6 ms·

Maybe bring a (printed) book, brochure, flyer, or treatise on the nocturnal behaviours of silkworms?

by troymc 6mo ago

bawolff 6mo ago
Do you commonly carry those around with you? I'm not mistaking a resturant for a library, i just want to kill time until my food comes out. Is there a reason why someone sitting by themselves reading a book on the e-reader app on their phone is more offensive than someone sitting by themselves reading a dead tree book?
- Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
  It's not hard to bring a book with you. People did it before phones. And I don't know what you're doing when you're transfixed by your phone and I'm not going to peer over your screen to find out.
  - fc417fc802 6mo ago
    You dodged the question. You don't know what he's using his phone for. Fair enough. Is there a reason that privately looking at the screen is offensive while privately looking at a book is not?
    - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
      It's a more social activity in a world that is increasingly isolated. A book is a nice conversation starter. I'm not going to come up to you and ask about what's on your little screen. Even if you're just reading an e-book the phone contributes to the perceived loneliness of those around you. If you really want to read a book in peace, try a library.
      - tenacious_tuna 6mo ago
        > Even if you're just reading an e-book the phone contributes to the perceived loneliness of those around you. This is a wild projection of your own experience onto someone else's actions. > If you really want to read a book in peace, try a library. I've quite enjoyed the times I've taken a book to a restaurant and read over a meal. I do not appreciate you, or people like you, dictating how I ought to act in public in a way that doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest. I don't want to start conversations when I'm alone at a table with my book. The fact that you find it somehow less social for me to be on my phone instead of reading a book when I am minding my own business at my own table seems like a tremendous failure in your own boundaries and expectations of other people.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        >This is a wild projection of your own experience onto someone else's actions. I asked a friend who doesn't use a smartphone about how it feels walking into a room full of people with phones and he told me the same thing. I have a smartphone but I don't take it out reflexively. I don't even consider myself a very social person or an extrovert, yet it always has to be ME to start a conversation in a room full of people because they would rather stare at a screen that say a hello. I'm going to talk to you whether you like it not. If you don't want to talk to people, then maybe don't put yourself in a social setting? Imagine entering a coffee shop and finding it dead silent. I would just go home and make some food. If you have a problem with me talking to you, go ahead tell me how much you don't appreciate it or whatever, I don't care.
        bawolff 6mo ago
        Maybe this is a cultural difference, but i would generally consider it incredibly rude for a random person to interupt someone trying to enjoy their meal. A resturant isn't a singles mixer.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        Depends on the layout. If its a large, sit-down restaurant with wide gaps between the tables, then yes it would be weird for me to go up to you and say "Hi, Stranger!". But at a coffee shop you might be sitting right next to me. We might even be sitting at the same table waiting for our food. Am I not allowed to talk to the person sitting right next to me? I ordered some food the other day and realized there were no free tables, so I asked a stranger if I could sit at his table and had a conversation with him and his buddy.
      - vile_wretch 6mo ago
        I don't think you're going to have many good conversations if you go around interrupting people trying to read in peace, regardless of where you do it. What a bizarre sentiment.
      - fc417fc802 6mo ago
        > A book is a nice conversation starter. Do you make a habit of interrupting people who are reading? If so I can just about guarantee that you're "that guy" to the people you're doing that to.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        Depends. In a library? No. In a social setting? That's fair game.
        fc417fc802 6mo ago
        I don't think most people view a table for one at a cafe as a social setting with regard to total strangers. It will depend of course and there will be associated social cues; reading anything be it a screen, a book, or something else is a strong cue against unsolicited social interaction in almost any context.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        It depends, it depends. You need to look at other signals. Are they extremely absorbed? Is it somewhere extremely quiet (like a library), or somewhere louder (like a coffee shop)?
  - bawolff 6mo ago
    > And I don't know what you're doing when you're transfixed by your phone and I'm not going to peer over your screen to find out. Nor should you, talk about injecting yourself into something that is none of your business.
    - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
      Oh, it's everyone's business. Phones are eroding the social fabric.
- bluebarbet 6mo ago
  >someone sitting by themselves reading a book on the e-reader app I was this person. Eventually I gave it up because I didn't want to be mistaken for just another screen-addled zombie with no impulse control miserably scrolling Whatsapp and Instagram. Perhaps I have too much self-awareness but I'd argue most people have too little.
  - fc417fc802 6mo ago
    > ... I didn't want to be mistaken for ... Who cares? They're strangers. If they want to make faulty assumptions and feel an unjustified smug sense of self superiority that's none of my business. At this point I read ~all books on my phone as a simple matter of practicality. I'd prefer my phone had an epaper screen and grayscale page centric apps (instead of scrolling) but that's just not how things are.
    - bluebarbet 6mo ago
      >on my phone as a simple matter of practicality Yes, I came to the same conclusion. IIRC I read Great Expectations on the thing! In my case scrollability was a bonus. Horses for courses.
  - bawolff 6mo ago
    > Eventually I gave it up because I didn't want to be mistaken for just another screen-addled zombie with no impulse control miserably scrolling Whatsapp and Instagram. So you gave it up not because you are worried about being a "phone addicted zombie" but because you are worried about being precieved and judged as such? Some would say changing your behaviour due to social insecurity is just another form of being a zombie.
    - bluebarbet 6mo ago
      Not sure it would make me a "zombie" exactly but I agree it's an oddly incoherent position to judge the behavior of others while also being concerned about their gaze. Much introspection has not yet pierced this mystery.
- jmye 6mo ago
  > Do you commonly carry those around with you? I do when I’m going somewhere that doesn’t allow phones. How is this complicated or hard to understand?
Mistletoe 6mo ago
Or just do what we did before, sit and think. What they call "mindfulness" now and even meditation is what we used to call just being alive.
hoherd 6mo ago
My company recently gave us a day off for wellbeing. My initial plan was to spend the day in the forest, but it was cold and rainy. So instead, I did as you described. I took an old warn paperback that I had long ago picked up at a Little Free Library and have been struggling to finish, went to a family owned diner, got some comfort food, and sat for an hour and read my book (and did not use my phone). It was wonderful.

Maybe bring a (printed) book, brochure, flyer, or treatise on the nocturnal behaviours of silkworms?

by troymc 6mo ago

Maybe bring a (printed) book, brochure, flyer, or treatise on the nocturnal behaviours of silkworms?

Do you commonly carry those around with you? I'm not mistaking a resturant for a library, i just want to kill time until my food comes out. Is there a reason why someone sitting by themselves reading a book on the e-reader app on their phone is more offensive than someone sitting by themselves reading a dead tree book?

Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
It's not hard to bring a book with you. People did it before phones. And I don't know what you're doing when you're transfixed by your phone and I'm not going to peer over your screen to find out.
- fc417fc802 6mo ago
  You dodged the question. You don't know what he's using his phone for. Fair enough. Is there a reason that privately looking at the screen is offensive while privately looking at a book is not?
  - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
    It's a more social activity in a world that is increasingly isolated. A book is a nice conversation starter. I'm not going to come up to you and ask about what's on your little screen. Even if you're just reading an e-book the phone contributes to the perceived loneliness of those around you. If you really want to read a book in peace, try a library.
    - tenacious_tuna 6mo ago
      > Even if you're just reading an e-book the phone contributes to the perceived loneliness of those around you. This is a wild projection of your own experience onto someone else's actions. > If you really want to read a book in peace, try a library. I've quite enjoyed the times I've taken a book to a restaurant and read over a meal. I do not appreciate you, or people like you, dictating how I ought to act in public in a way that doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest. I don't want to start conversations when I'm alone at a table with my book. The fact that you find it somehow less social for me to be on my phone instead of reading a book when I am minding my own business at my own table seems like a tremendous failure in your own boundaries and expectations of other people.
      - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        >This is a wild projection of your own experience onto someone else's actions. I asked a friend who doesn't use a smartphone about how it feels walking into a room full of people with phones and he told me the same thing. I have a smartphone but I don't take it out reflexively. I don't even consider myself a very social person or an extrovert, yet it always has to be ME to start a conversation in a room full of people because they would rather stare at a screen that say a hello. I'm going to talk to you whether you like it not. If you don't want to talk to people, then maybe don't put yourself in a social setting? Imagine entering a coffee shop and finding it dead silent. I would just go home and make some food. If you have a problem with me talking to you, go ahead tell me how much you don't appreciate it or whatever, I don't care.
        bawolff 6mo ago
        Maybe this is a cultural difference, but i would generally consider it incredibly rude for a random person to interupt someone trying to enjoy their meal. A resturant isn't a singles mixer.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        Depends on the layout. If its a large, sit-down restaurant with wide gaps between the tables, then yes it would be weird for me to go up to you and say "Hi, Stranger!". But at a coffee shop you might be sitting right next to me. We might even be sitting at the same table waiting for our food. Am I not allowed to talk to the person sitting right next to me? I ordered some food the other day and realized there were no free tables, so I asked a stranger if I could sit at his table and had a conversation with him and his buddy.
    - vile_wretch 6mo ago
      I don't think you're going to have many good conversations if you go around interrupting people trying to read in peace, regardless of where you do it. What a bizarre sentiment.
    - fc417fc802 6mo ago
      > A book is a nice conversation starter. Do you make a habit of interrupting people who are reading? If so I can just about guarantee that you're "that guy" to the people you're doing that to.
      - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        Depends. In a library? No. In a social setting? That's fair game.
        fc417fc802 6mo ago
        I don't think most people view a table for one at a cafe as a social setting with regard to total strangers. It will depend of course and there will be associated social cues; reading anything be it a screen, a book, or something else is a strong cue against unsolicited social interaction in almost any context.
        Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
        It depends, it depends. You need to look at other signals. Are they extremely absorbed? Is it somewhere extremely quiet (like a library), or somewhere louder (like a coffee shop)?
- bawolff 6mo ago
  > And I don't know what you're doing when you're transfixed by your phone and I'm not going to peer over your screen to find out. Nor should you, talk about injecting yourself into something that is none of your business.
  - Acrobatic_Road 6mo ago
    Oh, it's everyone's business. Phones are eroding the social fabric.
bluebarbet 6mo ago
>someone sitting by themselves reading a book on the e-reader app I was this person. Eventually I gave it up because I didn't want to be mistaken for just another screen-addled zombie with no impulse control miserably scrolling Whatsapp and Instagram. Perhaps I have too much self-awareness but I'd argue most people have too little.
- fc417fc802 6mo ago
  > ... I didn't want to be mistaken for ... Who cares? They're strangers. If they want to make faulty assumptions and feel an unjustified smug sense of self superiority that's none of my business. At this point I read ~all books on my phone as a simple matter of practicality. I'd prefer my phone had an epaper screen and grayscale page centric apps (instead of scrolling) but that's just not how things are.
  - bluebarbet 6mo ago
    >on my phone as a simple matter of practicality Yes, I came to the same conclusion. IIRC I read Great Expectations on the thing! In my case scrollability was a bonus. Horses for courses.
- bawolff 6mo ago
  > Eventually I gave it up because I didn't want to be mistaken for just another screen-addled zombie with no impulse control miserably scrolling Whatsapp and Instagram. So you gave it up not because you are worried about being a "phone addicted zombie" but because you are worried about being precieved and judged as such? Some would say changing your behaviour due to social insecurity is just another form of being a zombie.
  - bluebarbet 6mo ago
    Not sure it would make me a "zombie" exactly but I agree it's an oddly incoherent position to judge the behavior of others while also being concerned about their gaze. Much introspection has not yet pierced this mystery.
jmye 6mo ago
> Do you commonly carry those around with you? I do when I’m going somewhere that doesn’t allow phones. How is this complicated or hard to understand?

Mistletoe 6mo ago

Or just do what we did before, sit and think. What they call "mindfulness" now and even meditation is what we used to call just being alive.

hoherd 6mo ago

My company recently gave us a day off for wellbeing. My initial plan was to spend the day in the forest, but it was cold and rainy. So instead, I did as you described. I took an old warn paperback that I had long ago picked up at a Little Free Library and have been struggling to finish, went to a family owned diner, got some comfort food, and sat for an hour and read my book (and did not use my phone). It was wonderful.