4 ms·

I just want this whole idea to kindly please bog off. We shouldn't be further creating the apparatus of the surveillance state.

illiac786 6mo ago
I want corrupt politicians to bog off and people to think long term. I guess we’re both going to be very disappointed.
ilumanty 6mo ago
Yeah I don’t like how the discussion is shifting to implementation details, instead of debating whether any of this is good or necessary
- karussell 6mo ago
  IMO the implementation is crucial. If everything is locally on the device and I can confirm digitally that I'm older than 18 BUT NOTHING ELSE is leaked, like the German eID supports (I think). Why/how would this be a bad thing?
  - slackfan 6mo ago
    Implementing this is fascist.
  - Tanoc 6mo ago
    Because that's debating the mechanics of it rather than the need or the ethics. Nobody gives a shit about the mechanics because if there's a debate about the mechanics that means the discussions about the need and the ethics have already happened. Yet those discussions are in fact still going with few in favour of the ethics or need for these systems. The mechanics are the final step after everything else has been settled.
0-_-0 6mo ago
My understanding is that this is much more privacy friendly than showing your id
- tiluha 6mo ago
  Makes no difference in the fundamental dislike i have for the concept
  - magicalhippo 6mo ago
    Do you also dislike the concept of requiring to be a certain age to say enter a strip club or a sex club? If not, what is the difference between those controls and having to be a certain age to enter porn sites? Genuinely curious. To me, the primary objection to the online controls has been the implementations. The EU implementation will be[1] even better than the strip club, where the bouncer sees your ID and can remember it, when they move to zero-knowledge proofs. [1]: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-releases-enhanced-second-version-age-verification-blueprint https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-rel...
    - a0123 6mo ago
      First of all yes. Secondly, it's the dumbest comparison anyone could possibly make. The difference with a porn website is as follows: - the age check on porn sites are notoriously dumb and useless, it's literally a meme. It was a meme before there were memes. - I choose to go on porn sites. It's not exactly a requirement that I get access to a porn site. Access to my OS on my device to work, have fun or do whatever I want privately is kind of a lot more necessary. "Zero knowledge proof". Yeah OK. I've got a few dozen bridges to sell you. Interested?
      - magicalhippo 6mo ago
        > First of all yes. That at least explains a fair bit. > the age check on porn sites are notoriously dumb and useless That they have been useless is hardly an argument that's relevant to the current discussion. > I choose to go on porn sites. It's not exactly a requirement that I get access to a porn site. Indeed. > Access to my OS on my device to work, have fun or do whatever I want privately is kind of a lot more necessary. Sure, but that is an entirely different discussion. Anyway, if you had some actual substance to your flippant dismissal it could perhaps lead to some interesting discussion.

illiac786 6mo ago

I want corrupt politicians to bog off and people to think long term. I guess we’re both going to be very disappointed.

ilumanty 6mo ago

Yeah I don’t like how the discussion is shifting to implementation details, instead of debating whether any of this is good or necessary

karussell 6mo ago
IMO the implementation is crucial. If everything is locally on the device and I can confirm digitally that I'm older than 18 BUT NOTHING ELSE is leaked, like the German eID supports (I think). Why/how would this be a bad thing?
- slackfan 6mo ago
  Implementing this is fascist.
- Tanoc 6mo ago
  Because that's debating the mechanics of it rather than the need or the ethics. Nobody gives a shit about the mechanics because if there's a debate about the mechanics that means the discussions about the need and the ethics have already happened. Yet those discussions are in fact still going with few in favour of the ethics or need for these systems. The mechanics are the final step after everything else has been settled.

0-_-0 6mo ago

My understanding is that this is much more privacy friendly than showing your id

tiluha 6mo ago
Makes no difference in the fundamental dislike i have for the concept
- magicalhippo 6mo ago
  Do you also dislike the concept of requiring to be a certain age to say enter a strip club or a sex club? If not, what is the difference between those controls and having to be a certain age to enter porn sites? Genuinely curious. To me, the primary objection to the online controls has been the implementations. The EU implementation will be[1] even better than the strip club, where the bouncer sees your ID and can remember it, when they move to zero-knowledge proofs. [1]: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-releases-enhanced-second-version-age-verification-blueprint https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-rel...
  - a0123 6mo ago
    First of all yes. Secondly, it's the dumbest comparison anyone could possibly make. The difference with a porn website is as follows: - the age check on porn sites are notoriously dumb and useless, it's literally a meme. It was a meme before there were memes. - I choose to go on porn sites. It's not exactly a requirement that I get access to a porn site. Access to my OS on my device to work, have fun or do whatever I want privately is kind of a lot more necessary. "Zero knowledge proof". Yeah OK. I've got a few dozen bridges to sell you. Interested?
    - magicalhippo 6mo ago
      > First of all yes. That at least explains a fair bit. > the age check on porn sites are notoriously dumb and useless That they have been useless is hardly an argument that's relevant to the current discussion. > I choose to go on porn sites. It's not exactly a requirement that I get access to a porn site. Indeed. > Access to my OS on my device to work, have fun or do whatever I want privately is kind of a lot more necessary. Sure, but that is an entirely different discussion. Anyway, if you had some actual substance to your flippant dismissal it could perhaps lead to some interesting discussion.