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> They can't maintain the code so they are no longer going to maintain the code. Yes, I don't see the point of maintaining technical debt just for the sake of

> They can't maintain the code so they are no longer going to maintain the code. Yes, I don't see the point of maintaining technical debt just for the sake of it. The security environment in 2026 is such that legacy unmaintained code is a very real security risk for obscure zero-days to exploit to gain a foot in the door. Reading through the list I don't see it being an issue for the overwhelming majority of Linux users. Who, for example, still uses ISDN in 2026 ? Most telcos have stopped all new sales and existing ISDN circuits will be forcefully disconnected within 3–5 years as the telcos complete their FTTP build-outs and the copper network is subsequently decomissioned.

devmor 6mo ago
> Who, for example, still uses ISDN in 2026? Most TV and radio stations.
- traceroute66 6mo ago
  > Most TV and radio stations. I doubt it. And as I said, telcos have ceased new sales of ISDN and will be shutting down copper networks within 3–5 years. Therefore if there are still TV and radio stations still using it, they will be forced to stop using it by circumstance, i.e. they will find their ISDN will cease working after the telco shuts down the kit in the exchange.
  - devmor 6mo ago
    You can doubt it all you want, ISDN is used internally in broadcast all over the world. Telcos shutting it down has nothing to do with them and won’t affect them. Losing support in software however, does.
    - traceroute66 6mo ago
      >You can doubt it all you want, ISDN is used internally in broadcast all over the world Since you claim to be a domain expert, give me hard named examples with independently verifiable links. At this stage I want facts, not anecdotes. Because right now, my semi-educated guess is they are all using IP-based streaming codecs and protocols for remote contributions, outside broadcast, studio links and pretty much everything else under the sun.
      - mike_hearn 6mo ago
        No, he's right. I have a friend who does voiceover work and is and announcer for the UK Channel 4. He does all his work from home using an ISDN link. It's a huge pita for him because the telcos don't want to know indeed, but it's the usual story with legacy workflows. I think it's also a fully switched system so you are guaranteed bandwidth with no packet drops or buffering which is clearly useful for broadcast work.
        traceroute66 6mo ago
        > No, he's right. I have a friend who does voiceover work and is and announcer for the UK Channel 4. He does all his work from home using an ISDN link. But how much is this to do with either Channel 4 not supporting (in the "assistance" sense of the word, rather than "interop") his move to IP or potentially his personal reluctance to change ("ain't broke don't fix it" mindset). Given he is in the UK and the incumbent telco (BT) are switching off ISDN in 2027, I really suspect there is more than meets the eye to your friend's story. I am not seeking to judge, I just feel realistically that it highly unlikely that at this late stage (1 year to go to 2027) there really is no other option other than ISDN when collaborating with Channel 4... The reason I say this is because even the briefest of internet search throws up hard publicly-available evidence that the broadcast world have indeed moved on in the world .... Way back in 2008 the BBC were already investigating options to move away from ISDN...[1] ... and evidence is out there the BBC are using SIP for critical things like remote Radio contributions[2] > guaranteed bandwidth with no packet drops or buffering You can absolutely get this on IP. [1] https://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp-pdf-files/WHP170.pdf https://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp-pdf-files/WHP170... [2] https://support.inquality.com/kb/faq.php?id=144 https://support.inquality.com/kb/faq.php?id=144
        mike_hearn 6mo ago
        I assume they have a migration plan or already migrated. I don't know, he told me this years ago. It wasn't his choice it is/was just the standard in the industry. I'm sure they're moving to IP at the moment, I was just pushing back on the idea that broadcast doesn't use it. If they've moved away from it, it's a relatively recent change (last five years or so).
- dezgeg 6mo ago
  Do they use it via mainline Linux kernel's ISNDN drivers though (and not something proprietary)?

devmor 6mo ago

> Who, for example, still uses ISDN in 2026? Most TV and radio stations.

traceroute66 6mo ago
> Most TV and radio stations. I doubt it. And as I said, telcos have ceased new sales of ISDN and will be shutting down copper networks within 3–5 years. Therefore if there are still TV and radio stations still using it, they will be forced to stop using it by circumstance, i.e. they will find their ISDN will cease working after the telco shuts down the kit in the exchange.
- devmor 6mo ago
  You can doubt it all you want, ISDN is used internally in broadcast all over the world. Telcos shutting it down has nothing to do with them and won’t affect them. Losing support in software however, does.
  - traceroute66 6mo ago
    >You can doubt it all you want, ISDN is used internally in broadcast all over the world Since you claim to be a domain expert, give me hard named examples with independently verifiable links. At this stage I want facts, not anecdotes. Because right now, my semi-educated guess is they are all using IP-based streaming codecs and protocols for remote contributions, outside broadcast, studio links and pretty much everything else under the sun.
    - mike_hearn 6mo ago
      No, he's right. I have a friend who does voiceover work and is and announcer for the UK Channel 4. He does all his work from home using an ISDN link. It's a huge pita for him because the telcos don't want to know indeed, but it's the usual story with legacy workflows. I think it's also a fully switched system so you are guaranteed bandwidth with no packet drops or buffering which is clearly useful for broadcast work.
      - traceroute66 6mo ago
        > No, he's right. I have a friend who does voiceover work and is and announcer for the UK Channel 4. He does all his work from home using an ISDN link. But how much is this to do with either Channel 4 not supporting (in the "assistance" sense of the word, rather than "interop") his move to IP or potentially his personal reluctance to change ("ain't broke don't fix it" mindset). Given he is in the UK and the incumbent telco (BT) are switching off ISDN in 2027, I really suspect there is more than meets the eye to your friend's story. I am not seeking to judge, I just feel realistically that it highly unlikely that at this late stage (1 year to go to 2027) there really is no other option other than ISDN when collaborating with Channel 4... The reason I say this is because even the briefest of internet search throws up hard publicly-available evidence that the broadcast world have indeed moved on in the world .... Way back in 2008 the BBC were already investigating options to move away from ISDN...[1] ... and evidence is out there the BBC are using SIP for critical things like remote Radio contributions[2] > guaranteed bandwidth with no packet drops or buffering You can absolutely get this on IP. [1] https://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp-pdf-files/WHP170.pdf https://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp-pdf-files/WHP170... [2] https://support.inquality.com/kb/faq.php?id=144 https://support.inquality.com/kb/faq.php?id=144
        mike_hearn 6mo ago
        I assume they have a migration plan or already migrated. I don't know, he told me this years ago. It wasn't his choice it is/was just the standard in the industry. I'm sure they're moving to IP at the moment, I was just pushing back on the idea that broadcast doesn't use it. If they've moved away from it, it's a relatively recent change (last five years or so).
dezgeg 6mo ago
Do they use it via mainline Linux kernel's ISNDN drivers though (and not something proprietary)?