3 ms·

I mean, I don't disagree with you in this case, but if not this, then to a degree, what is IP for? This just happens to be a positive example, IP still exists

by Folcon 6mo ago

I mean, I don't disagree with you in this case, but if not this, then to a degree, what is IP for? This just happens to be a positive example, IP still exists to restrict certain kinds of competition I mean you can't get a clearer case of copycatting than this, as much as I'm a fan of pirate servers, assuming that they don't stifle the original game and considering calling Blizzard an 800 pound gorilla is quite an understatement in this case, I doubt this could

thaumasiotes 6mo ago
> but if not this, then to a degree, what is IP for? The same thing other state-granted monopolies are for.
Subdivide8452 6mo ago
Totally agree with this. Blizzard nowadays is a giant, but nobody would have blamed them if they remained a small studio, trying to protect what they've worked hard for to create. Just because they have a lot of money now, doesn't legally change a thing. It sucks because Blizzard has become a shitty company, and I'd like these types of devs from Turtle WoW to be able to continue their work, but you have to draw the line somewhere.
Ygg2 6mo ago
> I mean you can't get a clearer case of copycatting than this I'm pretty sure Turtle WoW has its own storyline, quests, etc. The story focuses heavily on extending Vanilla. In other words, it's not a simple copycat but a fan project. Rather than hiring and vying for talent, Blizzard is CnD their fans away.
- Folcon 6mo ago
  That's what I mean by a positive example A fan project still encroaches and Blizzard as many have pointed out is well within their rights to do this In case I wasn't clear enough, I'm not a fan of this move, I don't think it's a good thing they're doing, however I can't deny they can choose to do it If we want their behaviour to be constrained, then we've got to either convince them otherwise, regulate away their ability to do this or weaken copyright to prevent this That's the reality of the situation
  - Ygg2 6mo ago
    > A fan project still encroaches and Blizzard as many have pointed out is well within their rights to do this Sure, but I'm sure that IP laws don't demand you send CnD any fan project[1]. In the past, they were way more lenient. I guess they got scarred by their DotA experience. And honestly DotA mismanagement was their own fault. Stuff like that has a hugely detrimental effect; see Games Workshop and Warhammer 40k fan projects. [1] As far as I know the law doesn't prohibit to giving the server a license to run as a non-profit or giving them a cheap, short term license.
    - dpoloncsak 6mo ago
      IANAL but from what I understand, failure to enforce your IP in situations like this is often legally interpreted as a forfeit of your IP, and creates much more friction if you ever need to enforce it down the line
      - Ygg2 6mo ago
        Sure, but giving them a generous IP license isn't considered a forfeit of your IP. Blizzard actually went a step beyond and asked for your forfeit of any IP that you make with their tools. Not that any of those tools was used for Turtle WoW.
- nkrisc 6mo ago
  So why didn’t they just make a game with their own IP and avoid this whole issue in the first place? Oh yeah, because people didn’t want a new game, they wanted free WoW.
  - Ygg2 6mo ago
    Why do people write fanfiction rather than writing their original stuff? > Oh yeah, because people didn’t want a new game, they wanted free WoW. That's an error; Turtle WoW isn't a free WoW. It's WoW fixed to classic, with 2 new races, extra content. It's basically their flavor of WoW. Free WoW exists and it's called a pirate server. This isn't it chief.
    - nkrisc 6mo ago
      It’s WoW but it’s not WoW? Sounds like they’re talented game designers and they sunk their whole project because they stole art and assets. Sounds like they could have made a cool, new game with their own assets and been successful if it stands so well on its own merits.
      - Ygg2 6mo ago
        > It’s WoW but it’s not WoW? It's substantially different from a pirate server. > Sounds like they’re talented game designers and they sunk their whole project because they stole art and assets. At the end of the day, they are in essence WoW modders. Plus, a new game with own assets and engine is a different beast compared to modding an existing engine.
        Folcon 6mo ago
        Yes, and talented modders sometimes become a new studio, that's all I was wondering, if that was going to happen here
Salgat 6mo ago
Turtle WoW built off a 20 year old client with their own original content. After how many decades do you think it is acceptable for people to be allowed to mod and sell their own version of it? 75 years like with Disney? Would you feel that society would be worse off if people were allowed to sell modded N64 games?

by Folcon 6mo ago

thaumasiotes 6mo ago

> but if not this, then to a degree, what is IP for? The same thing other state-granted monopolies are for.

Subdivide8452 6mo ago

Totally agree with this. Blizzard nowadays is a giant, but nobody would have blamed them if they remained a small studio, trying to protect what they've worked hard for to create. Just because they have a lot of money now, doesn't legally change a thing. It sucks because Blizzard has become a shitty company, and I'd like these types of devs from Turtle WoW to be able to continue their work, but you have to draw the line somewhere.

Ygg2 6mo ago

> I mean you can't get a clearer case of copycatting than this I'm pretty sure Turtle WoW has its own storyline, quests, etc. The story focuses heavily on extending Vanilla. In other words, it's not a simple copycat but a fan project. Rather than hiring and vying for talent, Blizzard is CnD their fans away.

Folcon 6mo ago
That's what I mean by a positive example A fan project still encroaches and Blizzard as many have pointed out is well within their rights to do this In case I wasn't clear enough, I'm not a fan of this move, I don't think it's a good thing they're doing, however I can't deny they can choose to do it If we want their behaviour to be constrained, then we've got to either convince them otherwise, regulate away their ability to do this or weaken copyright to prevent this That's the reality of the situation
- Ygg2 6mo ago
  > A fan project still encroaches and Blizzard as many have pointed out is well within their rights to do this Sure, but I'm sure that IP laws don't demand you send CnD any fan project[1]. In the past, they were way more lenient. I guess they got scarred by their DotA experience. And honestly DotA mismanagement was their own fault. Stuff like that has a hugely detrimental effect; see Games Workshop and Warhammer 40k fan projects. [1] As far as I know the law doesn't prohibit to giving the server a license to run as a non-profit or giving them a cheap, short term license.
  - dpoloncsak 6mo ago
    IANAL but from what I understand, failure to enforce your IP in situations like this is often legally interpreted as a forfeit of your IP, and creates much more friction if you ever need to enforce it down the line
    - Ygg2 6mo ago
      Sure, but giving them a generous IP license isn't considered a forfeit of your IP. Blizzard actually went a step beyond and asked for your forfeit of any IP that you make with their tools. Not that any of those tools was used for Turtle WoW.
nkrisc 6mo ago
So why didn’t they just make a game with their own IP and avoid this whole issue in the first place? Oh yeah, because people didn’t want a new game, they wanted free WoW.
- Ygg2 6mo ago
  Why do people write fanfiction rather than writing their original stuff? > Oh yeah, because people didn’t want a new game, they wanted free WoW. That's an error; Turtle WoW isn't a free WoW. It's WoW fixed to classic, with 2 new races, extra content. It's basically their flavor of WoW. Free WoW exists and it's called a pirate server. This isn't it chief.
  - nkrisc 6mo ago
    It’s WoW but it’s not WoW? Sounds like they’re talented game designers and they sunk their whole project because they stole art and assets. Sounds like they could have made a cool, new game with their own assets and been successful if it stands so well on its own merits.
    - Ygg2 6mo ago
      > It’s WoW but it’s not WoW? It's substantially different from a pirate server. > Sounds like they’re talented game designers and they sunk their whole project because they stole art and assets. At the end of the day, they are in essence WoW modders. Plus, a new game with own assets and engine is a different beast compared to modding an existing engine.
      - Folcon 6mo ago
        Yes, and talented modders sometimes become a new studio, that's all I was wondering, if that was going to happen here

Salgat 6mo ago

Turtle WoW built off a 20 year old client with their own original content. After how many decades do you think it is acceptable for people to be allowed to mod and sell their own version of it? 75 years like with Disney? Would you feel that society would be worse off if people were allowed to sell modded N64 games?