4 ms·

This is a popular idea amongst American liberals who rejoice at any possible means to eliminate/curb/add friction to lawful firearms ownership and manufacturing

by 15155 6mo ago

This is a popular idea amongst American liberals who rejoice at any possible means to eliminate/curb/add friction to lawful firearms ownership and manufacturing. Where are they buying firearms in America at an "industrial scale?" An AR-15 receiver can be turned out in tens of minutes on a fast VMC - good luck stopping this.

consumer451 6mo ago
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/firearms-trace-data-mexico-2019-2024 https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/fire... https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/report/nfcta-volume-ii-part-iii-crime-guns-recovered-and-traced-us/download https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/report/nfcta-volume-ii-par... https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/firearms-trace-data-mexico-2018-2023 https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/fire... https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-21-322 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-21-322 https://www.gao.gov/video/weapons-recovered-arms-trafficking-mexico https://www.gao.gov/video/weapons-recovered-arms-trafficking...
- 15155 6mo ago
  Yep, just keep spamming these links. I'll keep milling, good luck with your agenda.
  - consumer451 6mo ago
    Yes, showing the preponderance of evidence against your easily disproven argument is actually "my agenda." Great job on calling that out. I grew up hunting. Like any other redneck, I fired a .308 at 13yrs old, and yes it knocked me to the ground, lol. Skinned a dear that same year. I just didn't choose to make guns my entire identity. All I am stating is the obvious. The USA is a major firearms manufacturer and exporter.
    - 15155 6mo ago
      It's not "disproven" - when an organization can buy a $30k machine and crank out high-quality firearms all day long, you can't do anything to stop it.
      - consumer451 6mo ago
        All you have done is shown that you have no idea how difficult and time consuming machining is, vs. mass production.
        15155 6mo ago
        I know for a fact that mass methamphetamine and fentanyl synthesis is more technically-difficult, more time consuming, and more capital-intensive than mass-manufacture of firearms - but good luck pushing your "Iron River" narrative lmao.
        consumer451 6mo ago
        At the risk of setting off the flame war detector on this website, please explain to me why simple chemistry that can be done anywhere, is easier than setting up a mass-manufacturing factory. I challenge you to explain to the exact relative differences. Also, why did you bring up fentanyl? How is that related to the very well documented Iron River? Well, I suppose it actually is, as the USA's very well documented supply of guns to Mexican cartels helps them bring up fent into the USA. Yay! Sorry to interrupt your previous narrative. Please, go on king.
        15155 6mo ago
        Gee, one requires huge industrial laboratories complete with niche equipment, highly-controlled precursors in massive quantities, and trained chemists.. the other requires commonly-available machinery and universally-obtainable, cheap materials and a scrappy high-school student who excelled in shop class. Seriously, you have no idea what you are talking about. I can have a receiver milled from billet in the time we've spent discussing this. Even the data you linked explains: Privately Made Firearms Law enforcement agencies recovered and submitted 37,980 suspected privately made firearms4 (PMFs) to ATF for tracing between 2017 and 2021. It is probable that current trace data significantly underrepresents the number of PMFs recovered in crimes by LEAs due to a variety of challenges presented by PMFs, to include: • PMFs involvement in crime is an emerging issue and LEAs are just beginning to institute uniform training on the recognition, identification, and reporting of PMFs that can lead to more accurate PMF data being collected. • PMFs by their nature may have no markings at all, duplicative markings, counterfeit markings, or markings that appear to be serial numbers on parts of the firearm other than the frame or receiver. These duplicative, counterfeit, or erroneous markings can be mistaken for authentic serial numbers and markings causing law enforcement to not recognize the firearm as a PMF and/or potentially follow false leads based on these markings. As Figure OFT-04 reflects, the number of suspected PMFs recovered by law enforcement agencies and submitted to ATF for tracing increased by 1,083% from 2017 (1,629) to 2021 (19,273). So, just domestically, home private firearms manufacturing totaled more units than all guns traced into Mexico in every given year.
  - deleted 6mo ago
    [deleted]
estearum 6mo ago
What’s the relevance of who “this is a popular idea” to? It’s either a good idea or it’s not. If it’s so easy, then why aren’t they doing that today and instead we just encounter thousands of guns bought in the US? Must be because that’s easier, correct? I get the sense you’re a bit pre-committed to your position here though and perceive this as a bit of an identity question.

by 15155 6mo ago

consumer451 6mo ago

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/firearms-trace-data-mexico-2019-2024 https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/fire... https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/report/nfcta-volume-ii-part-iii-crime-guns-recovered-and-traced-us/download https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/report/nfcta-volume-ii-par... https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/firearms-trace-data-mexico-2018-2023 https://www.atf.gov/firearms/report/firearms-trace-data/fire... https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-21-322 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-21-322 https://www.gao.gov/video/weapons-recovered-arms-trafficking-mexico https://www.gao.gov/video/weapons-recovered-arms-trafficking...

15155 6mo ago
Yep, just keep spamming these links. I'll keep milling, good luck with your agenda.
- consumer451 6mo ago
  Yes, showing the preponderance of evidence against your easily disproven argument is actually "my agenda." Great job on calling that out. I grew up hunting. Like any other redneck, I fired a .308 at 13yrs old, and yes it knocked me to the ground, lol. Skinned a dear that same year. I just didn't choose to make guns my entire identity. All I am stating is the obvious. The USA is a major firearms manufacturer and exporter.
  - 15155 6mo ago
    It's not "disproven" - when an organization can buy a $30k machine and crank out high-quality firearms all day long, you can't do anything to stop it.
    - consumer451 6mo ago
      All you have done is shown that you have no idea how difficult and time consuming machining is, vs. mass production.
      - 15155 6mo ago
        I know for a fact that mass methamphetamine and fentanyl synthesis is more technically-difficult, more time consuming, and more capital-intensive than mass-manufacture of firearms - but good luck pushing your "Iron River" narrative lmao.
        consumer451 6mo ago
        At the risk of setting off the flame war detector on this website, please explain to me why simple chemistry that can be done anywhere, is easier than setting up a mass-manufacturing factory. I challenge you to explain to the exact relative differences. Also, why did you bring up fentanyl? How is that related to the very well documented Iron River? Well, I suppose it actually is, as the USA's very well documented supply of guns to Mexican cartels helps them bring up fent into the USA. Yay! Sorry to interrupt your previous narrative. Please, go on king.
        15155 6mo ago
        Gee, one requires huge industrial laboratories complete with niche equipment, highly-controlled precursors in massive quantities, and trained chemists.. the other requires commonly-available machinery and universally-obtainable, cheap materials and a scrappy high-school student who excelled in shop class. Seriously, you have no idea what you are talking about. I can have a receiver milled from billet in the time we've spent discussing this. Even the data you linked explains: Privately Made Firearms Law enforcement agencies recovered and submitted 37,980 suspected privately made firearms4 (PMFs) to ATF for tracing between 2017 and 2021. It is probable that current trace data significantly underrepresents the number of PMFs recovered in crimes by LEAs due to a variety of challenges presented by PMFs, to include: • PMFs involvement in crime is an emerging issue and LEAs are just beginning to institute uniform training on the recognition, identification, and reporting of PMFs that can lead to more accurate PMF data being collected. • PMFs by their nature may have no markings at all, duplicative markings, counterfeit markings, or markings that appear to be serial numbers on parts of the firearm other than the frame or receiver. These duplicative, counterfeit, or erroneous markings can be mistaken for authentic serial numbers and markings causing law enforcement to not recognize the firearm as a PMF and/or potentially follow false leads based on these markings. As Figure OFT-04 reflects, the number of suspected PMFs recovered by law enforcement agencies and submitted to ATF for tracing increased by 1,083% from 2017 (1,629) to 2021 (19,273). So, just domestically, home private firearms manufacturing totaled more units than all guns traced into Mexico in every given year.
- deleted 6mo ago
  [deleted]

estearum 6mo ago

What’s the relevance of who “this is a popular idea” to? It’s either a good idea or it’s not. If it’s so easy, then why aren’t they doing that today and instead we just encounter thousands of guns bought in the US? Must be because that’s easier, correct? I get the sense you’re a bit pre-committed to your position here though and perceive this as a bit of an identity question.