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The Classic American Diner
- gowld 6mo agoWhy is this boosted to the front page?
- andyfilms1 6mo agoIt's lunchtime
- _doctor_love 6mo agohttps://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html My intellectual curiosity was gratified, hence I think it's good.
- eaggsg 6mo ago[flagged]
- magneticnorth 6mo agoPersonally, I learned that some diners were mass-produced to look like train cars and fit conveniently on a train car, which I hadn't known. And if I weren't American and thus very familiar with classic American diners, I expect there would have been a lot that is new and interesting in this article & photo collection.
- _doctor_love 6mo agoCan nothing seriously be done about this kind of obvious bot account? There's so many of them on HN these days.
- AnimalMuppet 6mo agoBecause some people here found it interesting enough to hit the upvote button.
- tuvix 6mo agoVisited Portland, Maine recently and ate at Becky’s Diner there. What a wonderful place, the food was just what you would expect when walking in (and I mean that in the best way). It made me lament the lack of old school diners where I live. Sometimes you just need a perfectly cooked breakfast and some solid coffee!
- kshacker 6mo agoDon't know about "classic". But diners used to be my weekly jaunt here in South Bay for almost a decade. Not any more because with age you realize the quantity is too much and my drive to work changed (WFH). There's something special about going to your regular place, seeing the same servers, and them knowing your order before you say it. Probably the same in dinner restaurants but we don't repeat restaurants as often whereas the breakfast / lunch diner was weekly so very familiar (to both sides). Tried to switch places a couple of times just for experience but it never felt the same ... but you can make it work.
- yumraj 6mo agowhich one(s) in South Bay? any recommendations?
- kshacker 6mo agoMy favorite is Holders Country Inn. I used to go to the one in Cupertino before it burnt down. They moved, this was on Deanza long time back, and the one on Wolfe does not have the same old diner feeling, it is for the next gen :) Now I go to the one on Saratoga. And while I do not go as often to other places, I have been to and liked Hobees, then there is one Joe's near Half Moon Bay. We go there as a family when we hike at Cowell Purisima trail nearby. And while I am rambling about places to eat, a recent non-diner discovery has been El Caminito on El Camino Real.
- HoldOnAMinute 6mo agoI wouldn't call it a diner but if you like these other places you might like Los Gatos Cafe
- kshacker 6mo agoLol thanks I will check it out, and I guess I was using the word diner way too loose - if it serves burgers, eggs and coffee, it hit my benchmark.
- 6mo ago
- redsocksfan45 6mo agoI would be frequenting the diner I pass by every day on the way home, but for some reason they think it's good business to stop serving eggs after the morning. To me, a proper diner should keep the griddle on and be serving eggs any time of the day.
- chiph 6mo agoI took a visitor from Finland to a Jim's location in Austin, and they were in awe. "It's just like from the movies!" (because it was - it has been used several times as a filming location). If you have a classic diner in your town, take your foreign guests there for the experience.
- A_D_E_P_T 6mo agoLooks like they have them in Helsinki: > https://maps.app.goo.gl/NCiZgiRjGckp6Jzn6 https://maps.app.goo.gl/NCiZgiRjGckp6Jzn6 And if that doesn't appeal, there's another one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/e3ZWtXWEKPvDnded8 https://maps.app.goo.gl/e3ZWtXWEKPvDnded8 Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place. From Belgrade, Serbia: https://share.google/qGq9vC7tKgf0ISyLz https://share.google/qGq9vC7tKgf0ISyLz To out-of-the-way towns in Austria: https://maps.app.goo.gl/bzHfTAobTRkHpvAN9 https://maps.app.goo.gl/bzHfTAobTRkHpvAN9 Germany's chock full of them. (The Germans are also more obsessed with "Cowboys and Indians" and Western US culture than any nation I've ever seen.) France has multiple "American Diner" chains e.g.: https://www.happydaysdiner.com/ https://www.happydaysdiner.com/ I'd hazard that there are nearly as many of these restaurants outside the US as there are inside of it. Within the US it's "throwback/nostalgia." Outside the US it's "exotic/kitsch." Maybe your Finnish friend was remarking that the American version somehow felt more "real"? I don't know... I've been to all sorts, and the ones in Europe are truly very similar.
- bigyabai 6mo agoI think there's a difference between the "squeeze-in" style diners and simply American-style diners like the ones you've posted. A lot of the nostalgia comes from the tiny prefab buildings that barely manage to fit a bar and row of booth seats. Those are the ones from the movies that feel more authentic/classic in person, at least to me.
- thaumasiotes 6mo ago> Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place. What do they serve?
- thenipper 6mo agoOh nice. I remember miss bellows falls from growing up!
- mech422 6mo agoyeah - growing up in Claremont NH, right across the connecticut river from Vermont, it was cool to see a few 'local' places in the article
- Lammy 6mo ago> Not all diners look like train cars, but many do because they were fabricated to look that way, […] features a corrugated metal surface Article would do well to mention that this particular style comes from cars manufactured by Budd Company, who developed the necessary process of welding the stainless steel, first seen on Burlington's “Zephyr”: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shot_welding https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shot_welding - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_Zephyr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_Zephyr
- ButlerianJihad 6mo agoIf you want to dine in an actual railcar, visit the Old Spaghetti Factory! https://www.osf.com/ https://www.osf.com/
- hackingonempty 6mo agoOne of my hobbies is looking up old prices in the BLS CPI calculator to see what they would cost today (March 2026 is the latest data.) The June 1940 photograph along Hwy 1 in Maryland had $0.05 hotdogs ($1.17) and $0.10 burgers ($2.34). The Feb 1959 photograph from the NYC diner advertises a $0.45 burger ($5.14) and probably a $0.75 steak sandwich ($8.57)
- dylan604 6mo agoThese prices adjusted for today's value seem off though. I'm guessing you'd be hard pressed to find a diner burger for $5.14 anywhere. No, fast food joints are not the same here and not part of this discussion. Where is the discrepancy? I've never really trusted these "adjusted for inflation" type numbers. I'm not an economist so I have no idea how they are calculated, but they've always just felt off to me. Usually, the numbers are for something esoteric to me, but these are about something I have some familiarity. In my experience, the adjusted burger price is about half the actual cost of today.
- plemer 6mo agoThat may be the point. Simple inflation adjustment gives us x but the real price is more or less than x. Why is that?
- JumpCrisscross 6mo ago> Simple inflation adjustment gives us x but the real price is more or less than x. Why is that? Restaurant economics are a function of ingredient costs and labour. I suspect ingredient costs are close to OP's estimated multiples. But real wages are way up since the 1950s. Anything with a large labour component of costs will have tended to rise faster than inflation, which is an average of goods and services. (There are specialised metrics if you actually wanted to dig into this question.)
- dylan604 6mo agoAre you saying the prices listed were just for the ingredients and not the actual cost to the person ordering? They mentioned they saw the price in a photo which suggest it is what the person would be charged. I get that labor costs would cause an increase of raw ingredient price comparisons for total prices. But if you could pay buy a burger for a nickel but now need $10, there is a definite issue in just a "simple" adjustment that suggests you'd only need $5. If the numbers are that far off because the simple needs to be more advanced, what's the point of the simple numbers? Bad data is worse than no data.
- solomonb 6mo agoI love diners but they aren't affordable anymore! I want a cheap simple meal and bad coffee. The diners that seem to survive in this market end up up-scaling their menus. : (
- cogman10 6mo agoTastes have changed and I think people have been highly exposed to tastier dishes. There's also the "Denny's" problem. Classic diners tend to be pretty much the same as a Denny's in terms of quality.
- kube-system 6mo agoYeah, chain restaurants have dominated most of the market everywhere out through and including the exurbs. But if you go to somewhere deeply rural you can still find cheap crappy diner food.
- traderj0e 6mo agoSome of the random non-chain diners in the middle of some forested area are super nice and somehow not expensive, like the kind you stop at on the way to a ski trip. I'd think they'd be pricey cause of tourism or difficulty getting supplies.
- SJC_Hacker 6mo agoWaffle House is your jam. Only in the southern US unfortunately
- kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 6mo agoBonus, there's a solid chance of being ringside to an epic local MMA fight.
- kulahan 6mo agoWH is all over the place in the US. I live in CO and go regularly. I’m 90% sure I saw one when I was in Utah.
- neves 6mo agoThe photos does not display what I hate the most: the fixed 2 double seats tables. It is completely antisocial. You can't arrive with your group of six friends and "join tables" so everybody can seat together. What Americans have against a big group of friends?
- allthetime 6mo agoYou can fit at least 6 in one of those booths. Get closer with your friends! You can also play musical chairs and lean over the divider (or could before covid)
- rconti 6mo agoDoesn't fit in a rail car, at least not when paired with a walkway, and a counter/bar, and a kitchen?
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- gdulli 6mo agoTheir absence supports that it's not an omnipresent American pattern after all.
- ButlerianJihad 6mo agoCouple of things. First, the patrons never put the tables and chairs back where they're supposed to be (even if they try, they get it wrong), so the minimum-wage waitress/busboy is stuck with the job of rearranging furniture, and cleaning up the floors. This is one reason that large groups get the "mandatory gratuity" treatment. Turnover: every restaurant needs to turn over tables on the regular. If a large group is sort of lingering even after being decimated, and the diner can't reclaim those 4-tops for another party, that's potential lost revenue. [Hmm, is that how "The Four Tops" got their name?] Wait staff are often assigned "stations" based on a group of table numbers, so if you shove together enough tables for 12 patrons, you may have a conflict of 2-3 waitresses, but only one "main" can be allocated. Any table or chair that can be lifted or moved by a patron becomes a potential melee weapon. Diners are occupied by rough crowds and after-club drunks who are trying to sober up. This is also why you're lucky to get a butter knife with your sirloin. Booths feel more comfy, and offer a better feeling of privacy than tables. A table's more flexible if you have a family and toddlers, a wheelchair, or something, but booths are for lovers to cuddle.
- acheron 6mo agoWorcester, MA has several classic old diners still. Some used to be manufactured there, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worcester_Lunch_Car_Company https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worcester_Lunch_Car_Company
- contingencies 6mo agoI did a lot of research in to the evolution of US fast food culture recently, from a technology angle. If anyone would be interested in a run-down I might put together a video starting ~19th century and moving to present.
- v9v 6mo agoPut me down as interested!
- sgtaylor5 6mo agohttps://franksdiners.com https://franksdiners.com just looking at the video makes me hungry.
- joecool1029 6mo agoNJ got snubbed in this submission. We still have tons of independent diners (around 450 according to this article: https://www.npr.org/2024/04/01/1241959475/new-jersey-diners-adapt-to-survive-in-state-dubbed-diner-capital-of-the-world https://www.npr.org/2024/04/01/1241959475/new-jersey-diners-... )
- mc32 6mo agoYeah, it's weird, NJ is pretty well-known for having iconic Diners. People from many different states will know about NJ diners. https://www.tastingtable.com/1203923/best-diners-in-new-jersey-ranked/ https://www.tastingtable.com/1203923/best-diners-in-new-jers...
- fipar 6mo agoAnd people not even from the states (like me) know about NJ diners because one saw the birth of Unicode :)
- koolba 6mo ago> … NJ diners because one saw the birth of Unicode While it’s possible that Unicode was also conceived at a diner, you’re likely thinking of UTF-8. Unicode was from a decade earlier. https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ucs/utf-8-history.txt https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ucs/utf-8-history.txt
- fipar 6mo agoYup! That's what I was thinking about. In fact I did read this right before posting (though I had found it at https://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/utf-8_history https://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/utf-8_history) but only to validate that it had been in a NJ diner, so I missed my confusion of UTF-8 with Unicode. I would not make a good fact-checker :(
- caymanjim 6mo agoIt's virtually guaranteed that much of the birth of Unix itself took place at NJ diners.
- woohin 6mo ago[dead]
- m-s-y 6mo agoNot a single picture of a diner in Worcester, MA? For shame.
- kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 6mo agoProbably gave up when the speech to text kept butchering the spelling.
- dlivingston 6mo agoI love diners. The late nights of undergrad was spent in diner booths, with textbooks and laptops splayed, and cups of coffee that never ran dry. New Mexico has lots of great dinners scattered all around the state. I'm in Massachusetts now and enjoying those I can find here.
- dventimi 6mo agoYou can buy kits! http://www.dinermite.com/photos.html http://www.dinermite.com/photos.html
- fermentation 6mo agoThis is incredible. For only $380k I can have someone ship me a diner.
- dventimi 6mo agoIt'll pay for itself!
- dfxm12 6mo agoI think "diner" should be a protected term that has to meet certain criteria, like Kentucky Strait Bourbon. A diner should only be able to legally call itself a diner if it's open 24/7, has a glass case showing slices of its desserts, offers breakfast, lunch and dinner all day, and if you order spaghetti, your server yells back to the kitchen for "a mile of rope".
- socalgal2 6mo agoIn SF/LA there's Mel's which has been around since 1947. Unfortunately I've had some pretty bad meals there (the one a across from the Metreon). In SoCal there's also Ruby's. It not "classic" (started in 1982), but their original location is on the Balboa Pier which is pretty great (https://maps.app.goo.gl/WoWrLEmGwPbVaumq5 https://maps.app.goo.gl/WoWrLEmGwPbVaumq5)
- selimthegrim 6mo agoWhat about the one in the park over on the shore by Sunset, did it reopen?
- JSR_FDED 6mo agoThe lack and white photo “row of truck drivers sitting at a Maryland diner counter” has an amazing sense of place.
- penguin_booze 6mo agoIt feels weird that you sit on a counter and face the staff while you eat or drink (while do their job).
- pm90 6mo agoif you ever visit Austin do try Kerby Lane Cafe/Magnolia Cafe.
- geeunits 6mo agoThere's few places I've left a 1 star review, and sadly, Kerby was it.
- lasermatts 6mo agoNo mention of New Jersey, sacrilege.
- hackermailman 6mo agoThere's a well run diner here beside the courts and because they have booths which are a little more private than tables it's always full of lawyers with clients or architects with builders that need space to lay out plans. It's always some professionals utilizing the whole table. Many armed sheriffs too so there is always security. It's run like a Michelin star restaurant the second you are out of water someone is there to refill. You will never come in and not be acknowledged immediately no matter how busy inside the staff have magical training to be able to multitask. There is tight windows for court staff they have to return on time and can't be waiting around trying to pay a bill with no staff in sight. Beside it is a row of various hyper trendy restaurants that I never see similar patrons inside because they have terrible service and seating. The worst of them requires you to stand in a huge line and prepay then they bring the food out to you. This means watching idiot after idiot fumbling around with their phone or taking forever to find their card to pay while you stand in this line and burn up your lunch time. The clientele here is much different it's mostly tourists so is dead in the off season as no locals go. I'm always interested in seeing how service industry runs things and it's usually just doing the basics better than everyone else that makes all the difference
- qazxcvbnmlp 6mo agoIm convinced that real estate costs are whats confining restaurants to more confined service. In lower cost areas booths seem to be much more common.
- Joel11 6mo agoI like reading about these classic food cultures. It's fascinating how some traditions stay the same for decades
- dzonga 6mo agoI sometimes forget ford used to make cars more than trucks. the prices in that article shows the diners were cheap enough for a working man to eat daily there - a 10c dinner in 1940 - would be $2.38 today. you can't find a hot meal for $2.30 anywhere in the states or Western Europe today.