4 ms·

With Sinofsky gone and Start8 selling well, will MS add the start menu back?

17 points by Breakthrough 14y ago

arocks 14y ago
Microsoft has a history of maintaining backward compatibility even at the expense of a less clean design. In that context, bringing back the start button sounds very plausible.
meaty 14y ago
They better do as to be honest, I'll be fucked if I'm going to use it any more unless it happens. Historically, I have used Windows 8 from CP, to RP and now RTM exclusively. Unfortunately, I now have to use RDP and as a VMware guest regularly, which due to the hot corners and the fact that some apps whinge about resolution being low if you run in a smaller than 1378x768 window, it is absolutely unusable. It's so backwards it's sickening.
- xradionut 14y ago
  Windows 8 works best as a VMWare guest OS. :)
mtgx 14y ago
Will they stop forcing me to use all the Metro stuff while in desktop mode, too? That's what I want to know. I installed Windows 8 on a laptop, and I immediately felt the need to have the start button back and get rid of the annoying "Charms", and also of the Metro start screen, which is completely useless and space-wasteful in desktop mode. But then I realized - why do I even bother with all these hacks, to make it look like a more "regular" Windows, when I can just use Windows 7? Besides all those annoyances, I didn't find that the desktop mode of Windows 8 offered me any real advantages over Windows 7. It's more like a SP2 for Windows 7.
- whalesalad 14y ago
  I really like the chrome and general UX enhancements in Windows 8. Aero from Win 7 is hard for me to look at. My biggest frustration with Win8 is indeed its lack of a traditional start-style desktop experience.
  - mtgx 14y ago
    Then just disable Aero.
kmfrk 14y ago
But their “telemetry data” and “Customer Experience Improvement Program”! Seriously, I’m not joking: http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/28/3274107/windows-8-start-menu-samsung-s-launcher-widget-app http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/28/3274107/windows-8-start-me.... Well, I am, but at the expense of Microsoft. I have no problem with the new system, but I am not the median Windows user. Microsoft’s design by committee and telemetry data sound like self-parody, to be perfectly honest. And now that we’re at it, can’t we make a(nother) sacrificial offering for the abomination that is the Skype app?
nzeribe 14y ago
All of the backwards-looking nostalgia from all of the commenters posting so far are exactly why Apple were able to get out of the door with iPad first and slowly destroy Microsoft's pre-eminence. Had Redmond produced the iPad, it's users would have rejected it - and demanded a "Start" button! Quite ludicrous. Ballmer may be gutting the company of all of it's talent and slowly running it into the ground but, unbelievably, I am with him on this one.
- ygra 14y ago
  I'm not too sure. The overwhelming opinion seems to be that Metro works quite well on touch devices. Just forcing it onto desktop users is the actual problem.
- mtgx 14y ago
  The problem is Apple separated the two, with 2 separate use cases. And people bought into that. Microsoft is not doing that. They are merging the two, and pissing off a lot of people in the process. A new survey from Avast shows the same thing. What's surprising is that a third of the respondents even plan to switch to Mac next because of Windows 8: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2012/11/14/poll-shows-us-consumers-hesitant-windows-8/1700585/ http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2012/11/14/poll-shows-us-...
  - madoublet 14y ago
    Not entirely correct, from the article "While 68% indicated they would get one of the new Windows 8 models, 30% planned to buy an Apple iPad touch tablet, and 12%, an Apple Macintosh computer." Math seems a bit off here.
- danieldk 14y ago
  As if there haven't been tablets with Windows and a start button ;). It's exactly the opposite, Microsoft thought they could get away with a traditional interface on a modern touch device.
- Shorel 14y ago
  Redmond produced good tablet PCs, that were about 1.5x the price of a comparable laptop. Apple produced a good enough tablet with about 0.5x the price of a comparable (for some uses) laptop. Pricing matters.
Aardwolf 14y ago
In what way does merging the desktop and touch experience in one support ANYONE? Why did they (and some Linux desktops as well) try that at all? Two different types of devices with two different input paradigms. Why merge them? Why not optimize them for each separate paradigm? It is much better for everyone, and friendlier to the user, to give them the best, perfect, interface, for the device they are using. Even if that device is a desktop computer.
- adamman 14y ago
  I use Windows 8 on my desktop without a touchscreen. I find it much more enjoyable to use than Windows 7 or my Mac.
  - codeulike 14y ago
    Yeah I like it, you just have to get used to going to the corners. Admittedly, corners are a problem on VMs.
    - Zr40 14y ago
      Or use the keyboard instead. Win+c opens the side panel you'd get when going into the top/bottom right corner.
- MatthewPhillips 14y ago
  Merging them makes you think of tablets as computers and not entertainment screens. It's a power play.
- codeulike 14y ago
  You don't see a benefit to having a unified experience between Laptop, Tablet and Phone? And Xbox? By standardising the interface, you standardise the environment and interactions for apps. Metro apps for a Win 8 phone will also run on Win 8 tablets and laptops. I think its a pretty brave decision from Microsoft, and it may well pay off massively.
  - 14y ago
firkolas 14y ago
pfft! What a load of toosh. This is just marketing crap from Stardocks as they realise their precious desktop theming software is redundant. Who themes their desktop other than kids anyway?
- Shorel 14y ago
  It was redundant the moment Windows 7 shipped.
wluu 14y ago
I doubt it'd happen. Plus, the new head of Windows was the one that brought the Ribbon to Office. If it did happen, it'd be just the button, which would then trigger the start screen.
- randallsquared 14y ago
  it'd be just the button, which would then trigger the start screen. That's the current behavior, except without the visible button.
Permit 14y ago
Where is this love of the Start Menu coming from? Can't people just type in the name of program they're interested in? What does the Start Menu offer that people miss?
- ygra 14y ago
  Some people apparently still click. But there is indeed a portion of users that benefit more from a start menu. If you regularly have to use Windows 8 via RDP, either in a window or on a multimon configuration, then have fun hitting the hot corners. And the start screen needs plenty of time getting rendered over a network.
  - Permit 14y ago
    The RDP complaints sound justified to me. Fading, sliding and other animations sound like they would cause a headache, as would the hot corners.
- xtirpation 14y ago
  Personally I don't like that the new start menu takes up an entire screen. You're right that people can just type in the name of the program they're interested in, but in that case it makes even less sense to me for the start menu to take up all that space unnecessarily. It's just jarring to me that if I ever want to launch a program from the new start menu, I'll have to drop everything I'm doing when I might otherwise be looking at another window. Really I think the new start menu is meant to be easier for people who don't just type in the name of the program they're interested in, allowing them to put all the apps and programs they use onto their start menu and arrange them however they want, not unlike an extended "favourites" menu.
- Angostura 14y ago
  Apparently people like GUIs
- gregd 14y ago
  Have you used Windows 8 on the desktop? The start menu and the desktop top are two separate "eco systems" for lack of a better word. When you're on the desktop, you can't just start typing and have search popup what it finds like you can on the start menu. The new start menu is a usability nightmare. I can't get desktop alerts on my Start Menu (from AV and Firewall). Toast notifications, when desktop programs catch up to that functionality, won't be as elaborate as desktop notifications. Meaning I won't be able to click "allow" or "deny" or "block" while in the start menu.
duiker101 14y ago
I don't see what it the problem with the new windows 8 dashboard... I really think it works just fine... I mean just because you are used to the start menu doesn't mean you can't change... OSX and Ubuntu(random one) don't have a start menu and they do just fine. It's just that you need to get used to it. I don't think MS will bring it back. And people will soon forget about it.
- jcoby 14y ago
  OS X and Ubuntu also don't have two modes of operating. Win8 is basically two operating systems that you can freely switch between. (I use Windows for games and for testing in IE. I use OS X as my primary OS. The below is from a few hours of using Win8 after upgrading last week. I have been using Windows since the 3.1 days.) In Win8 you can click on the Desktop charm and get to the desktop. There is absolutely no way to get back to the Metro start screen by clicking on something on the screen. You have to go to a 5x5px hidden block in the bottom-left of the screen and then click on the start block thing. Or use the keyboard. When in Metro you have to go to the bottom-right corner and then wait and then go to the middle of the right in order to access settings. Or something. I can't really figure out how I manage to get the right side menu to pop out. I just move it around on the bottom right side of the screen until something happens. I still can't figure out how to edit charms. There is nothing you can click on to see all of your apps. You have to start typing while in Metro. I had to use Google to figure this out. A "find apps" or something charm would be helpful. Win8 is so chock full of mystery meat navigation that I cannot use it with the mouse. I'm having to use the keyboard to do anything. And it's so undiscoverable that I can not recommend it to anyone that isn't a power user. The Win8 UI is really bad. They'll make it better but as it stands now, it's awful and unusable for normal people.
Yhippa 14y ago
The only thing that bothers me about the new Start menu is that it takes an extra step to get to the point where I can search for programs. I'd been using that feature anyway but now I have to get to the charms and go to "Search". I'd like to hit a shortcut to do that.
- missing_cipher 14y ago
  Not really, just press the Windows key and start typing. You don't even have to go to search.
  - ygra 14y ago
    Or, if you want an explicit “Search for apps”, then it's Win+Q.
- cadab 14y ago
  Just hit your windows key, and start typing.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
barefoot 14y ago
The start screen and missing start button are indeed steps forward when implemented properly and I think Microsoft is most of the way there. I would be very displeased if they added the start menu or button back. There is still a start button, and they made it larger. The four corners of the screen are the fastest and easiest targets to acquire aside from the pixel directly under the current mouse position. The lower left corner is infinitely larger and easier of a target to hit than the old start button. The only place this breaks down is inside a virtual machine (you can still use the corner to open the menu but it's significantly slower). As for the start screen replacing the start menu on the desktop, I think it's still a net win. How often do you need to see your current desktop while navigating the start menu? I can't think of one occurrence in my ten or so years of using Windows on a daily basis. If the rest of the screen is not actively used for the task, why fill it with noise? The start screen on all of the Windows 8 installs that I've used opens just as fast as the previous start menu. I primarily use search (Windows Key + Start Typing...) and it works better than the previous version by taking advantage of the additional space on the screen. I'm not sure if this is even a story. What's a rational well-reasoned argument for bringing back the start menu or button other than "it's what I'm used to"?
- ygra 14y ago
  The start button itself never was restricted to just the space of the button. The lower-left corner has always worked the same way (well, not in NT4 and not in XP if you had the language bar in the task bar). Still, for a very long time and at least for US customers the lower-left corner has worked to bring up the start menu.
  - barefoot 14y ago
    Fair enough, but I would hazard a guess that most users in versions previous to Windows 8 attempted to click on the center of the button, a slower movement than hitting the bottom left corner of the screen.
  - dagw 14y ago
    not in XP if you had the language bar in the task bar So that is the reason. I've never understood why the lower-left corner thing worked on some XP machines and not others. Now I know, Thank you!
doah78 14y ago
I think MS needs to quit trying to reinvent entire OS's and start tweaking features within the OS and specific portions of the OS. That I think is one thing that Apple did correctly. They keep a similar user experience between versions but tweak various features within it building upon the previous release.
- ygra 14y ago
  You'll be delighted to find the UX in desktop mode to be pretty much the same (sans Start Menu, which becomes more and more obsolete if you pin stuff to the task bar) with loads of nice tweaks. From a better file copy dialog to a new task manager – the improvements are there.
- dagw 14y ago
  one thing that Apple did correctly Am I the only person who remembers the switch from OS 9->OS X? The noise around Windows 7->Windows 8 sounds quite similar to the noise Mac users where making around that time.
daigoba66 14y ago
The only thing that annoys me is the split up of searching for programs, settings (control panel applets), and files. I alway hit start and then begin typing, but 2/3 of the time don't see what I'm looking for. I have to notice that I'm actually looking for a setting or file and then change context. I know there are shortcuts to jump straight to searching files or settings, but I'm not always thinking about that. Especially when it is a gray area like control panel applets or small utility programs that I don't have shortcuts for. When most search implementations are becoming more single and "unified", Windows has taken a step backwards. Why can't they just copy Apple's Spotlight?
- gregd 14y ago
  I also haven't been able to figure out how to search the app store. The same "universal" search functionality that works from the start menu (by just starting to type anywhere), doesn't work in the app store. Right-clicking in the app store doesn't work either. What am I missing?
  - daigoba66 14y ago
    You have to bring up the charm menu (mouse in upper right or windows-c), and then click search and then start typing. Took me far too long to figure that out.
    - gregd 14y ago
      Fuckin' A. Thanks...
      - drharris 14y ago
        Now that you've learned it, you'll find it works for almost every app. Windows Store isn't approving many apps that don't use the built-in search (other than games and things where search doesn't make sense)
        gregd 14y ago
gregd 14y ago
What I find really irritating, is the lack of interaction between the start menu and the desktop. I use current AV and Firewall software that's "Windows 8 compatible". However, if I'm in the app store and attempt to launch an app from there, the firewall will happily block it with no notifications visible where I am currently (app store, or start menu) If I then go back to the desktop, I can answer the alert from the firewall AND go back to the app store and use the app. I've since learned that the start menu will have toast notifications, but everything that I'm reading about them is that they will not have the same elaborations that desktop notifications have. In other words, I can't answer "allow", "deny", "block" or anything else while in the start menu. Is nobody else seeing this behavior?
skiman 14y ago
There is a way to bring the start menuback without the hot corners, why is everyone bs'ing bring up charms bar and click the start button I have no problems with usability when remoting on from my windows 7 pc

17 points by Breakthrough 14y ago

Microsoft has a history of maintaining backward compatibility even at the expense of a less clean design. In that context, bringing back the start button sounds very plausible.

meaty 14y ago

They better do as to be honest, I'll be fucked if I'm going to use it any more unless it happens. Historically, I have used Windows 8 from CP, to RP and now RTM exclusively. Unfortunately, I now have to use RDP and as a VMware guest regularly, which due to the hot corners and the fact that some apps whinge about resolution being low if you run in a smaller than 1378x768 window, it is absolutely unusable. It's so backwards it's sickening.

xradionut 14y ago
Windows 8 works best as a VMWare guest OS. :)

mtgx 14y ago

Will they stop forcing me to use all the Metro stuff while in desktop mode, too? That's what I want to know. I installed Windows 8 on a laptop, and I immediately felt the need to have the start button back and get rid of the annoying "Charms", and also of the Metro start screen, which is completely useless and space-wasteful in desktop mode. But then I realized - why do I even bother with all these hacks, to make it look like a more "regular" Windows, when I can just use Windows 7? Besides all those annoyances, I didn't find that the desktop mode of Windows 8 offered me any real advantages over Windows 7. It's more like a SP2 for Windows 7.

whalesalad 14y ago
I really like the chrome and general UX enhancements in Windows 8. Aero from Win 7 is hard for me to look at. My biggest frustration with Win8 is indeed its lack of a traditional start-style desktop experience.
- mtgx 14y ago
  Then just disable Aero.

kmfrk 14y ago

But their “telemetry data” and “Customer Experience Improvement Program”! Seriously, I’m not joking: http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/28/3274107/windows-8-start-menu-samsung-s-launcher-widget-app http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/28/3274107/windows-8-start-me.... Well, I am, but at the expense of Microsoft. I have no problem with the new system, but I am not the median Windows user. Microsoft’s design by committee and telemetry data sound like self-parody, to be perfectly honest. And now that we’re at it, can’t we make a(nother) sacrificial offering for the abomination that is the Skype app?

nzeribe 14y ago

All of the backwards-looking nostalgia from all of the commenters posting so far are exactly why Apple were able to get out of the door with iPad first and slowly destroy Microsoft's pre-eminence. Had Redmond produced the iPad, it's users would have rejected it - and demanded a "Start" button! Quite ludicrous. Ballmer may be gutting the company of all of it's talent and slowly running it into the ground but, unbelievably, I am with him on this one.

ygra 14y ago
I'm not too sure. The overwhelming opinion seems to be that Metro works quite well on touch devices. Just forcing it onto desktop users is the actual problem.
mtgx 14y ago
The problem is Apple separated the two, with 2 separate use cases. And people bought into that. Microsoft is not doing that. They are merging the two, and pissing off a lot of people in the process. A new survey from Avast shows the same thing. What's surprising is that a third of the respondents even plan to switch to Mac next because of Windows 8: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2012/11/14/poll-shows-us-consumers-hesitant-windows-8/1700585/ http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2012/11/14/poll-shows-us-...
- madoublet 14y ago
  Not entirely correct, from the article "While 68% indicated they would get one of the new Windows 8 models, 30% planned to buy an Apple iPad touch tablet, and 12%, an Apple Macintosh computer." Math seems a bit off here.
danieldk 14y ago
As if there haven't been tablets with Windows and a start button ;). It's exactly the opposite, Microsoft thought they could get away with a traditional interface on a modern touch device.
Shorel 14y ago
Redmond produced good tablet PCs, that were about 1.5x the price of a comparable laptop. Apple produced a good enough tablet with about 0.5x the price of a comparable (for some uses) laptop. Pricing matters.

Aardwolf 14y ago

In what way does merging the desktop and touch experience in one support ANYONE? Why did they (and some Linux desktops as well) try that at all? Two different types of devices with two different input paradigms. Why merge them? Why not optimize them for each separate paradigm? It is much better for everyone, and friendlier to the user, to give them the best, perfect, interface, for the device they are using. Even if that device is a desktop computer.

adamman 14y ago
I use Windows 8 on my desktop without a touchscreen. I find it much more enjoyable to use than Windows 7 or my Mac.
- codeulike 14y ago
  Yeah I like it, you just have to get used to going to the corners. Admittedly, corners are a problem on VMs.
  - Zr40 14y ago
    Or use the keyboard instead. Win+c opens the side panel you'd get when going into the top/bottom right corner.
MatthewPhillips 14y ago
Merging them makes you think of tablets as computers and not entertainment screens. It's a power play.
codeulike 14y ago
You don't see a benefit to having a unified experience between Laptop, Tablet and Phone? And Xbox? By standardising the interface, you standardise the environment and interactions for apps. Metro apps for a Win 8 phone will also run on Win 8 tablets and laptops. I think its a pretty brave decision from Microsoft, and it may well pay off massively.
- 14y ago

firkolas 14y ago

pfft! What a load of toosh. This is just marketing crap from Stardocks as they realise their precious desktop theming software is redundant. Who themes their desktop other than kids anyway?

Shorel 14y ago
It was redundant the moment Windows 7 shipped.

wluu 14y ago

I doubt it'd happen. Plus, the new head of Windows was the one that brought the Ribbon to Office. If it did happen, it'd be just the button, which would then trigger the start screen.

randallsquared 14y ago
it'd be just the button, which would then trigger the start screen. That's the current behavior, except without the visible button.

Permit 14y ago

Where is this love of the Start Menu coming from? Can't people just type in the name of program they're interested in? What does the Start Menu offer that people miss?

ygra 14y ago
Some people apparently still click. But there is indeed a portion of users that benefit more from a start menu. If you regularly have to use Windows 8 via RDP, either in a window or on a multimon configuration, then have fun hitting the hot corners. And the start screen needs plenty of time getting rendered over a network.
- Permit 14y ago
  The RDP complaints sound justified to me. Fading, sliding and other animations sound like they would cause a headache, as would the hot corners.
xtirpation 14y ago
Personally I don't like that the new start menu takes up an entire screen. You're right that people can just type in the name of the program they're interested in, but in that case it makes even less sense to me for the start menu to take up all that space unnecessarily. It's just jarring to me that if I ever want to launch a program from the new start menu, I'll have to drop everything I'm doing when I might otherwise be looking at another window. Really I think the new start menu is meant to be easier for people who don't just type in the name of the program they're interested in, allowing them to put all the apps and programs they use onto their start menu and arrange them however they want, not unlike an extended "favourites" menu.
Angostura 14y ago
Apparently people like GUIs
gregd 14y ago
Have you used Windows 8 on the desktop? The start menu and the desktop top are two separate "eco systems" for lack of a better word. When you're on the desktop, you can't just start typing and have search popup what it finds like you can on the start menu. The new start menu is a usability nightmare. I can't get desktop alerts on my Start Menu (from AV and Firewall). Toast notifications, when desktop programs catch up to that functionality, won't be as elaborate as desktop notifications. Meaning I won't be able to click "allow" or "deny" or "block" while in the start menu.

duiker101 14y ago

I don't see what it the problem with the new windows 8 dashboard... I really think it works just fine... I mean just because you are used to the start menu doesn't mean you can't change... OSX and Ubuntu(random one) don't have a start menu and they do just fine. It's just that you need to get used to it. I don't think MS will bring it back. And people will soon forget about it.

jcoby 14y ago
OS X and Ubuntu also don't have two modes of operating. Win8 is basically two operating systems that you can freely switch between. (I use Windows for games and for testing in IE. I use OS X as my primary OS. The below is from a few hours of using Win8 after upgrading last week. I have been using Windows since the 3.1 days.) In Win8 you can click on the Desktop charm and get to the desktop. There is absolutely no way to get back to the Metro start screen by clicking on something on the screen. You have to go to a 5x5px hidden block in the bottom-left of the screen and then click on the start block thing. Or use the keyboard. When in Metro you have to go to the bottom-right corner and then wait and then go to the middle of the right in order to access settings. Or something. I can't really figure out how I manage to get the right side menu to pop out. I just move it around on the bottom right side of the screen until something happens. I still can't figure out how to edit charms. There is nothing you can click on to see all of your apps. You have to start typing while in Metro. I had to use Google to figure this out. A "find apps" or something charm would be helpful. Win8 is so chock full of mystery meat navigation that I cannot use it with the mouse. I'm having to use the keyboard to do anything. And it's so undiscoverable that I can not recommend it to anyone that isn't a power user. The Win8 UI is really bad. They'll make it better but as it stands now, it's awful and unusable for normal people.

Yhippa 14y ago

The only thing that bothers me about the new Start menu is that it takes an extra step to get to the point where I can search for programs. I'd been using that feature anyway but now I have to get to the charms and go to "Search". I'd like to hit a shortcut to do that.

missing_cipher 14y ago
Not really, just press the Windows key and start typing. You don't even have to go to search.
- ygra 14y ago
  Or, if you want an explicit “Search for apps”, then it's Win+Q.
cadab 14y ago
Just hit your windows key, and start typing.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

barefoot 14y ago

The start screen and missing start button are indeed steps forward when implemented properly and I think Microsoft is most of the way there. I would be very displeased if they added the start menu or button back. There is still a start button, and they made it larger. The four corners of the screen are the fastest and easiest targets to acquire aside from the pixel directly under the current mouse position. The lower left corner is infinitely larger and easier of a target to hit than the old start button. The only place this breaks down is inside a virtual machine (you can still use the corner to open the menu but it's significantly slower). As for the start screen replacing the start menu on the desktop, I think it's still a net win. How often do you need to see your current desktop while navigating the start menu? I can't think of one occurrence in my ten or so years of using Windows on a daily basis. If the rest of the screen is not actively used for the task, why fill it with noise? The start screen on all of the Windows 8 installs that I've used opens just as fast as the previous start menu. I primarily use search (Windows Key + Start Typing...) and it works better than the previous version by taking advantage of the additional space on the screen. I'm not sure if this is even a story. What's a rational well-reasoned argument for bringing back the start menu or button other than "it's what I'm used to"?

ygra 14y ago
The start button itself never was restricted to just the space of the button. The lower-left corner has always worked the same way (well, not in NT4 and not in XP if you had the language bar in the task bar). Still, for a very long time and at least for US customers the lower-left corner has worked to bring up the start menu.
- barefoot 14y ago
  Fair enough, but I would hazard a guess that most users in versions previous to Windows 8 attempted to click on the center of the button, a slower movement than hitting the bottom left corner of the screen.
- dagw 14y ago
  not in XP if you had the language bar in the task bar So that is the reason. I've never understood why the lower-left corner thing worked on some XP machines and not others. Now I know, Thank you!

doah78 14y ago

I think MS needs to quit trying to reinvent entire OS's and start tweaking features within the OS and specific portions of the OS. That I think is one thing that Apple did correctly. They keep a similar user experience between versions but tweak various features within it building upon the previous release.

ygra 14y ago
You'll be delighted to find the UX in desktop mode to be pretty much the same (sans Start Menu, which becomes more and more obsolete if you pin stuff to the task bar) with loads of nice tweaks. From a better file copy dialog to a new task manager – the improvements are there.
dagw 14y ago
one thing that Apple did correctly Am I the only person who remembers the switch from OS 9->OS X? The noise around Windows 7->Windows 8 sounds quite similar to the noise Mac users where making around that time.

daigoba66 14y ago

The only thing that annoys me is the split up of searching for programs, settings (control panel applets), and files. I alway hit start and then begin typing, but 2/3 of the time don't see what I'm looking for. I have to notice that I'm actually looking for a setting or file and then change context. I know there are shortcuts to jump straight to searching files or settings, but I'm not always thinking about that. Especially when it is a gray area like control panel applets or small utility programs that I don't have shortcuts for. When most search implementations are becoming more single and "unified", Windows has taken a step backwards. Why can't they just copy Apple's Spotlight?

gregd 14y ago
I also haven't been able to figure out how to search the app store. The same "universal" search functionality that works from the start menu (by just starting to type anywhere), doesn't work in the app store. Right-clicking in the app store doesn't work either. What am I missing?
- daigoba66 14y ago
  You have to bring up the charm menu (mouse in upper right or windows-c), and then click search and then start typing. Took me far too long to figure that out.
  - gregd 14y ago
    Fuckin' A. Thanks...
    - drharris 14y ago
      Now that you've learned it, you'll find it works for almost every app. Windows Store isn't approving many apps that don't use the built-in search (other than games and things where search doesn't make sense)
      - gregd 14y ago

gregd 14y ago

What I find really irritating, is the lack of interaction between the start menu and the desktop. I use current AV and Firewall software that's "Windows 8 compatible". However, if I'm in the app store and attempt to launch an app from there, the firewall will happily block it with no notifications visible where I am currently (app store, or start menu) If I then go back to the desktop, I can answer the alert from the firewall AND go back to the app store and use the app. I've since learned that the start menu will have toast notifications, but everything that I'm reading about them is that they will not have the same elaborations that desktop notifications have. In other words, I can't answer "allow", "deny", "block" or anything else while in the start menu. Is nobody else seeing this behavior?

skiman 14y ago

There is a way to bring the start menuback without the hot corners, why is everyone bs'ing bring up charms bar and click the start button I have no problems with usability when remoting on from my windows 7 pc