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This is to a large part to give Egypt plausible deniability. They don’t want to deal with Gaza, refugees, or a humanitarian crisis, but also don’t want the poli

This is to a large part to give Egypt plausible deniability. They don’t want to deal with Gaza, refugees, or a humanitarian crisis, but also don’t want the political fallout of taking action like the Israelis do.

ceejayoz 6mo ago
Eh, 50/50. Israel would not respond positively to Egypt throwing the gates wide open.
- philistine 6mo ago
  That is very reductive of the whole situation. The Egyptians are not singularly focused on helping Palestinians; it is far more nuanced than that. Bottom line, Egyptians are not interested in supporting millions of refugees inside their border. So the border stays closed to mass immigration.
  - ceejayoz 6mo ago
    All that may be true. Also true: If Egypt opened the border and Israel objected, Israel would take swift military action.
    - deepsun 6mo ago
      No, why? Israel would celebrate. But NONE of the Arab countries want to help Gaza people really.
      - ceejayoz 6mo ago
        > No, why? Israel would celebrate. This is directly contradicted by Israel's actions in the Gaza War. Egyptian control of the crossing was not enough, so they took it. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-07/israel-raid-closes-rafah-border-crossing-in-gaza-hamas-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-07/israel-ra...
        JumpCrisscross 6mo ago
        Israel would object to aid and weapons flows into Gaza. It would be fine with Gazans leaving the Strip. The problem is there are currently zero takers globally for a significant Palestinian refugee population, in part, as other comments have mentioned, due to the history of Palestinian refugee populations in the Middle East. (To my knowledge, Palestinian Americans have been fine and productive members of society.)
        shykes 6mo ago
        [flagged]
        constantius 6mo ago
        Racial theorists are out in full force today. I do wonder if you all can hear yourself: a lot of subtle implications of genetic defects in Palestinians' character and selective understanding of geopolitics in the region, or just basic societal dynamics. I invited another commenter to transpose their reasoning to groups it's less popular to openly discriminate, I'd suggest you do the same.
        philistine 6mo ago
        Saying that no nations want to take Palestinian refugees does not make you a racist. The fact remains; no Middle Eastern nation wants Palestinian refugees, not for their genes, but for their politics.
        constantius 6mo ago
        "Saying that gays steal does not make you homophobic": technically true, but you're being selective with your understanding of facts. Most states (talking about decision-makers, not populations) don't want to take in large groups of refugees, not because of their genes or politics, but because it has a cost and risks (in terms of integration, gov perception, fuelling far right parties, etc.). Nothing to do with Middle-Eastern/Palestinian. Even though there are examples of massive refugee intakes by states, everywhere, including in the Middle-East, including of Palestinians, including voluntary.
      - 8note 6mo ago
        if egypt opened the border, it would mean weapons and bombs flowing from egypt into gaza. thats not something israel would be excited about
        deepsun 6mo ago
        I mean "open the border" to allow Gazans to leave to Egypt. But Egypt (and none other Arab countries) are accepting refugees from Gaza.
        fakedang 6mo ago
        More like refugees flowing out, which Egypt doesn't want to deal with. The Palestinians didn't help their cause with Yasser Arafat's Black September uprising in Jordan. Then they topped that up with strong support for Saddam when he invaded Kuwait. Like the ones in Kuwait were literally betraying Kuwaitis to the Iraqi troops. Oh, and did I forget Lebanon? They literally fomented the civil war.
- pixl97 6mo ago
  At the same time, neither would Egypt. Refugee crisises are messy.
  - shykes 6mo ago
    Yes, the "refugee crisis" in Jordan and Lebanon was indeed quite messy... https://www.thoughtco.com/black-september-jordanian-plo-civil-war-2353168 https://www.thoughtco.com/black-september-jordanian-plo-civi... https://www.historiascripta.org/post-ww2/the-palestinians-of-the-plo-in-lebanon-a-state-within-a-state-and-the-outbreak-of-the-civil-war/ https://www.historiascripta.org/post-ww2/the-palestinians-of...
- don_esteban 6mo ago
  The Israeli openly proposed for the Gaza Palestinians to move to Egypt (effectively ethnic cleansing Gaza, their obvious goal), not that long after 7.10. Egypt said 'HELL NO', first, because they don't want to deal with Palestinians (both political and economic nightmare), and second because it would have been viewed as ceding to Israelis and helping them cleanse Gaza, which would be highly unpopular among their population.
  - ceejayoz 6mo ago
    > The Israeli openly proposed for the Gaza Palestinians to move to Egypt Yeah, that's not "wide open". Israel would absolutely be happy with a one-way exit gate.
    - shykes 6mo ago
      [flagged]
      - constantius 6mo ago
        No they wouldn't, it's their land and they demonstrated after 80 years of ethnic cleansing that they will not be driven out it. I already addressed another one of your racial fantasies elsewhere, here you descend into genocide apology.
- shykes 6mo ago
  On the contrary, I believe Israel would be delighted. It would lessen the humanitarian burden on them, and force Egypt to deal with the Hamas problem more directly. It will never happen, though. No Arab country will "throw the gates wide open" for Palestinians. They have done so before, several times, and it went very badly.

ceejayoz 6mo ago

Eh, 50/50. Israel would not respond positively to Egypt throwing the gates wide open.

philistine 6mo ago
That is very reductive of the whole situation. The Egyptians are not singularly focused on helping Palestinians; it is far more nuanced than that. Bottom line, Egyptians are not interested in supporting millions of refugees inside their border. So the border stays closed to mass immigration.
- ceejayoz 6mo ago
  All that may be true. Also true: If Egypt opened the border and Israel objected, Israel would take swift military action.
  - deepsun 6mo ago
    No, why? Israel would celebrate. But NONE of the Arab countries want to help Gaza people really.
    - ceejayoz 6mo ago
      > No, why? Israel would celebrate. This is directly contradicted by Israel's actions in the Gaza War. Egyptian control of the crossing was not enough, so they took it. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-07/israel-raid-closes-rafah-border-crossing-in-gaza-hamas-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-07/israel-ra...
      - JumpCrisscross 6mo ago
        Israel would object to aid and weapons flows into Gaza. It would be fine with Gazans leaving the Strip. The problem is there are currently zero takers globally for a significant Palestinian refugee population, in part, as other comments have mentioned, due to the history of Palestinian refugee populations in the Middle East. (To my knowledge, Palestinian Americans have been fine and productive members of society.)
        shykes 6mo ago
        [flagged]
        constantius 6mo ago
        Racial theorists are out in full force today. I do wonder if you all can hear yourself: a lot of subtle implications of genetic defects in Palestinians' character and selective understanding of geopolitics in the region, or just basic societal dynamics. I invited another commenter to transpose their reasoning to groups it's less popular to openly discriminate, I'd suggest you do the same.
        philistine 6mo ago
        Saying that no nations want to take Palestinian refugees does not make you a racist. The fact remains; no Middle Eastern nation wants Palestinian refugees, not for their genes, but for their politics.
        constantius 6mo ago
        "Saying that gays steal does not make you homophobic": technically true, but you're being selective with your understanding of facts. Most states (talking about decision-makers, not populations) don't want to take in large groups of refugees, not because of their genes or politics, but because it has a cost and risks (in terms of integration, gov perception, fuelling far right parties, etc.). Nothing to do with Middle-Eastern/Palestinian. Even though there are examples of massive refugee intakes by states, everywhere, including in the Middle-East, including of Palestinians, including voluntary.
    - 8note 6mo ago
      if egypt opened the border, it would mean weapons and bombs flowing from egypt into gaza. thats not something israel would be excited about
      - deepsun 6mo ago
        I mean "open the border" to allow Gazans to leave to Egypt. But Egypt (and none other Arab countries) are accepting refugees from Gaza.
      - fakedang 6mo ago
        More like refugees flowing out, which Egypt doesn't want to deal with. The Palestinians didn't help their cause with Yasser Arafat's Black September uprising in Jordan. Then they topped that up with strong support for Saddam when he invaded Kuwait. Like the ones in Kuwait were literally betraying Kuwaitis to the Iraqi troops. Oh, and did I forget Lebanon? They literally fomented the civil war.
pixl97 6mo ago
At the same time, neither would Egypt. Refugee crisises are messy.
- shykes 6mo ago
  Yes, the "refugee crisis" in Jordan and Lebanon was indeed quite messy... https://www.thoughtco.com/black-september-jordanian-plo-civil-war-2353168 https://www.thoughtco.com/black-september-jordanian-plo-civi... https://www.historiascripta.org/post-ww2/the-palestinians-of-the-plo-in-lebanon-a-state-within-a-state-and-the-outbreak-of-the-civil-war/ https://www.historiascripta.org/post-ww2/the-palestinians-of...
don_esteban 6mo ago
The Israeli openly proposed for the Gaza Palestinians to move to Egypt (effectively ethnic cleansing Gaza, their obvious goal), not that long after 7.10. Egypt said 'HELL NO', first, because they don't want to deal with Palestinians (both political and economic nightmare), and second because it would have been viewed as ceding to Israelis and helping them cleanse Gaza, which would be highly unpopular among their population.
- ceejayoz 6mo ago
  > The Israeli openly proposed for the Gaza Palestinians to move to Egypt Yeah, that's not "wide open". Israel would absolutely be happy with a one-way exit gate.
  - shykes 6mo ago
    [flagged]
    - constantius 6mo ago
      No they wouldn't, it's their land and they demonstrated after 80 years of ethnic cleansing that they will not be driven out it. I already addressed another one of your racial fantasies elsewhere, here you descend into genocide apology.
shykes 6mo ago
On the contrary, I believe Israel would be delighted. It would lessen the humanitarian burden on them, and force Egypt to deal with the Hamas problem more directly. It will never happen, though. No Arab country will "throw the gates wide open" for Palestinians. They have done so before, several times, and it went very badly.