all support autonomously?? I mean they can spin up their database if needed?? What more do they need? Hence the SAAS apocalypse... Oh wait... this sarcasm will get me targeted by the LessWrong AI god when he/she/it becomes omnipotent....
  - hluska 5mo ago
    The sarcasm is neither funny nor well written. Nobody will care.
kashunstva 5mo ago
> that's how little support matters to them I’m coming up on my one year anniversary of having my Claude Pro account terminated for reasons that to this day remain an utter mystery. “Here, submit this Google form and we’ll look at it.” They have never done so in the one year since this happened. Once I interacted with what seemed like a human; but weeks later it was replaced with the brain dead fin.ai At least they did not steal my money; so I should be grateful for that. But as a small potatoes user, I advise everyone contemplating dealing with this user-disrespecting company to walk away.

by avree 5mo ago

yu3zhou4 5mo ago

Maybe it’s in order to have an external provider to blame for failures and shift the blame/responsibility?

pdpi 5mo ago
A less cynical explanation is that it helps decouple product failures from support failures. Last thing you want is for your customer support to break whenever your product breaks.
- lwhi 5mo ago
  That makes good sense
- yu3zhou4 5mo ago
  Good idea, too! Why do you see my explanation as cynical, though?
  - irthomasthomas 5mo ago
    A cynic is what an optimist calls a realist.
  - pdpi 5mo ago
    Your explanation is literally "blame somebody else, shift responsibility". It's a pretty straightforward case of assuming bad intentions. Obviously, I don't know for a fact what Anthropic's motivations are, but I don't believe I'm being overly optimistic because I know for a fact that "use a third party as a way to de-risk" is a tried and true strategy. E.g. when I was at Facebook, all regular day-to-day comms were on Workplace, but they kept an IRC server hosted by some vendor or other, specifically to coordinate responses for serious SEVs that disrupted the normal channels. Of course, an even simpler explanation is that they perceive building their own support harness as just low value work for engineers who could be working on their core product instead, and the cost of buying that service from somebody else is probably a drop in the ocean.

Master_Odin 5mo ago

They saw how Google providing absolutely terrible customer service for a very long time has done nothing to hurt their bottom line and decided to copy.

itsthejb 5mo ago
Tell me about it. As an individual user you absolutely CANNOT get support is some (if not many or all) circumstances. It’s really quite shocking
- mothballed 5mo ago
  We all miss the old days of calling a real Filipino or Dominican slave-center where you got a script loop or suddenly the English runs out whenever it's time to ask for a refund.
  - jack_pp 5mo ago
    In the good old days of 2011 when I started to learn C++ "for real" I did it using learncpp.com, google and "support" from freenode's #c++ where truly masterful wizards would help me with the most inane questions. I don't think anything I've ever found has come close to freenode's level of "support". In the old days where we didn't depend on services and everything was local even if you needed something truly arcane if you knew where to ask you could find a niche expert willing to help out or at least that's how I remember it. Nowadays if you have a problem with a service you literally are shit out of luck because there is absolutely NOTHING you can do about it, you can't debug it, you can't hack it, NOTHING.
    - cwnyth 5mo ago
      I truly miss those days. Programming forums from the turn of the millennium were very exciting places. I still have my account on Linux Forums from 2004, but it seems the rest are long gone. And no one will ever convince me that Discord is an adequate replacement for IRC.
    - 5mo ago

conception 5mo ago

Huh? Why wouldn’t they just spin up the current help-desk darling? (Intercom) Rolling their own seems silly.

stevenally 5mo ago
"Rolling their own seems silly". But isn't AI going to destroy all current software vendors?? Everybody is going to roll their own?? In fact, AIs will handle all support autonomously?? I mean they can spin up their database if needed?? What more do they need? Hence the SAAS apocalypse... Oh wait... this sarcasm will get me targeted by the LessWrong AI god when he/she/it becomes omnipotent....
- hluska 5mo ago
  The sarcasm is neither funny nor well written. Nobody will care.

kashunstva 5mo ago

> that's how little support matters to them I’m coming up on my one year anniversary of having my Claude Pro account terminated for reasons that to this day remain an utter mystery. “Here, submit this Google form and we’ll look at it.” They have never done so in the one year since this happened. Once I interacted with what seemed like a human; but weeks later it was replaced with the brain dead fin.ai At least they did not steal my money; so I should be grateful for that. But as a small potatoes user, I advise everyone contemplating dealing with this user-disrespecting company to walk away.