4 ms·

Can Deepseek answer probing questions about Winnie the Pooh?

by kevin_thibedeau 6mo ago

harvey9 6mo ago
Is it subject to CCP censorship? Maybe.
- windexh8er 6mo ago
  It's fun to pretend the US models have no censorship constraints.
  - deleted 6mo ago
    [deleted]
  - zapnuk 6mo ago
    US models align with our "average" (western) values. If we outsource thinking by using LLMs, why would we outsource it to an LLM that doesn't have our values encoded in it?
    - HDBaseT 6mo ago
      [dead]
  - pimeys 6mo ago
    I remember asking Gemini about that one famous 9/11 joke from late Norm MacDonald and it got really iffy about answering. Told it that hey I'm not american and in our culture it's not such a taboo. But yes, they do have similar constraints.
  - libertine 6mo ago
    Any source for this?
    - windexh8er 6mo ago
      Basically any frontier model right now and ask it any politically divisive fact that may upset certain classes of people.
      - libertine 6mo ago
        For example? Because for Deepseek is pretty straightforward censorship.
        rotis 6mo ago
        https://chatgpt.com/share/69f0dc83-ec70-83eb-896b-b258de2c9f33 https://chatgpt.com/share/69f0dc83-ec70-83eb-896b-b258de2c9f... https://claude.ai/share/ac4d2041-4328-4511-904a-ff8b1cbfc0bb https://claude.ai/share/ac4d2041-4328-4511-904a-ff8b1cbfc0bb Looks like self-censoring to me. Grok has no problems answering, so it is not a technical limitation: https://grok.com/share/bGVnYWN5_341d6428-ea7d-4b84-ad4d-8df9313478fe https://grok.com/share/bGVnYWN5_341d6428-ea7d-4b84-ad4d-8df9...
        libertine 6mo ago
        It doesn't look like self censoring at all - basically you want the default behavior of llms to gamble on the ethnicity of someone based on how they look. Grok used a book as a reference. It's not like ethnicity is a fact you infer from looking at someone. Now ask Deepseek about what happened in Tiananmen Square and watch what censorship actually looks like. It literally knows the facts, but then there's a layer that prevents it from stating the facts. That's censorship. It's not an opinion, it's not a choice when facing a gradient, it's just an historical known fact.
mgol94 6mo ago
What are you using LLMs for? To learn about world’s politics? Oh boy I have a news for you…
- rvba 6mo ago
  One of the first things I did when openAI came out was asking it "which active politican is a spy?" - and it was blocked from the start. I asked early, at the time people were posting various jailbreaks, never worked. On a side note, any self hosted model I can get for my PC? I have 96 GB of RAM.
  - KronisLV 6mo ago
    > On a side note, any self hosted model I can get for my PC? I have 96 GB of RAM. Try the 8 bit quantized version (UD-Q8_K_X) of Qwen 3.6 35B A3B by Unsloth: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-GGUF https://huggingface.co/unsloth/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-GGUF Some people also like the new Gemma 4 26B A4B model: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/gemma-4-26B-A4B-it-GGUF https://huggingface.co/unsloth/gemma-4-26B-A4B-it-GGUF Either should leave plenty of space for OS processes and also KV cache for a bigger context size. I'm guessing that MoE models might work better, though there are also dense versions you can try if you want. Performance and quality will probably both be worse than cloud models, though, but it's a nice start!
  - DANmode 6mo ago
    > and it was blocked from the start. Wait - what?
petre 6mo ago
Yeah, I specifically asked it about it. It seemed less censored than Gemini, back when it appeared and the latter was quite useless.
yieldcrv 6mo ago
It understands everything in thinking mode and will break down its rule system in adhering to Chinese regulation So if you or anyone passing by was curious, yes you can get accurate output about the Chinese head of state and political and critical messages of him, China and the party Its final answer will not play along If you want an unfiltered answer on that topic, just triage it to a western model, if you want unfiltered answers on Israel domestic and foreign policy, triage back to an eastern model. You know the rules for each system and so does an LLM
djeastm 6mo ago
Do you often find yourself asking your Chinese employees what they think about Winnie the Pooh?
kdheiwns 6mo ago
I can't even make American AIs say no no words. All AIs are lobotomized drones.

Can Deepseek answer probing questions about Winnie the Pooh?

harvey9 6mo ago

Is it subject to CCP censorship? Maybe.

windexh8er 6mo ago
It's fun to pretend the US models have no censorship constraints.
- deleted 6mo ago
  [deleted]
- zapnuk 6mo ago
  US models align with our "average" (western) values. If we outsource thinking by using LLMs, why would we outsource it to an LLM that doesn't have our values encoded in it?
  - HDBaseT 6mo ago
    [dead]
- pimeys 6mo ago
  I remember asking Gemini about that one famous 9/11 joke from late Norm MacDonald and it got really iffy about answering. Told it that hey I'm not american and in our culture it's not such a taboo. But yes, they do have similar constraints.
- libertine 6mo ago
  Any source for this?
  - windexh8er 6mo ago
    Basically any frontier model right now and ask it any politically divisive fact that may upset certain classes of people.
    - libertine 6mo ago
      For example? Because for Deepseek is pretty straightforward censorship.
      - rotis 6mo ago
        https://chatgpt.com/share/69f0dc83-ec70-83eb-896b-b258de2c9f33 https://chatgpt.com/share/69f0dc83-ec70-83eb-896b-b258de2c9f... https://claude.ai/share/ac4d2041-4328-4511-904a-ff8b1cbfc0bb https://claude.ai/share/ac4d2041-4328-4511-904a-ff8b1cbfc0bb Looks like self-censoring to me. Grok has no problems answering, so it is not a technical limitation: https://grok.com/share/bGVnYWN5_341d6428-ea7d-4b84-ad4d-8df9313478fe https://grok.com/share/bGVnYWN5_341d6428-ea7d-4b84-ad4d-8df9...
        libertine 6mo ago
        It doesn't look like self censoring at all - basically you want the default behavior of llms to gamble on the ethnicity of someone based on how they look. Grok used a book as a reference. It's not like ethnicity is a fact you infer from looking at someone. Now ask Deepseek about what happened in Tiananmen Square and watch what censorship actually looks like. It literally knows the facts, but then there's a layer that prevents it from stating the facts. That's censorship. It's not an opinion, it's not a choice when facing a gradient, it's just an historical known fact.

mgol94 6mo ago

What are you using LLMs for? To learn about world’s politics? Oh boy I have a news for you…

rvba 6mo ago
One of the first things I did when openAI came out was asking it "which active politican is a spy?" - and it was blocked from the start. I asked early, at the time people were posting various jailbreaks, never worked. On a side note, any self hosted model I can get for my PC? I have 96 GB of RAM.
- KronisLV 6mo ago
  > On a side note, any self hosted model I can get for my PC? I have 96 GB of RAM. Try the 8 bit quantized version (UD-Q8_K_X) of Qwen 3.6 35B A3B by Unsloth: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-GGUF https://huggingface.co/unsloth/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-GGUF Some people also like the new Gemma 4 26B A4B model: https://huggingface.co/unsloth/gemma-4-26B-A4B-it-GGUF https://huggingface.co/unsloth/gemma-4-26B-A4B-it-GGUF Either should leave plenty of space for OS processes and also KV cache for a bigger context size. I'm guessing that MoE models might work better, though there are also dense versions you can try if you want. Performance and quality will probably both be worse than cloud models, though, but it's a nice start!
- DANmode 6mo ago
  > and it was blocked from the start. Wait - what?

petre 6mo ago

Yeah, I specifically asked it about it. It seemed less censored than Gemini, back when it appeared and the latter was quite useless.

yieldcrv 6mo ago

It understands everything in thinking mode and will break down its rule system in adhering to Chinese regulation So if you or anyone passing by was curious, yes you can get accurate output about the Chinese head of state and political and critical messages of him, China and the party Its final answer will not play along If you want an unfiltered answer on that topic, just triage it to a western model, if you want unfiltered answers on Israel domestic and foreign policy, triage back to an eastern model. You know the rules for each system and so does an LLM

djeastm 6mo ago

Do you often find yourself asking your Chinese employees what they think about Winnie the Pooh?

kdheiwns 6mo ago

I can't even make American AIs say no no words. All AIs are lobotomized drones.