5 ms·

Well, I hope I'm not, but yes, I will be quite disappointed if so.

dwaite 6mo ago
My condolences in advance
brandall10 6mo ago
Apple is a multi-trillion dollar public company. It would be unusual for a leader of such a thing not act in accordance w/ shareholders' best interests, as well to defy likely board guidance.
- jmye 6mo ago
  “Capitulating to the current regime on everything is in shareholder’s best interests” is neither a foregone conclusion nor a statement of fact. It’s economic myopia at best.
  - brandall10 6mo ago
    Let me be clear - I'm not happy about it. But ignoring such a reality reminds me of that quote comparing Job's best friend to a lawnmower. That said, I'd love to enlightened to how it's myopic, or rather, what course(s) of action you would take, keeping in mind that Apple is a multi-trillion dollar public company.
    - jmye 6mo ago
      I’m telling you that thinking a->b is myopic. It could be that shareholder value would’ve been higher had Tim Cook told Trump (or Biden, or Trump, or Obama) to go fuck himself. Perhaps the people who spend money on iPhones, specifically, would’ve been more inclined to buy a new iProduct, than they are now that he’s bent the knee. Myopia is thinking “well he did it so it must have been good”. There are myriad other things he could’ve done, that have a strong argument towards higher shareholder value. Edit to add: Think TSLA, if you want a concrete example. If that stock was at all trading on fundamentals (and if they had a remotely capable or competent board) and not Magic Memes, Musk’s hard right pivot was inarguably bad for the brand and shareholder value, even if it made the President temporarily happy.
      - Nevermark 6mo ago
        Counterfactuals are weak opinion, at best. Given that Apple is doing well, the onus is on someone claiming that Apple would have done better, having a strong argument. Not "could" have done better, because things could obviously have gone better, worse, or anything else, given any substantive or random difference. Could means nothing. (And I say this as someone very disappointed with how Cook handled that.)
        pohl 6mo ago
        I’d rather hear from someone suggesting, counterfactually, that they would have done worse had they not capitulated. What’s that argument like?
        Nevermark 6mo ago
        You want motivated reasoning? It’s not clear what you are saying, other than what you want to hear.
        jmye 6mo ago
        > Counterfactuals are weak opinion, at best. Ah, "If you can't definitively and completely prove a negative then you're wrong (but also I'm like, totally not carrying water for those people)" is definitely not a weak opinion, though. That said, maybe you should read the discussion a bit more carefully before jumping in with "OMG PROOOOOOF" or whatever the fuck this was supposed to be? The entire, plain English discussion, revolved around one thing not being the only possible "fact" just because it happened. None of the posts were particularly long, and none used challenging words.
        Nevermark 6mo ago
        My point isn’t that anyone’s view is wrong. I can’t make that claim either. I hate what Cook did. I would be happy and open to anyone who can point out how Apple was supposed to handle the actual threat of major tariffs in their components and systems better than he did. But simply asserting a counter factual, a plausible way it might have been better, isn’t that. What would Cook be expected to do with that? But what? Not dismissing that there was a better way. There must be. It’s very worthwhile figuring out, even as a counter factual. That’s how we all learn.l Not judging anyone. My answer is just or even more weak! I have really thought about this too, and come up with nothing so far. (I appreciate and take note that my comment didn’t communicate my point well enough. It’s important to recognize weak reasoning. But that wasn’t meant to discourage, or show a lack of respect for another person’s efforts. I want a better answer too.)
- shye 6mo ago
  Most shareholders may not care beyond the next quarter, but CEO action that led to those results were made couple of years ago at least, and current action will do as much to determine not the next quarter, but one slightly further in the future. Hence Jamie Dimon, for example, making a different decision in a similar matter. As Dimon explained: “[…] we have to be very careful about how anything is perceived, and also how the next DOJ is going to deal with it. So, we’re quite conscious of risks we bear by doing anything that looks like buying favors or anything like that”[1]. --- [1] https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/05/business/video/jp-morgan-chase-ceo-jamie-dimon-full-intv-ebof-digvid https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/05/business/video/jp-morgan-chas...
mrexcess 6mo ago
Wouldn’t Ternus have had a hand in the Apple Silicon backdoor? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43003230 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43003230
- saagarjha 6mo ago
  Unlikely and it also doesn’t really seem like a backdoor

My condolences in advance

Apple is a multi-trillion dollar public company. It would be unusual for a leader of such a thing not act in accordance w/ shareholders' best interests, as well to defy likely board guidance.

jmye 6mo ago
“Capitulating to the current regime on everything is in shareholder’s best interests” is neither a foregone conclusion nor a statement of fact. It’s economic myopia at best.
- brandall10 6mo ago
  Let me be clear - I'm not happy about it. But ignoring such a reality reminds me of that quote comparing Job's best friend to a lawnmower. That said, I'd love to enlightened to how it's myopic, or rather, what course(s) of action you would take, keeping in mind that Apple is a multi-trillion dollar public company.
  - jmye 6mo ago
    I’m telling you that thinking a->b is myopic. It could be that shareholder value would’ve been higher had Tim Cook told Trump (or Biden, or Trump, or Obama) to go fuck himself. Perhaps the people who spend money on iPhones, specifically, would’ve been more inclined to buy a new iProduct, than they are now that he’s bent the knee. Myopia is thinking “well he did it so it must have been good”. There are myriad other things he could’ve done, that have a strong argument towards higher shareholder value. Edit to add: Think TSLA, if you want a concrete example. If that stock was at all trading on fundamentals (and if they had a remotely capable or competent board) and not Magic Memes, Musk’s hard right pivot was inarguably bad for the brand and shareholder value, even if it made the President temporarily happy.
    - Nevermark 6mo ago
      Counterfactuals are weak opinion, at best. Given that Apple is doing well, the onus is on someone claiming that Apple would have done better, having a strong argument. Not "could" have done better, because things could obviously have gone better, worse, or anything else, given any substantive or random difference. Could means nothing. (And I say this as someone very disappointed with how Cook handled that.)
      - pohl 6mo ago
        I’d rather hear from someone suggesting, counterfactually, that they would have done worse had they not capitulated. What’s that argument like?
        Nevermark 6mo ago
        You want motivated reasoning? It’s not clear what you are saying, other than what you want to hear.
      - jmye 6mo ago
        > Counterfactuals are weak opinion, at best. Ah, "If you can't definitively and completely prove a negative then you're wrong (but also I'm like, totally not carrying water for those people)" is definitely not a weak opinion, though. That said, maybe you should read the discussion a bit more carefully before jumping in with "OMG PROOOOOOF" or whatever the fuck this was supposed to be? The entire, plain English discussion, revolved around one thing not being the only possible "fact" just because it happened. None of the posts were particularly long, and none used challenging words.
        Nevermark 6mo ago
        My point isn’t that anyone’s view is wrong. I can’t make that claim either. I hate what Cook did. I would be happy and open to anyone who can point out how Apple was supposed to handle the actual threat of major tariffs in their components and systems better than he did. But simply asserting a counter factual, a plausible way it might have been better, isn’t that. What would Cook be expected to do with that? But what? Not dismissing that there was a better way. There must be. It’s very worthwhile figuring out, even as a counter factual. That’s how we all learn.l Not judging anyone. My answer is just or even more weak! I have really thought about this too, and come up with nothing so far. (I appreciate and take note that my comment didn’t communicate my point well enough. It’s important to recognize weak reasoning. But that wasn’t meant to discourage, or show a lack of respect for another person’s efforts. I want a better answer too.)
shye 6mo ago
Most shareholders may not care beyond the next quarter, but CEO action that led to those results were made couple of years ago at least, and current action will do as much to determine not the next quarter, but one slightly further in the future. Hence Jamie Dimon, for example, making a different decision in a similar matter. As Dimon explained: “[…] we have to be very careful about how anything is perceived, and also how the next DOJ is going to deal with it. So, we’re quite conscious of risks we bear by doing anything that looks like buying favors or anything like that”[1]. --- [1] https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/05/business/video/jp-morgan-chase-ceo-jamie-dimon-full-intv-ebof-digvid https://www.cnn.com/2025/11/05/business/video/jp-morgan-chas...

mrexcess 6mo ago

Wouldn’t Ternus have had a hand in the Apple Silicon backdoor? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43003230 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43003230

saagarjha 6mo ago
Unlikely and it also doesn’t really seem like a backdoor