4 ms·

It's a shame what happened to this company. I used to really want a Tesla, but now the brand signifies your support for Musk/DOGE, they killed half their lineup

by tapoxi 6mo ago

It's a shame what happened to this company. I used to really want a Tesla, but now the brand signifies your support for Musk/DOGE, they killed half their lineup, and they keep mentioning that cars aren't the future as they aim for driverless taxis and robots. At least they opened the supercharger network. My mom picked up a Cadillac Optiq and even with her being on the other side of the country she was able to seamlessly transition to an EV.

verdverm 6mo ago
I was able to drive across the US in the winter in an Ioniq 6 without using Tesla chargers. All but a couple were 350V, WY was the worst state (NY->WA), battery conditioning had charges ~200V for the first phase until charge levels became the dominant factor. Ionna is 8 automakers building an alternative network https://www.ionna.com/founding-partners/ https://www.ionna.com/founding-partners/ Hyundai has their EV platform which has been 800V for a couple of years, future proof for the lifetime of the car considering how slow EV rollout is in the US...
- Toutouxc 6mo ago
  > All but a couple were 350V, WY was the worst state (NY->WA), battery conditioning had charges ~200V for the first phase until charge levels became the dominant factor. Sorry but what? I can maybe understand “V” instead of “kW” (why?), but what does the second part mean?
  - jdeibele 6mo ago
    EV batteries charge much faster from 10% or 20% to 60%, maybe somewhat higher than that. Going from 20% to 80% typically takes as long as going from 80% to 100% and so standard advice is never to charge to 100% unless you absolutely have to. Every model has a charging curve, which I've never seen a manufacturer provide but some reviews do their own.
    - Toutouxc 6mo ago
      I drive an EV, I asked because the comment genuinely didn’t make sense to me.
      - jdeibele 6mo ago
        https://www.evchargerreviews.net/best-ev-home-charger-for-hyundai-ioniq-6/ https://www.evchargerreviews.net/best-ev-home-charger-for-hy... You're right that the poster used V when they meant KW but the Level 3 DC Charging Curve graph shows what I think they're describing: their EV charged at over 200 KW until the battery reached about 46%, then it slowed significantly again at 62 or 63%. Maybe TMI, sorry if so.
        verdverm 6mo ago
        I'll confirm I meant KW not V for the charging numbers The Ioniq 6 (Hyundai EV platform generally), charge from 20-80% in about 20m, which is on their 800v DC architecture
- tapoxi 6mo ago
  Yeah I've had an ID4 for a few years and its certainly possible, but seemingly overnight the charging network doubled and its a net win for everyone. Also, my mom is in her 70s, those CCS plugs are huge! I'm glad everyone was able to standardize on NACS.
- gramie 6mo ago
  That sounds wonderful. Our experience with an Ioniq 6 has been less spectacular. First of all, in winter the range drops from 520km to about 350km, and charging takes about 50% longer. Then when we took a long trip we only found one or two charging stations faster than 10kW every 300km. Many of the chargers were not functioning, some were on private property (e.g. car dealerships) and closed on Sundays, and none of them were rated at more than 100kW (and typically charging at about 70kW). The ones that were 100kW often had one or more cars waiting for them, so our 90-minute charge could have taken double that. The only exception was a Tesla supercharger station, but my wife refuses to support Elon Musk in any way, so that was out. This is in Southern Ontario, outside the Greater Toronto Area.
4ndrewl 6mo ago
It'll be a case study in years to come. Dually turning the brand toxic to your core customers, and having a bonfire of a strategy around products.
burnt-resistor 6mo ago
Absolutely waste but with insufficient accountability. I don't understand how or why shareholders haven't sued him into penury. Taking political positions as a business figure is inherently fraught with risk, but then taking extreme political positions, openly flaunting drug use, and suggesting human decency is weakness is bloody weird and insane that will only lead to hubris. I don't want to know a CEO's religion or politics because these should be private matters.
- the_biot 6mo ago
  Because while Musk is certainly running Tesla into the ground, without him it would sink even faster. Without his hype jacking up the share price, it's just a carmaker with 2.5 models, cratering sales, fast obsoleting tech, and no new models in the near pipeline. All the shareholders can do is hang on to the ride for as long as they can.
- Zigurd 6mo ago
  That salute was too much even for the AfD. That it's not obvious to every American is an indicator of just how thoroughly boiled are we frogs.
  - burnt-resistor 6mo ago
    Covert bigots with self-awareness are more worrying than the overt ones lacking it because they try hard to pretend to simulate normal civility while knowing their symbols and ideals are still widely repugnant that they avoid any association with them while accumulating legitimacy and political power. People lacking empathy and believing they are better than others indeed represent the tao of fascism, and cannot be bargained with or appeased into cooperative, pro-social participation. Neville Chamberlain made that mistake that plunged the world into a more costlier war. Might I also suggest that expressing self-fulfilling prophecy, learned helpless, demotivating doubt and doom is both untrue and doesn't help advance individual or collective power, hope, or change. IOW, the "we're cooked" pattern behavior people fail to see how their selfish compulsion for unfiltered self-expression harms the cause of change and harms others by demotivating them.
RichardHesketh 6mo ago
[flagged]
dzhiurgis 6mo ago
I finally test drove friends BYD Sealion 7. Yes interior is very nice, soft materials, etc (to a point where it almost feels tacky). Drive felt much softer than my mid-gen Model Y (almost too boaty and rolly but thats is completely fine for a family car). The software is not great tho, really misses the point and I can see why people hate touchscreens. No single pedal driving (idk perhaps they haven't enabled it), no phone as key, no profiles, engine start/stop button. Overall I'd say people are sold on features without looking in depth what you get with Tesla. And Tesla still outselling any other brand here in NZ. Hope I can try out Zeekr 7x performance in couple of weeks. I heard a lot of good things about it.

by tapoxi 6mo ago

verdverm 6mo ago

I was able to drive across the US in the winter in an Ioniq 6 without using Tesla chargers. All but a couple were 350V, WY was the worst state (NY->WA), battery conditioning had charges ~200V for the first phase until charge levels became the dominant factor. Ionna is 8 automakers building an alternative network https://www.ionna.com/founding-partners/ https://www.ionna.com/founding-partners/ Hyundai has their EV platform which has been 800V for a couple of years, future proof for the lifetime of the car considering how slow EV rollout is in the US...

Toutouxc 6mo ago
> All but a couple were 350V, WY was the worst state (NY->WA), battery conditioning had charges ~200V for the first phase until charge levels became the dominant factor. Sorry but what? I can maybe understand “V” instead of “kW” (why?), but what does the second part mean?
- jdeibele 6mo ago
  EV batteries charge much faster from 10% or 20% to 60%, maybe somewhat higher than that. Going from 20% to 80% typically takes as long as going from 80% to 100% and so standard advice is never to charge to 100% unless you absolutely have to. Every model has a charging curve, which I've never seen a manufacturer provide but some reviews do their own.
  - Toutouxc 6mo ago
    I drive an EV, I asked because the comment genuinely didn’t make sense to me.
    - jdeibele 6mo ago
      https://www.evchargerreviews.net/best-ev-home-charger-for-hyundai-ioniq-6/ https://www.evchargerreviews.net/best-ev-home-charger-for-hy... You're right that the poster used V when they meant KW but the Level 3 DC Charging Curve graph shows what I think they're describing: their EV charged at over 200 KW until the battery reached about 46%, then it slowed significantly again at 62 or 63%. Maybe TMI, sorry if so.
      - verdverm 6mo ago
        I'll confirm I meant KW not V for the charging numbers The Ioniq 6 (Hyundai EV platform generally), charge from 20-80% in about 20m, which is on their 800v DC architecture
tapoxi 6mo ago
Yeah I've had an ID4 for a few years and its certainly possible, but seemingly overnight the charging network doubled and its a net win for everyone. Also, my mom is in her 70s, those CCS plugs are huge! I'm glad everyone was able to standardize on NACS.
gramie 6mo ago
That sounds wonderful. Our experience with an Ioniq 6 has been less spectacular. First of all, in winter the range drops from 520km to about 350km, and charging takes about 50% longer. Then when we took a long trip we only found one or two charging stations faster than 10kW every 300km. Many of the chargers were not functioning, some were on private property (e.g. car dealerships) and closed on Sundays, and none of them were rated at more than 100kW (and typically charging at about 70kW). The ones that were 100kW often had one or more cars waiting for them, so our 90-minute charge could have taken double that. The only exception was a Tesla supercharger station, but my wife refuses to support Elon Musk in any way, so that was out. This is in Southern Ontario, outside the Greater Toronto Area.

4ndrewl 6mo ago

It'll be a case study in years to come. Dually turning the brand toxic to your core customers, and having a bonfire of a strategy around products.

burnt-resistor 6mo ago

Absolutely waste but with insufficient accountability. I don't understand how or why shareholders haven't sued him into penury. Taking political positions as a business figure is inherently fraught with risk, but then taking extreme political positions, openly flaunting drug use, and suggesting human decency is weakness is bloody weird and insane that will only lead to hubris. I don't want to know a CEO's religion or politics because these should be private matters.

the_biot 6mo ago
Because while Musk is certainly running Tesla into the ground, without him it would sink even faster. Without his hype jacking up the share price, it's just a carmaker with 2.5 models, cratering sales, fast obsoleting tech, and no new models in the near pipeline. All the shareholders can do is hang on to the ride for as long as they can.
Zigurd 6mo ago
That salute was too much even for the AfD. That it's not obvious to every American is an indicator of just how thoroughly boiled are we frogs.
- burnt-resistor 6mo ago
  Covert bigots with self-awareness are more worrying than the overt ones lacking it because they try hard to pretend to simulate normal civility while knowing their symbols and ideals are still widely repugnant that they avoid any association with them while accumulating legitimacy and political power. People lacking empathy and believing they are better than others indeed represent the tao of fascism, and cannot be bargained with or appeased into cooperative, pro-social participation. Neville Chamberlain made that mistake that plunged the world into a more costlier war. Might I also suggest that expressing self-fulfilling prophecy, learned helpless, demotivating doubt and doom is both untrue and doesn't help advance individual or collective power, hope, or change. IOW, the "we're cooked" pattern behavior people fail to see how their selfish compulsion for unfiltered self-expression harms the cause of change and harms others by demotivating them.

RichardHesketh 6mo ago

[flagged]

dzhiurgis 6mo ago

I finally test drove friends BYD Sealion 7. Yes interior is very nice, soft materials, etc (to a point where it almost feels tacky). Drive felt much softer than my mid-gen Model Y (almost too boaty and rolly but thats is completely fine for a family car). The software is not great tho, really misses the point and I can see why people hate touchscreens. No single pedal driving (idk perhaps they haven't enabled it), no phone as key, no profiles, engine start/stop button. Overall I'd say people are sold on features without looking in depth what you get with Tesla. And Tesla still outselling any other brand here in NZ. Hope I can try out Zeekr 7x performance in couple of weeks. I heard a lot of good things about it.