6 ms·

>not immediately clear on what grounds China was seeking the annulment of a deal involving a Singapore-based company and how, if at all, a completed acquisitio

>not immediately clear on what grounds China was seeking the annulment of a deal involving a Singapore-based company and how, if at all, a completed acquisition transaction would be unwound. Interesting. I wonder what sorts of threats China could make to back up this demand, or if this is more of a warning for future acquisitions in the space.

some_random 5mo ago
"Your families live here", maybe "We have shadow police stations across the world", the playbook is well established
- stego-tech 5mo ago
  I mean, they're just cribbing what America did, and what the British Empire did before that. It's a disgusting playbook, but it's also an effective one if you're a state trying to exert control over important players or entities.
  - catgary 5mo ago
    I think you need to give some concrete examples, considering the US happily let its companies offshore a lot of work to China over the years, and Chinese funds own large chunks of American companies.
    - stego-tech 5mo ago
      Okay! * The US and UK propped up the Iranian Shah to help western oil interests: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état * US Export Controls basically handcuff anyone of import involved in creating anything of value to the state: https://www.investopedia.com/u-s-export-restrictions-6753407 https://www.investopedia.com/u-s-export-restrictions-6753407 * We continue to embargo Cuba instead of letting it succeed or fail on its own merits - while also controlling their own land for a Black Ops prison and having attempted repeatedly to assassinate their leaders or create coups: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_... * Our centralization of global finance and status as a reserve currency lets us dictate global policy on everything from Intellectual Property to National Defense, meaning companies generally have to "play ball" or the host country will incur penalties * That time we overthrew the democratically-elected government of Guatemala because they imposed radical ideas like a minimum wage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état * And that time we overthrew the democratically-elected socialist government in Chile to prop up exploitative labor practices and resource extraction: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Chilean_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Chilean_coup_d%27état I can go on, but really, Wikipedia is right there. If you're looking for a specific analogue to "we kidnapped CEOs and demanded a foreign company unwind their merger", I don't think I can provide that right away; however, if instead you're looking for examples of "country used threats and force to foment an outcome favorable to its domestic policies", well then, boy howdy are there tons and tons of examples out there just a cursory search away.
      - HDThoreaun 5mo ago
        None of this is similar to what is happening here
      - ozgrakkurt 5mo ago
        Also you can add middle east for last 20-30 years. Complete disregard for human life for profit.
      - JPKab 5mo ago
        You basically just parroted a bunch of Howard Zinn agitprop and didn't cite a single example that was remotely similar to this specific incident, because you literally can't. What exactly is your motivation here, because it's certainly not truth-seeking.
        selectively 5mo ago
        Howard Zinn was a hero.
      - jujube3 5mo ago
        Since you think Cuba and China are such nice places, perhaps try living there. You'll quickly find out about their "merits" (such as the fact that they execute dissidents).
        ebbi 5mo ago
        True, America just kills outside its borders (~37 million people since the 50s), so it's a lot safer!
    - pleurotus 5mo ago
      ? The united states have blocked exports by a Dutch company to China, and somehow got away with it.
  - some_random 5mo ago
    Not even getting into the more dubious part of this claim, just because the British or Americans did it doesn't mean it's right or acceptable. If you disagree with that, you're implicitly pro slavery, pro penal expeditions, etc.
    - pishpash 5mo ago
      There is this thing called implicit acceptability. If you really find it unacceptable you might want to start close to your circle of concern. Otherwise, pretty sure you find it acceptable by action. Many, even most people are pro-slavery and pro-whatever as we speak, even paying to see it happen. They only mouth some useless moralizing words.
    - stego-tech 5mo ago
      Oh, no, it's incredibly reprehensible what China's doing. Just like it was reprehensible that America propped up the Iranian shah to ensure western oil interests were served. And reprehensible that the British Empire got the Chinese addicted to Opium to force more favorable trade agreements. Also reprehensible is the Cuban blockade imposed by America, which has prohibited the country from thriving or failing on its own merits and forced suffering onto its people. It's all reprehensible, and it should all be held up lest folks get this notion that America is this infallible savior who can do no wrong. It's bad, and it should never happen, but it does and it will so long as people keep buying into Nationalist narratives like these.
      - some_random 5mo ago
        You find it reprehensible but can't _just_ say that, you have to justify it with "and also the Americans and British did it". Yeah right.
        owebmaster 5mo ago
        Why does that bother you tho? Not having the moral ground changes the argument?
  - godelski 5mo ago
    I'm really unfamiliar with this playbook and how America has used it. Do you have any examples? I can't seem to find any
  - dublinstats 5mo ago
    [flagged]
    - stego-tech 5mo ago
      [flagged]
      - dublinstats 5mo ago
        [flagged]
        tomhow 5mo ago
        Can you please stop with this style of commenting? This is not what HN is for – ideological battle, cross-examination, sneering/snark. The thing HN is for is curious conversation, and you'll be much more at home here if you can keep that in mind and make an effort to heed the guidelines. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        dublinstats 5mo ago
        I think you're misreading my tone because the other poster was so opinionated. I didn't think being Chinese was insulting or something, but had expected a continuing discussion there. And I think my prior response in the thread was rather highbrow and clever, referencing ancient history.
- Detrytus 5mo ago
  That's interesting, because recently China is definitely trying to paint themselves as the reasonable, stable partner, commited to upholding international law (unlike the US, which is ruled by a madman) . Trying to block this aquisition without good legal argument goes directly against that strategy.
  - strangegecko 5mo ago
    They're doing a lot that goes against that strategy, you just don't see it in the headlines except in cases such as these or when you dig into how they conduct international negotiations or business deals involving the Chinese market. Not to mention how they are openly expansionist in the SCS and obviously wrt Taiwan. Of course they want to be seen as reasonable, their ideal is to control the international narrative just how they can do it internally in China.
    - RobertoG 5mo ago
      So, who would you say that spend more resources 'controlling the international narrative', the USA or China?
      - nikkwong 5mo ago
        China at least does it covertly. The US president broadcasts his madman narrative on Twitter for everyone to see.
        strangegecko 5mo ago
        Personally, I prefer the US approach. At least then everyone knows what they're dealing with and they can openly react instead of being forced into a fake dance between what is said and what is REALLY said. The covert stuff gives some degree of plausible deniability and it causes a good amount of the population to be complacent and ignore reality. I don't see how this can be considered good for anyone but the people creating propaganda.
      - strangegecko 5mo ago

some_random 5mo ago

"Your families live here", maybe "We have shadow police stations across the world", the playbook is well established

stego-tech 5mo ago
I mean, they're just cribbing what America did, and what the British Empire did before that. It's a disgusting playbook, but it's also an effective one if you're a state trying to exert control over important players or entities.
- catgary 5mo ago
  I think you need to give some concrete examples, considering the US happily let its companies offshore a lot of work to China over the years, and Chinese funds own large chunks of American companies.
  - stego-tech 5mo ago
    Okay! * The US and UK propped up the Iranian Shah to help western oil interests: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état * US Export Controls basically handcuff anyone of import involved in creating anything of value to the state: https://www.investopedia.com/u-s-export-restrictions-6753407 https://www.investopedia.com/u-s-export-restrictions-6753407 * We continue to embargo Cuba instead of letting it succeed or fail on its own merits - while also controlling their own land for a Black Ops prison and having attempted repeatedly to assassinate their leaders or create coups: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_... * Our centralization of global finance and status as a reserve currency lets us dictate global policy on everything from Intellectual Property to National Defense, meaning companies generally have to "play ball" or the host country will incur penalties * That time we overthrew the democratically-elected government of Guatemala because they imposed radical ideas like a minimum wage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état * And that time we overthrew the democratically-elected socialist government in Chile to prop up exploitative labor practices and resource extraction: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Chilean_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Chilean_coup_d%27état I can go on, but really, Wikipedia is right there. If you're looking for a specific analogue to "we kidnapped CEOs and demanded a foreign company unwind their merger", I don't think I can provide that right away; however, if instead you're looking for examples of "country used threats and force to foment an outcome favorable to its domestic policies", well then, boy howdy are there tons and tons of examples out there just a cursory search away.
    - HDThoreaun 5mo ago
      None of this is similar to what is happening here
    - ozgrakkurt 5mo ago
      Also you can add middle east for last 20-30 years. Complete disregard for human life for profit.
    - JPKab 5mo ago
      You basically just parroted a bunch of Howard Zinn agitprop and didn't cite a single example that was remotely similar to this specific incident, because you literally can't. What exactly is your motivation here, because it's certainly not truth-seeking.
      - selectively 5mo ago
        Howard Zinn was a hero.
    - jujube3 5mo ago
      Since you think Cuba and China are such nice places, perhaps try living there. You'll quickly find out about their "merits" (such as the fact that they execute dissidents).
      - ebbi 5mo ago
        True, America just kills outside its borders (~37 million people since the 50s), so it's a lot safer!
  - pleurotus 5mo ago
    ? The united states have blocked exports by a Dutch company to China, and somehow got away with it.
- some_random 5mo ago
  Not even getting into the more dubious part of this claim, just because the British or Americans did it doesn't mean it's right or acceptable. If you disagree with that, you're implicitly pro slavery, pro penal expeditions, etc.
  - pishpash 5mo ago
    There is this thing called implicit acceptability. If you really find it unacceptable you might want to start close to your circle of concern. Otherwise, pretty sure you find it acceptable by action. Many, even most people are pro-slavery and pro-whatever as we speak, even paying to see it happen. They only mouth some useless moralizing words.
  - stego-tech 5mo ago
    Oh, no, it's incredibly reprehensible what China's doing. Just like it was reprehensible that America propped up the Iranian shah to ensure western oil interests were served. And reprehensible that the British Empire got the Chinese addicted to Opium to force more favorable trade agreements. Also reprehensible is the Cuban blockade imposed by America, which has prohibited the country from thriving or failing on its own merits and forced suffering onto its people. It's all reprehensible, and it should all be held up lest folks get this notion that America is this infallible savior who can do no wrong. It's bad, and it should never happen, but it does and it will so long as people keep buying into Nationalist narratives like these.
    - some_random 5mo ago
      You find it reprehensible but can't _just_ say that, you have to justify it with "and also the Americans and British did it". Yeah right.
      - owebmaster 5mo ago
        Why does that bother you tho? Not having the moral ground changes the argument?
- godelski 5mo ago
  I'm really unfamiliar with this playbook and how America has used it. Do you have any examples? I can't seem to find any
- dublinstats 5mo ago
  [flagged]
  - stego-tech 5mo ago
    [flagged]
    - dublinstats 5mo ago
      [flagged]
      - tomhow 5mo ago
        Can you please stop with this style of commenting? This is not what HN is for – ideological battle, cross-examination, sneering/snark. The thing HN is for is curious conversation, and you'll be much more at home here if you can keep that in mind and make an effort to heed the guidelines. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        dublinstats 5mo ago
        I think you're misreading my tone because the other poster was so opinionated. I didn't think being Chinese was insulting or something, but had expected a continuing discussion there. And I think my prior response in the thread was rather highbrow and clever, referencing ancient history.
Detrytus 5mo ago
That's interesting, because recently China is definitely trying to paint themselves as the reasonable, stable partner, commited to upholding international law (unlike the US, which is ruled by a madman) . Trying to block this aquisition without good legal argument goes directly against that strategy.
- strangegecko 5mo ago
  They're doing a lot that goes against that strategy, you just don't see it in the headlines except in cases such as these or when you dig into how they conduct international negotiations or business deals involving the Chinese market. Not to mention how they are openly expansionist in the SCS and obviously wrt Taiwan. Of course they want to be seen as reasonable, their ideal is to control the international narrative just how they can do it internally in China.
  - RobertoG 5mo ago
    So, who would you say that spend more resources 'controlling the international narrative', the USA or China?
    - nikkwong 5mo ago
      China at least does it covertly. The US president broadcasts his madman narrative on Twitter for everyone to see.
      - strangegecko 5mo ago
        Personally, I prefer the US approach. At least then everyone knows what they're dealing with and they can openly react instead of being forced into a fake dance between what is said and what is REALLY said. The covert stuff gives some degree of plausible deniability and it causes a good amount of the population to be complacent and ignore reality. I don't see how this can be considered good for anyone but the people creating propaganda.
    - strangegecko 5mo ago