4 ms·

> real wage growth. Something that's not existed since the 1970s Real wages are 15% higher than they were in 1979 [1]. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/

> real wage growth. Something that's not existed since the 1970s Real wages are 15% higher than they were in 1979 [1]. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LES1252881600Q https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LES1252881600Q

noosphr 8mo ago
That is not hourly earnings. Americans are working longer than they did in 1970. On top of that even if we take your link at face value that's a 0.35% growth per year. The medieval warm period had faster wage growth.
- JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
  > That is not hourly earnings Hourly earnings (nominal) have grown at 3.2% per year between 2006 and 2025 [1]. Inflation in that interval was 2.7% [2]. > Americans are working longer than they did in 1970 Source? These data show hours worked are down [3]. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES0500000003 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES0500000003 [2] https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=1&year1=200601&year2=202602 https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=1&year1=200601... [3] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=18H2H https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=18H2H
  - noosphr 8mo ago
    If you look very carefully you can notice that 2006 is not 1970. >Source? These data show hours worked are down [3]. https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2018/october/how-hours-americans-work-compare-rest-world https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2018/october/how-h...
    - JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
      Do you have the underlying data? I’m curious if per capita is being averaged across whole population or workers. If the former, that seems to penalize younger-aged countries.
      - deleted 8mo ago
        [deleted]
- dangus 8mo ago
  And let’s not forget that single income households converted to dual income households, from 47% to 66% of married couples. https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/america-has-become-nation-dual-income-working-couples/ https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/america-has-becom... (Not my favorite think tank but they have a nice chart.)
  - JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
    The real-wage data above aren’t household statistics.
    - deleted 8mo ago
      [deleted]
Avicebron 8mo ago
CPI-U is deceptive and misses the point entirely, cheap t-shirt and televisions don't matter when people can't afford healthcare or housing.
nicoburns 8mo ago
Only because the inflation metrics don't include housing.
- JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
  > Only because the inflation metrics don't include housing Which price index are you looking at that doesn’t include housing?
  - dangus 8mo ago
    Consumer price index is probably the most common one and it doesn’t include housing.
    - JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
      > Consumer price index is probably the most common one and it doesn’t include housing Almost all BLS price indices, including CPI, include housing. (CPI measures the “rent of primary residence, owners' equivalent rent, utilities, bedroom furniture” [1].) [1] https://www.bls.gov/opub/hom/cpi/concepts.htm#the-cpi-as-a-cost-of-living-framework https://www.bls.gov/opub/hom/cpi/concepts.htm#the-cpi-as-a-c...
      - dangus 8mo ago
        Serves me right for asking AI. Of course, CPI doesn’t capture whether people have roommates or have made other adjustments to keep their housing costs within income limits.
mahogany 8mo ago
Honestly, even if that takes into account housing and everything, doesn't that seem... pathetic? All of the automation and technological advancement and productivity gains over the past 45 years, and average workers in the US see a measly 15% higher real wage over that timespan. Compared to the obscene (real) wealth increase by those at the top during the same span, this seems pathetic to me.

noosphr 8mo ago

That is not hourly earnings. Americans are working longer than they did in 1970. On top of that even if we take your link at face value that's a 0.35% growth per year. The medieval warm period had faster wage growth.

JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
> That is not hourly earnings Hourly earnings (nominal) have grown at 3.2% per year between 2006 and 2025 [1]. Inflation in that interval was 2.7% [2]. > Americans are working longer than they did in 1970 Source? These data show hours worked are down [3]. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES0500000003 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CES0500000003 [2] https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=1&year1=200601&year2=202602 https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=1&year1=200601... [3] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=18H2H https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=18H2H
- noosphr 8mo ago
  If you look very carefully you can notice that 2006 is not 1970. >Source? These data show hours worked are down [3]. https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2018/october/how-hours-americans-work-compare-rest-world https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2018/october/how-h...
  - JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
    Do you have the underlying data? I’m curious if per capita is being averaged across whole population or workers. If the former, that seems to penalize younger-aged countries.
    - deleted 8mo ago
      [deleted]
dangus 8mo ago
And let’s not forget that single income households converted to dual income households, from 47% to 66% of married couples. https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/america-has-become-nation-dual-income-working-couples/ https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/america-has-becom... (Not my favorite think tank but they have a nice chart.)
- JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
  The real-wage data above aren’t household statistics.
  - deleted 8mo ago
    [deleted]

Avicebron 8mo ago

CPI-U is deceptive and misses the point entirely, cheap t-shirt and televisions don't matter when people can't afford healthcare or housing.

nicoburns 8mo ago

Only because the inflation metrics don't include housing.

JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
> Only because the inflation metrics don't include housing Which price index are you looking at that doesn’t include housing?
- dangus 8mo ago
  Consumer price index is probably the most common one and it doesn’t include housing.
  - JumpCrisscross 8mo ago
    > Consumer price index is probably the most common one and it doesn’t include housing Almost all BLS price indices, including CPI, include housing. (CPI measures the “rent of primary residence, owners' equivalent rent, utilities, bedroom furniture” [1].) [1] https://www.bls.gov/opub/hom/cpi/concepts.htm#the-cpi-as-a-cost-of-living-framework https://www.bls.gov/opub/hom/cpi/concepts.htm#the-cpi-as-a-c...
    - dangus 8mo ago
      Serves me right for asking AI. Of course, CPI doesn’t capture whether people have roommates or have made other adjustments to keep their housing costs within income limits.

mahogany 8mo ago

Honestly, even if that takes into account housing and everything, doesn't that seem... pathetic? All of the automation and technological advancement and productivity gains over the past 45 years, and average workers in the US see a measly 15% higher real wage over that timespan. Compared to the obscene (real) wealth increase by those at the top during the same span, this seems pathetic to me.