4 ms·

>It’s like saying my car isn’t really a car because I can’t adjust spark timing. What if it only drives along select predetermined monetised routes?

kuboble 6mo ago
Even a car that you are not allowed to drive at all is still a car. It just isn't your car.
- falcor84 6mo ago
  Exactly! Our argument shouldn't be about the device's capabilities, but about its ownership. And increasingly, as this enshittification progresses, the person buying the device is becoming less and less its owner.
- modo_mario 6mo ago
  Sure. But a taxi is a car yet it doesn't quite take up the same mental spots. People will say they came by taxi instead of by car. People won't say they don't see the value in selfdriving capabilities or repairability because they can just get a taxi. Etc
sudb 6mo ago
I think we call those buses, usually!
- PurpleRamen 6mo ago
  No, a Bus is a big car with more space for passengers. The Route has no relation to the naming.
brookst 6mo ago
What if my aunt had three wheels? I don’t see the value in hypotheticals like that. If the claim is that a computer is not really a computer unless every user can do any low level operations they want, is it also true that a car is not really a car unless every user can do any low level operations they want?
- gosub100 6mo ago
  Manufacturers are taking away right to repair too! I think you picked a bad example. Back in the 60s you absolutely could change every low level component on a car.
dpark 6mo ago
That’s still a car. You could own a race car that cannot legally be driven on any public roads and it’s still a car. I agree with brookst that this sort of redefinition is a poor rhetorical tool.
- modo_mario 6mo ago
  Well it's still a vehicle but once something sufficiently deviates in form or function or the like it will no longer primarily be called that. People usually say they took a taxi for example rather saying they came by car even when every taxi is a car. Once that happens they start taking up different mental spots and comparisons between them start to make less and less sense. (saying you don't see the value of self driving capabilities because you can just get a taxi for example.)
  - dpark 6mo ago
    > it will no longer primarily be called that This isn’t relevant. Taxis are still cars and that’s something the vast majority of people would agree with. The fact that they have a more specific name doesn’t change anything. A Bungalow is still a house. A skyscraper is still a building. A panini is still a sandwich. A taxi is still a car.
pcthrowaway 6mo ago
Then it's a streetcar

kuboble 6mo ago

Even a car that you are not allowed to drive at all is still a car. It just isn't your car.

falcor84 6mo ago
Exactly! Our argument shouldn't be about the device's capabilities, but about its ownership. And increasingly, as this enshittification progresses, the person buying the device is becoming less and less its owner.
modo_mario 6mo ago
Sure. But a taxi is a car yet it doesn't quite take up the same mental spots. People will say they came by taxi instead of by car. People won't say they don't see the value in selfdriving capabilities or repairability because they can just get a taxi. Etc

sudb 6mo ago

I think we call those buses, usually!

PurpleRamen 6mo ago
No, a Bus is a big car with more space for passengers. The Route has no relation to the naming.

brookst 6mo ago

What if my aunt had three wheels? I don’t see the value in hypotheticals like that. If the claim is that a computer is not really a computer unless every user can do any low level operations they want, is it also true that a car is not really a car unless every user can do any low level operations they want?

gosub100 6mo ago
Manufacturers are taking away right to repair too! I think you picked a bad example. Back in the 60s you absolutely could change every low level component on a car.

dpark 6mo ago

That’s still a car. You could own a race car that cannot legally be driven on any public roads and it’s still a car. I agree with brookst that this sort of redefinition is a poor rhetorical tool.

modo_mario 6mo ago
Well it's still a vehicle but once something sufficiently deviates in form or function or the like it will no longer primarily be called that. People usually say they took a taxi for example rather saying they came by car even when every taxi is a car. Once that happens they start taking up different mental spots and comparisons between them start to make less and less sense. (saying you don't see the value of self driving capabilities because you can just get a taxi for example.)
- dpark 6mo ago
  > it will no longer primarily be called that This isn’t relevant. Taxis are still cars and that’s something the vast majority of people would agree with. The fact that they have a more specific name doesn’t change anything. A Bungalow is still a house. A skyscraper is still a building. A panini is still a sandwich. A taxi is still a car.

pcthrowaway 6mo ago

Then it's a streetcar