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Oh my god, yet _another_ "developer-focused" laptop with full-sized left/right arrow keys, which are an absolutely miserable experience to actually use. How is

Oh my god, yet _another_ "developer-focused" laptop with full-sized left/right arrow keys, which are an absolutely miserable experience to actually use. How is it that Apple is the only company these days() that consistently gets this right? ( Yes, I know they used full-sized keys for a while, I moaned and cursed them at the time as well.)

bigyabai 6mo ago
The modern Thinkpad arrow cluster spoils me; most other laptops leave me reaching for a convenient pgup/pgdn key that doesn't exist. I'd much rather see something like that, going back to Fn+up/dn makes me feel like a caveman.
trostaft 6mo ago
? Sorry, I've never seen this perspective, why do you want the smaller ones? The small arrow keys on my MacBook are one of my least favorite parts of the keyboard.
- bschwindHN 6mo ago
  You want the smaller ones so you can easily locate the arrow key cluster without having to look. The empty space above the left and right arrow keys is a good tactile indicator that your fingers are on the correct location.
kristianp 6mo ago
I agree with you that having full height left-right and half-sized up-down is a pain, because of the inconsistency. The problem I have with laptop keyboard is that the arrow key height is too small, and the cluster itself is too crowded to sit my fingers on comfortably when using arrows. I want the arrow cluster to have full sized keys.
stavros 6mo ago
Real developers use hjkl, which, if this keyboard uses QMK like their previous ones, you can just remap to actual arrows (with a modifier key). I am only slightly joking.
manuhabitela 6mo ago
> How is it that Apple is the only company these days() that consistently gets this right? Thinkpads also do this right, and have a way better keyboard layout than macbooks actually :)
lawn 6mo ago
A developer-focused laptop shouldn't even need arrow keys. It's weird what people prioritize.

bigyabai 6mo ago

The modern Thinkpad arrow cluster spoils me; most other laptops leave me reaching for a convenient pgup/pgdn key that doesn't exist. I'd much rather see something like that, going back to Fn+up/dn makes me feel like a caveman.

trostaft 6mo ago

? Sorry, I've never seen this perspective, why do you want the smaller ones? The small arrow keys on my MacBook are one of my least favorite parts of the keyboard.

bschwindHN 6mo ago
You want the smaller ones so you can easily locate the arrow key cluster without having to look. The empty space above the left and right arrow keys is a good tactile indicator that your fingers are on the correct location.

kristianp 6mo ago

I agree with you that having full height left-right and half-sized up-down is a pain, because of the inconsistency. The problem I have with laptop keyboard is that the arrow key height is too small, and the cluster itself is too crowded to sit my fingers on comfortably when using arrows. I want the arrow cluster to have full sized keys.

stavros 6mo ago

Real developers use hjkl, which, if this keyboard uses QMK like their previous ones, you can just remap to actual arrows (with a modifier key). I am only slightly joking.

manuhabitela 6mo ago

> How is it that Apple is the only company these days() that consistently gets this right? Thinkpads also do this right, and have a way better keyboard layout than macbooks actually :)

lawn 6mo ago

A developer-focused laptop shouldn't even need arrow keys. It's weird what people prioritize.