4 ms·

They’re still going the almost certainly end up running this on US designed chips, with US designed networking equipment and a bunch of other assets tied back t

by cmiles8 6mo ago

They’re still going the almost certainly end up running this on US designed chips, with US designed networking equipment and a bunch of other assets tied back to US companies. They should do what they want, but it’s “sovereignty theater” at best.

ghighi7878 6mo ago
You always have to start somewhere. Whether this will succeed or not is not known, but you do have to start somewhere.
- pessimizer 6mo ago
  Start with not antagonizing China, and you'll have other vendors to chose from.
omgwtfbyobbq 6mo ago
I wouldn't say that. I think it's a proportional response to US tarriffs/changes in foreign policy under the current administration, just like the cancellation of defence contracts/orders. It's unrealistic for any nation to do everything themselves, but they can make some changes in response to the US starting trade wars, ditching foreign policy/climate objectives, etc...
znnajdla 6mo ago
The US or Trump can’t switch off your chips or your networking equipment on a whim - and if they ever designed hardware that could do that, no one would buy such hardware as soon as that capability became known. Using cloud software is a much bigger risk - your access can be turned off anytime and data access is part of the deal. Sovereignty is not about building everything yourself. Division of labor advances civilization, but it doesn’t have to come at the cost of sovereignty. Sovereignty is about designing the work contract such that you don’t become entirely beholden to another party. You build hardware for me, but after that it’s mine, not yours. I trust you to build the hardware to fulfill that contract, and if you ever break that trust I’ll find someone else to build that hardware. That’s sovereignty. I don’t have to build everything myself.
- MaxPock 6mo ago
  Trump just needs to ask them to jump and they will ask how high.
  - pvaldes 6mo ago
    What you are missing is that, unlike US citizens, Europeans don't hesitate to fire their political parties. New parties will appear and take the power. The republicans from Sarkozy were swiftly replaced by Rennaisance by Macron, a party with just ten years of life. Even more, Sarcozy was jailed later by corruption, a symptom of a healthy democracy that US should try sometime (It would fix a lot of the current and future US problems). Jumping in the Trump circus in Europe one year ago, maybe could work; now it equals to political suicide after Greenland, the Middle East mess and the more and more obvious symptoms of Trump's dementia and disgusting behaviour. Definitely didn't worked for Elon in the past Germany elections. European politicians are very aware of this, currently. The elections in Hungary are probably ultra-rigged at this point, but we will see if Vance performing as guest comedian for the pro-Russian party Fidesz will help Orban (or Vance) in the long term.
Leomuck 6mo ago
Maybe, but chips cannot hold you hostage during work. I don't care where things are built (except when they are built somewhere where human rights are being treated like shit), software is what locks you into whatever bullshit the company decides on, not chips. So it is a good step I think. We don't have to be all "we don't use anything from outside the EU" - why? Some countries are better than others at stuff. Fair enough. The movement is about moving away from software monopolies that decide on what you can and can't do, not about having everything inside a certain geographical location.
anigbrowl 6mo ago
Rome wasn't built in a day, and its computing and networking technology wasn't replaced in a day either.

by cmiles8 6mo ago

ghighi7878 6mo ago

You always have to start somewhere. Whether this will succeed or not is not known, but you do have to start somewhere.

pessimizer 6mo ago
Start with not antagonizing China, and you'll have other vendors to chose from.

omgwtfbyobbq 6mo ago

I wouldn't say that. I think it's a proportional response to US tarriffs/changes in foreign policy under the current administration, just like the cancellation of defence contracts/orders. It's unrealistic for any nation to do everything themselves, but they can make some changes in response to the US starting trade wars, ditching foreign policy/climate objectives, etc...

znnajdla 6mo ago

The US or Trump can’t switch off your chips or your networking equipment on a whim - and if they ever designed hardware that could do that, no one would buy such hardware as soon as that capability became known. Using cloud software is a much bigger risk - your access can be turned off anytime and data access is part of the deal. Sovereignty is not about building everything yourself. Division of labor advances civilization, but it doesn’t have to come at the cost of sovereignty. Sovereignty is about designing the work contract such that you don’t become entirely beholden to another party. You build hardware for me, but after that it’s mine, not yours. I trust you to build the hardware to fulfill that contract, and if you ever break that trust I’ll find someone else to build that hardware. That’s sovereignty. I don’t have to build everything myself.

MaxPock 6mo ago
Trump just needs to ask them to jump and they will ask how high.
- pvaldes 6mo ago
  What you are missing is that, unlike US citizens, Europeans don't hesitate to fire their political parties. New parties will appear and take the power. The republicans from Sarkozy were swiftly replaced by Rennaisance by Macron, a party with just ten years of life. Even more, Sarcozy was jailed later by corruption, a symptom of a healthy democracy that US should try sometime (It would fix a lot of the current and future US problems). Jumping in the Trump circus in Europe one year ago, maybe could work; now it equals to political suicide after Greenland, the Middle East mess and the more and more obvious symptoms of Trump's dementia and disgusting behaviour. Definitely didn't worked for Elon in the past Germany elections. European politicians are very aware of this, currently. The elections in Hungary are probably ultra-rigged at this point, but we will see if Vance performing as guest comedian for the pro-Russian party Fidesz will help Orban (or Vance) in the long term.

Leomuck 6mo ago

Maybe, but chips cannot hold you hostage during work. I don't care where things are built (except when they are built somewhere where human rights are being treated like shit), software is what locks you into whatever bullshit the company decides on, not chips. So it is a good step I think. We don't have to be all "we don't use anything from outside the EU" - why? Some countries are better than others at stuff. Fair enough. The movement is about moving away from software monopolies that decide on what you can and can't do, not about having everything inside a certain geographical location.

anigbrowl 6mo ago

Rome wasn't built in a day, and its computing and networking technology wasn't replaced in a day either.